New System with bad sound

[cgiles]

Hello all,

I've read some threads but want to make sure I fully understand what needs to be done before taking my car back to the installers. My new system in my '16 401a 12 speaker is 3 way front stage and a sub; all other speakers have been disconnected. There is a Helix DSP connected with high-level inputs and then a five channel amp. My problem is I cannot turn the knob past 15 without the 6.5s cutting out. Not bass rolloff, but speakers not working unless volume is turned down. The sound is blah at best. Highs seem ok and there is a terrible alt whine.

I believe the cutting out can be fixed with the elimination of the factory eq with Forscan. I read somewhere that pre 18, before Sony, cars need a Rockford DSR1 installed pre-DSP to convert to low-level. This will clean up the sound but will it eliminate the whine or is that being picked up elsewhere? Bad ground somewhere?

Is this the right path to fixing my problem? Thanks

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[Cathul]

Hello all,

I've read some threads but want to make sure I fully understand what needs to be done before taking my car back to the installers. My new system in my '16 401a 12 speaker is 3 way front stage and a sub; all other speakers have been disconnected. There is a Helix DSP connected with high-level inputs and then a five channel amp. My problem is I cannot turn the knob past 15 without the 6.5s cutting out. Not bass rolloff, but speakers not working unless volume is turned down. The sound is blah at best. Highs seem ok and there is a terrible alt whine.

You are already describing your problem in the bold statement.

Dude... it's the year 2022. Why the f*ck are you using high level input when it's known for years that the signal between the ACM and the stock amplifier is a full range non clipping variable line level signal?
There are T-harnesses for integration available for years.
Did you even read the sticky threads?

Really... people should start reading the stickies first or bring their cars to a shop that is not doing high-level inputs for cars where proper integration is easy as nothing else these days.

If a shop installed your system... bring it back and tell them to do a proper job.
If you did it yourself, read up on integration and do it the right way.

High-Level input when a variable low level signal is available is not the right way!

Really... reading such threads in the year 2022 makes me want to stop helping people.

 

[Evolvd]

You are already describing your problem in the bold statement.

Dude... it's the year 2022. Why the f*ck are you using high level input when it's known for years that the signal between the ACM and the stock amplifier is a full range non clipping variable line level signal?
There are T-harnesses for integration available for years.
Did you even read the sticky threads?

Really... people should start reading the stickies first or bring their cars to a shop that is not doing high-level inputs for cars where proper integration is easy as nothing else these days.

If a shop installed your system... bring it back and tell them to do a proper job.
If you did it yourself, read up on integration and do it the right way.

High-Level input when a variable low level signal is available is not the right way!

Really... reading such threads in the year 2022 makes me want to stop helping people.

Dang man, top rope! He’s been a member for 6 years and has 3 posts. I bet he doesn’t spend a ton of time reading the threads and we all started with zero knowledge at some point.

OP. Look at the sticky threads in this forum, they are at the top. Lots of information on wiring, integration, etc. If it’s above your head let us know and we’ll guide you.

 

[Cathul]

Well, nat having posted anything doesn’t mean he can’t read.
Sorry, but sometimes I feel like fighting windmills.

To OP: please excuse my rude behavior.
First and foremost you should get rid of the high level in into the Helix DSP. The Helix is such a capable unit that you really should give him the best signal possible, which is available between the ACM and the stock amplifier.
You need a T-harness and a relay to integrate into the signal lines.
The harness you want is the idatalink HRN-AR-FO3 and for relay you want a PAC-Audio TR4.
If you need instructions on how to prepare you can come back to us. We try our best to help you.

 

[cgiles]

I apologize, I haven't installed a system myself in about 15 years and never dealt with any integration so this is all new ground. I tried to make it through the 800 pages of stickies but in the end said "screw it, the shop will know what to do". My mistake.

The HRN-AR-FO into a DSR1. From there it'll go to the Helix. The amp is turning on, don't know if they used the TR4 or what, so that most likely isn't an issue. This used to be real simple. Buy a deck, amp, and speakers and the installs were straight forward. It has gotten above my head so I out-sourced it.

 

[Cathul]

So if they use a DSR1 to do the integration into a Helix processor and it sounds like garbage, then it really is a tuning issue with the Helix processor.
DSR1 is not giving high level to the Helix, but the variable line level signal. Clipping should be a non issue if it is set up correctly.
If the midbass shut off my guess is that the Helix is shutting them off due to the internal gain structure.
And 3-way up front, but only a 5-channel amp? Are the tweeters and mids crossed with a passive crossover?
Somethings fishy going on with the setup of the Helix processor for sure.

 

[cgiles]

There isn't a DSR1, yet. After doing some reading, that's what I figured I needed to fix the problem. That and forscan to disable the factory eq'ing. Yes, currently it's just the Helix going to a five channel amp. I do know that the tweets and 6.5s were a component set with the 3s being separate. I don't know how they wired the speakers to the 4 channels but it sounds good. Get's plenty loud using the Helix remote knob. I just can't stand the whine and limited on the radio volume and forced to use the remote knob, also know that the speakers should sound better. It's much better sounding than factory and to the normal person it probably sounds great. Weather is nice today; I may go dick around with it and see what's what.

 

[Cathul]

Well… if you going high level to the Helix the stock amp starts to clip at around 15 on the volume knob, so there you go. With the DSR1 no EQ change is necessary as you‘re getting the best possible signal from the DSR1.
But be aware that when tuning the Helix you should connect the laptop directly to the Helix as the ACM in the Mustang has a non defeatable bass boost up to around 20 on the volume knob. Learned this the hard way.
But…. You don’t really need the DSR1. You just need the harness and the PAC-Audio relay that I mentioned. You have to do some soldering, yes, but this way you haven’t spend the money on the DSR1.
General approach is outlined in the sticky threads.

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