Hello Canucks!

[whoishomer]

Some dealers will take less to get an older car off the lot. I'm pretty sure the red GT at Koch Ford is the first one they got back in October...getting pretty old. I've been told dealers pay interest on cars sitting on their lot, so it is costing them for it to sit they. They'd be willing to make less money to stop paying money to hold it there.

Factory customer orders are sometimes a bit harder to get a smoking deal. I can vouch that Freedom Ford will give you a pretty good deal, they offered me 500 over invoice without even haggling, but they screwed me on my trade in as well, so I bought elsewhere.

Yes I can see them wanting to move older inventory. I've been getting my pricing based on factory ordering as well. How's your order coming along? Has the car been built yet?

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[RevvdMedia]

Yes I can see them wanting to move older inventory. I've been getting my pricing based on factory ordering as well. How's your order coming along? Has the car been built yet?

I orderd Dec 23rd, didn't have a VIN as of Tuesday this week. I don't want to be too annoying with my dealer, so I haven't called much. I've been going through the sales manager as my sales rep is out of the country for another week or two. I'll bug him more via email when he returns.

I really want it to arrive before the end of March so I can take advantage of the 0% financing. At this rate though...I'm not sure. No processing + no VIN = no car. They really need to get on this.

 

[dkf]

I have been given 3 very different prices from 3 different dealers
1. There are no incentives right now MSRP is what you will have to pay. Unless of course a different dealer gives you a better price...then they could match that price.
2. Told they could sell it at invoice + a small admin fee, which is apparently better then x-plan pricing, but not as good as a-plan pricing
3. Emailed back and forth with another dealer, never even called or went in, and was given a price below invoice (according to unhaggle.com)

I know dealers receive a hold back from ford when they sell a vehicle, and can also get rebates based on the volume their dealership sells, so realistically they can sell below invoice and still make a profit.

I'm curious about this. I don't have much experience with haggling. How do you get a dealership to move off the sticker price? I assume it would be possible if a dealer had a lot of inventory they were eager to move but for something with more limited supply, what incentive do they have to negotiate?

Based on what I've read on these forums I know X-plan isn't the best deal you can get from a dealership but I'm not sure how to get a dealership to admit that!

When you call/email dealers, do you tell them upfront that you're shopping around with their competitors as well?

 

[opensesame]

Unhaggle.com is your friend. Use this to get the best price. Don't pay the $100 fee but rather contact at least 10 dealers in your area with the options you want then go to the cheapest one. I saved at least $10,000 doing this. Also apply for a Costco membership to get $1000 off


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[whoishomer]

Yes the pricing unhaggle.com listed as the dealer invoice matched to the penny the dealer invoice pricing I was able to obtain from a dealer.

A few general tips from my experience.

1. Expect the sales guy to try to pressure you into buying a car the first time you come by. The chances of you buying a car dramatically drop the minute you walk out the door for the first time.
2. It seems like they always ask me how much I want to pay. No matter what dollar amount I give them, they say that's a really aggressive price and they aren't sure they can do it. They'll have to run it by their manager.
3. The manager will decline to meet the price you asked for...it was just too aggressive. But if you are willing to sign right now, they will meet you in the middle.

The funny thing is, it doesn't really matter if the price you asked for was aggressive or not. If they think you only expect to get $500 off MSRP, they will make it out like that is an amazing deal and you aren't going to get that sort of pricing anywhere...you need to sign right now for them to even off you that sort of crazy discount. It’s all BS. The sales guy sells cars for a living. He has a pretty darn good idea about how low they can go on the price. He doesn't need to check with the manager. They are just playing mind games with you so you think you are getting a good deal.


As others stated go to unhaggle.com and get the invoice price. Dealers can make a very nice profit selling at invoice price. They get a 'holdback' of between $500-1000 from ford when they sell a car. Additionally they will get a volume rebate on pricing if they sell enough cars. So realistically they can sell you a new car below invoice and still make money.

A nice thing about factory ordering a car. You get whatever factory incentive is better between the time you order the car and the time it comes in. Right now they have a $500 winter warmup promo going on, so expect to get $500 off invoice price at a minimum. Next month they might have Costco's $1000 off. So then you could expect to get $1000 off invoice (no you can't combine them)

You can however combine certain offers that you get direct from ford. Does your city have a car show coming up? If you go to the car show and go to the ford section, they probably will have a computer setup and you can fill out your info if you are interested in buying a new ford. Expect to get a $500 off coupon in the mail.

So, at that point, if Costco pricing was on, and you had the $500 coupon from the auto show, you should have no issue finding a dealer who will sell you the car for $1500 below dealer invoice (not MSRP, but dealer invoice)

Again because of the volume rebates and dealer holdbacks, you could pay even less than that.

Also keep in mind that the more options you add to your car, the more markup there is.

My particular car came in with an MSRP about $4500 over invoice. So add in the $500 winter warm up, and $500 auto show discount, I will be paying about $5500 below MSRP for my car. Is this the best price I could have gotten? No, I highly doubt it, but I like my dealer and the way they have always treated me...that is worth something to me as well.

Good luck!

 

[opensesame]

Ask them to throw in free stuff. I got free lifetime oil changes and all season mats. If they don't tell them you are prepared to walk out if not and watch them crumble.


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[Papaya]

X-Plan at Kentwood Ford accepted

Only ask if they accept X-Plan. If they don't, walk away. You can order retail with any dealer in Canada and it will be delivered to your dealership. $500 off MSRP? That's a joke. IMO a Mustang isn't something rare. I will ask Zender Ford if they accept x-plan and post the answer here. I know Kentwood Ford is accepting it (that's why I did buy my car there). Denny Andrews would do it I am thinking.

Update:
Kentwood Ford will do x-plan for sure. :gossip:

 

[Mirko03]

Wow I just love all the hate that goes towards sales people at dealerships.

I have been in sales for 4 years now 2 at Ford and 2 at Chrysler (currently), let me tell you guys a few things from the other side of the fence.

1. There are 2 different kind of dealerships, the first is commission based these guys get paid on how much they can sell the car for and negotiate very little due to discounts affecting their pay checks. The second are volume dealers, these guy's get paid flat rates and the salesperson can care less what they sell the car for as he will get paid the same amount regardless the price of the car, these dealerships are usually easier to deal with and won't put as much pressure on you.

2. Dealers make money 3 different ways, the first is front end profit (amount the car is sold for) this does not include rebates from the manufacture but the amount you get after the rebates have been applied. The second is back end this is basically any products you buy in the business office, extended warranty, rust proof, accessories and if you finance the banks tend to give some money to the dealer. The third is the kickbacks from the manufacture for selling x amount of cars monthly it's not much but it does add up over x amount of cars sold, so when the poor salesperson says "I have to check with my manager" he/she is not necessarily lying to you because some dealers will take a bigger "lose" in order to move another unit and get to their target.

3. Don't blame the salesperson, these guys are only the messengers, yes they usually know what the range for the car your looking at is being sold for but it dosent mean it will always be that, the managers are the ones you should yell and scream at they are the decision makers.

Hope this helps your guys' outlook on dealerships (they are not all out to get you) I would be more than happy to answer any questions you guys might have about deals or whatever.




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[Papaya]

I don't hate sales persons. They have to make their living too. And yes. I did buy per-paid services because I know the dealership made me a really good deal on all of them - including my car. The only thing I am still like to get some answers is why I didn't get a Ford Credit loan. Dealer still says because I ordered in August not December - what sounds weird to me. :shrug:

 

[whoishomer]

Wow I just love all the hate that goes towards sales people at dealerships.

I have been on sales for 4 years now 2 at Ford and 2 at Chrysler (currently), let me tell you guys a few things from the other side of the fence.

1. There are 2 different kind of dealerships, the first is commission based these guys get paid on how much they can sell the car for and negotiate very little due to discounts affecting their pay checks. The second are volume dealers, these guy's get paid flat rates and the salesperson can care less what they sell the car for as he will get paid the same amount regardless the price of the car, these dealerships are usually easier to deal with and won't put as much pressure on you.

2. Dealers make money 3 different ways, the first is front end profit (amount the car is sold for) this does not include rebates from the manufacture but the amount you get after the rebates have been applied. The second is back end this is basically any products you buy in the business office, extended warranty, rust proof, accessories and if you finance the banks tend to give some money to the dealer. The third is the kickbacks from the manufacture for selling x amount of cars monthly it's not much but it does add up over x amount of cars sold, so when the poor salesperson says "I have to check with my manager" he/she is not necessarily lying to you because some dealers will take a bigger "lose" in order to move another unit and get to their target.

3. Don't blame the salesperson, these guys are only the messengers, yes they usually know what the range for the car your looking at is being sold for but it dosent mean it will always be that, the managers are the ones you should yell and scream at they are the decision makers.

Hope this helps your guys' outlook on dealerships (they are not all out to get you) I would be more than happy to answer any questions you guys might have about deals or whatever.




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Interesting perspective.

I think the moral of the story is to just do your research before you go in.
The dealership that offered me $500 off and said there really wasn't any more room then that was Kentwood ford. They claim to have fixed commission rates. The dealer that had no issues going right down to invoice pricing was a smaller commission based dealer. So really your mileage may vary!

There are definitely some really bad sales guys who will do their best to make you feel good about being ripped off. There are others won't skip the BS and give you a good price..

 

[Papaya]

Interesting perspective.

I think the moral of the story is to just do your research before you go in.
The dealership that offered me $500 off and said there really wasn't any more room then that was Kentwood ford. They claim to have fixed commission rates. The dealer that had no issues going right down to invoice pricing was a smaller commission based dealer. So really your mileage may vary!

There are definitely some really bad sales guys who will do their best to make you feel good about being ripped off. There are others won't skip the BS and give you a good price..

That's really funny. 1st you said to me Gavin ask you to sign an order BEFORE you get any pricing. I personally know that this isn't the true story. I am also aware you never asked for x-plan pricing too. X-plan is the best you could ask for a retail order. They do that to everyone who is asking. I'm not special. And they don't only claim to have fixed commissions. All 35 dealer at the GoAuto Group have this. Anyway. If you running around and throw "numbers " at sales guys they're not realistic - you never get your car. Ask only like most of us for x-plan. That's all. And don't expect US pricing. That would be so wrong.

 

[whoishomer]

That's really funny. 1st you said to me Gavin ask you to sign an order BEFORE you get any pricing. I personally know that this isn't the true story. I am also aware you never asked for x-plan pricing too. X-plan is the best you could ask for a retail order. They do that to everyone who is asking. I'm not special. And they don't only claim to have fixed commissions. All 35 dealer at the GoAuto Group have this. Anyway. If you running around and throw "numbers " at sales guys they're not realistic - you never get your car. Ask only like most of us for x-plan. That's all. And don't expect US pricing. That would be so wrong.

Yes Papaya the first time I spoke to Gavin he wanted me to sign before he'd give me any pricing.
Yesterday on the phone he wanted me to put a deposit down before he'd give me any firm pricing. Seriously??? Put down a deposit before you even tell me how much you are going to sell me the car for? How stupid does he think I am?!?!?

The day earlier in email he told me he could beat the other dealers pricing (which I know for a fact is better then xplan pricing) but he wouldn't tell me if he could beat their deal by 1 dollar or 50000 dollars, just that he could beat it. If I put down a deposit, or came in he would then magically know how much he could beat it by.

So I hate to break it to you, but what you personally know is wrong. I have about 20 emails between myself and Gavin and I personally know that I am right.
I would suggest anyone looking to buy a Mustang stay away from Go Auto, from what I have personally experience. Again your mileage may vary.

 

[Papaya]

Wow! Members always look for a good deal. Why are you not posting your DORA like we all did? If you don't like Go Auto that is fine with me. X-plan pricing is $500 over invoice. Again and the last time, you never asked I assume. But anyway. Members who are still in progress to find the best deal would like to hear from you how to get a better deal than x-plan pricing. No DORA not happened was the saying here a couple month ago.

 

[Mirko03]

I don't hate sales persons. They have to make their living too. And yes. I did buy per-paid services because I know the dealership made me a really good deal on all of them - including my car. The only thing I am still like to get some answers is why I didn't get a Ford Credit loan. Dealer still says because I ordered in August not December - what sounds weird to me. :shrug:

That's odd, im presumming you financed your vehicle? Over how long did you finance?

I know Ford Credit Canada only offers Financing up to 72 months, there would be no other reason why they wouldn't finance you unless they declined your application due to credit.:shrug:

I ordered in August as well and I got Fiancned by Ford Credit.

 

[Papaya]

That's odd, im presumming you financed your vehicle? Over how long did you finance?

I know Ford Credit Canada only offers Financing up to 72 months, there would be no other reason why they wouldn't finance you unless they declined your application due to credit.:shrug:

I ordered in August as well and I got Fiancned by Ford Credit.

I did like to go for 48 month. Than we ended up with TD Auto finance 60 month. They actually got me on the wrong food because they told me the whole December that Ford would give me 1.99% when my car arrives. That's why I didn't apply online. But I am still on it and my credit is open so I can pay off any time.

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