GT350 vs. Z/28

[traxiii]

Not sure if this belongs here but, here goes. Talked to a couple of guys at Multimatic this weekend at Laguna Seca, and the debut of the GT350 in racing seems to be the biggest secret in motor racing right now.

Also talked to Michael Shank, and he wanted to put the Ford EcoBoost in his P2 derived Prototype this year, but they (Ford) were not interested, as they will not be racing in the Prototype category next year Instead they will be racing the Ford GT in GTLM and other places, against the Corvettes and such. He seemed kind of ticked at the loss of Ford power after 8 years of running Blue Oval power. He said the 3.5EB would fit just fine, it just isn't where Ford is going right now.

Not a great weekend for Ford MRLS, though Billy Johnson's charge to second from 6th, was pretty amazing. If Maxwell could keep out of trouble in his stints and near the top 4 Billy could win them all, he seems to be that much faster than everyone else.

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[thePill]

Billy got caught in a bad pit (both cars). They came out in like 9th and 10th. He charged to 2nd with less than 30 minutes left.

He was on that z28's ass bad, another 5 minutes and things would have been different. Still a slight advantage and that car has trouble with a Boss.

Stevenson is suppose to win this year. Already have multiple poles and a 2nd, 1st, 1st finish in only 3 races. The last time someone won two in a row was in 2011 when the Camaro's restrictions were completely removed while everyone else's suffered. They couldn't win it then and they will probably eat it again this year. They even claimed Roush was cheating after they finished 2nd in the 3rd race.

How awful...

 

[Stuntman]

^I thought you dont follow CTSCC races?

Their last stop wasn't a "bad pit" but rather was THE CALL to put the Mustang in to contention. The Z28 still is faster in a straight line and didn't wear their tires out as fast as the Boss (despite a smaller restrictor and 75lbs more weight), which was a 5-7th place car but the tire call put them in contention for the win.

Its insane how fast the Camaros are with all of the restrictions, yet they still need to be slowed down even more.

 

[thePill]

The z28's still have a HP/TQ, Power curve and PtW Ratio advantage over everyone else in the class.

Yes, they need to be slowed down more. They may not be competitive after that. The Boss was hauling ass... It was pathetic the see one run down a 7 liter Camaro :lol:

What does it matter, this is the first race the Camaro has been this restricted. Pretty much gave them a 3 race head start. Pratt that is, not Chevy.

 

[traxiii]

The z28's still have a HP/TQ, Power curve and PtW Ratio advantage over everyone else in the class.

Yes, they need to be slowed down more. They may not be competitive after that. The Boss was hauling ass... It was pathetic the see one run down a 7 liter Camaro :lol:

What does it matter, this is the first race the Camaro has been this restricted. Pretty much gave them a 3 race head start. Pratt that is, not Chevy.

The guys on the PA were saying that the weight seemed to only hurt towards the end of stints and the new restrictor was no factor due to the short length of WOT at Laguna Seca. The call for tires was perfect, but they needed an extra lap or two. Kinda bummed, and then Pruitt/Hand's trans. loses 5th gear. :doh:

 

[thePill]

If Billy would have pitted and taken tires with everyone else, he wouldn't have needed to cook them off going from 9th to 2nd. He reeled in the entire pack.

The Boss is too fast for the class.

 

[Sabre]

If Billy would have pitted and taken tires with everyone else, he wouldn't have needed to cook them off going from 9th to 2nd. He reeled in the entire pack.

The Boss is too fast for the class.

Nope...not at all...your analysis once again....is way off.

By the time Billy pitted, all the competitors were on burned off tires...some more than others....but going with new tires was the only chance he had to advance in the remaining time in the race. It was their only chance...it turned out to be a great call...and it worked as well as it could have.

http://racing.ford.com/series/road-...mustang-boss-302r-to-second-in-ctsc-race.html

 

[Erik427]

^I thought you dont follow CTSCC races?

Their last stop wasn't a "bad pit" but rather was THE CALL to put the Mustang in to contention. The Z28 still is faster in a straight line and didn't wear their tires out as fast as the Boss (despite a smaller restrictor and 75lbs more weight), which was a 5-7th place car but the tire call put them in contention for the win.

Its insane how fast the Camaros are with all of the restrictions, yet they still need to be slowed down even more.

Stuntman, Here are my questions to you. What does the z28 weigh vs it's street version. Now we all know that the z28 comes stock with a 428 cid motor. The Stang with a 302 cid motor. On the street the Stang weighs far less than the z28. Don't you think this should be reflected on the track? If the z28 has been given a weight break over it's street going version? Shouldn't the Stang be allowed the same weight break?.......:shrug:

 

[Stuntman]

That's not how it works; it's professional racing with a Balance Of Performance "BOP" to equalize the cars for exciting racing. Better cars/drivers/teams tend to be penalized while worse cars/drivers/teams are advantaged. Then when good drivers/teams switch and race a car that's been advantaged by less talented drivers/teams and start dominating, the series then reacts to slow that car down (and the less talented drivers/teams become less competitive). That's racing. While CTSCC are showroom stock cars and typically each brand has a good team/drivers competing, it will never be perfectly 'fair'. It's a hard job for the series to even the playing field, especially when some teams sandbag their performance and turn it up later on, which seems to be the case with the Camaro.

So you can't just look at stock to race weight differences, because these constantly change, so does fuel tank sizes, restrictor sizes, wheel sizes, etc... in order to "Balance" the performance of each brand. Right now (without going into 'curb weight' differences):

Vantage: ~3,550 street 3,040 race = 510lbs
370Z: ~3,278 street 2,850 race = 428lbs
M3: ~3,704 street 3,350 race = 354lbs
Boss 302: ~3,666 street 3,360 race = 306lbs
Z28: ~3,820 street 3,575 race = 245lbs
911: ~3,131 street 3,025 race = 106lbs

 

[Erik427]

I say make all brands run their production weight......production (STOCK) engines......and such. That would win me back as a fan.

 

[thePill]

Nope...not at all...your analysis once again....is way off.

By the time Billy pitted, all the competitors were on burned off tires...some more than others....but going with new tires was the only chance he had to advance in the remaining time in the race. It was their only chance...it turned out to be a great call...and it worked as well as it could have.

http://racing.ford.com/series/road-...mustang-boss-302r-to-second-in-ctsc-race.html

Nope, call it how the announcers see it if you want. He had a stronger car. The caution came out as soon as the z28 passed him. He would have been faster taking tires being in the top 5. He had to turn consecutive 1.38's to catch up. That was far faster and more consistent than any other car out there. He fell behind, and even more so after pitting and used a lot of tire getting back up there.


I would have rather kept my spot and went head to head, not having to come from behind in the last 30 minutes. That's just me though... It rarely works out as good as it did.

 

[thePill]

I JUST watched a Boss 302 eat the entire field in Pro Racing... It is far from balanced.

 

[thePill]

The guys on the PA were saying that the weight seemed to only hurt towards the end of stints and the new restrictor was no factor due to the short length of WOT at Laguna Seca. The call for tires was perfect, but they needed an extra lap or two. Kinda bummed, and then Pruitt/Hand's trans. loses 5th gear. :doh:

That doesn't make sense. Did the weight get heavier towards the end? I would think air flow restriction had an effect throughout the entire power band.

I hear that the GT350 program is a highly guarded secret. The last time I seen a pic of one was Daytona I think. In the Multimatic garage. It looked complete... There were multiple Mustang Teams looking at it.


"A Championship from the Factory"

The FPC is picking up major time by eliminating shifts. Not only is the potential of the GT350 far superior to anything else in class, it's more efficient and eliminates human error.

 

[Sabre]

Nope, call it how the announcers see it if you want. He had a stronger car. The caution came out as soon as the z28 passed him. He would have been faster taking tires being in the top 5. He had to turn consecutive 1.38's to catch up. That was far faster and more consistent than any other car out there. He fell behind, and even more so after pitting and used a lot of tire getting back up there.


I would have rather kept my spot and went head to head, not having to come from behind in the last 30 minutes. That's just me though... It rarely works out as good as it did.

How the announcers see it? What are you talking about?

Did you even read the link I provided?

I'm going off of Billy Johnson's first person comments on the race.

I think I'll take Billy Johnson and Multimatic's opinion and actions on when he'll be faster, over your Monday morning, arm chair opinions any day.

Perhaps you'd like to go click on the link and actually read what the driver who was "in" the race has to say.

 

[thePill]

The Stevenson car consistently laid down a 1:38.1-1:38.6 in the last 30 minutes. That is about as fast as they get in traffic. In order for Billy to go from 9th to 2nd in that amount of time, he would have needed to run faster than the leading z28. And that is exactly what happened. Billy had more car than everyone else... It was obvious...

Now, if Billy would have grabbed tires like everyone else, chances are the z28 would have never passed him to begin with. He was lucky the caution came out. He could have been forced to pit later. AND, there was no way anyone would have said Billy and the Boss could pull consistent 1:38's, while being faster than the leader, for 30 minutes.

Instead, he got lucky, fell to 9th, and had to run consistent faster laps. He had the fastest car out there, he would have done better. If there wasn't a caution between the pit and end, he may have won.

I think it's pathetic to see a 7 liter car at the mercy of a Boss 302 and 370z.

I watched the race, I don't need someone else to tell me what I think.

If you consider the circumstances, yes, luck was on his side, caution came out and it was a lucky pit. That caution may have never happened and they could have went another 15 minutes with no caution at all. Maybe the whole race... But he got LUCKY and got one right after Liddel past him. If your running faster than the leader (which was one of the fastest), then you had the car to take tires like everyone else and pull away the rest of the race. He was still strong after 30, he could have been faster still at 44 with everyone else.

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