GT350 vs. Z/28

[ChefBorOzzy]

I agree with them not knowing the weight and they can't change anything now.

However, they DID/DO know that the Camaro is overweight. I just can't see them not correcting this. ATS is at a solid weight and so is the CTS.

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[Mikes5.0]

Im sure gm knows more than we do about the mustang just like ford knows more than we do about the camaro.

 

[w3rkn]

Im sure gm knows more than we do about the mustang just like ford knows more than we do about the camaro.

But that still doesn't change anything, or work miracles for GM. As they are NOT engineering a brand new chassis with a 4-year development plan... they are simply reworking an already existing sedan chassis.

The compromise was/has already been made at the top...

 

[Mikes5.0]

But that still doesn't change anything, or work miracles for GM. As they are NOT engineering a brand new chassis with a 4-year development plan... they are simply reworking an already existing sedan chassis.

The compromise was/has already been made at the top...

So GM has officially announced what chassis the camaro will be developed on or we just speculating again?

 

[w3rkn]

So GM has officially announced what chassis the camaro will be developed on or we just speculating again?

Not sure if you are joking, or innocently ignorant...

 

[thePill]

Sorry about long absences, some of my FB friends here have probably seen my next purchase. Its a rather large purchase and needs my full attention. I promise to get more in depth with the z28.R and IMSA for my Camaro5 fans.

I believe some fans are being pulled into the very trap I was as well as the Corvette faithful. Both Ford and Chevy knew very well a heavier Mustang and Corvette would not be popular... at all... Manufactures have their hands tied as far as new standard features and safety equipment. I've had my head in an SS, it sucked pretty bad. It is actually equally equipped as the S197 was, yet, the S550 took on weight. The 5th Gen has some pretty cheap interior, just material alone will see an increase. The Corvette was a shock to me, I figured with an all new, one piece aluminum chassis it would have lost weight. No... not happening in todays OEM. I understand everyone wants a lighter competitive Camaro, and, if you strip it down, it could be lighter. However, off the lot, its gonna be a porker for another generation. The Camaro could very well be pushing a $40,000 MSRP for the V8's, makes it real hard to implement some expensive weight saving materials and still remain cost competitive.

We have only heard that the Camaro will use the Alpha. Initially C5 thought it would be the Alpha Short. If we examine the ATS's are chassis, we can instantly see two things. First, the sled runner setup looks like it is limited to T4 and V6. There is just not enough bone to hold up the Camaro muscle. Another issue may be the clearance between firewall and tower. A traditional V8 looks like it may be a little too long. The ATS is a lighter chassis, about 200lbs lighter than the CTS. But, it accomplishes that be limiting the powertrain weight therefore, requiring less support overall.

I get it that many of you read Camaro5 often, and, it seems their speculation holds more water than mine. They assumed it would be the ATS... The ATS has NO V8 option so, scratch that off your list unless they develop an extended sport chassis. The best option here would be a CTS chopped down. However, I can't be sure that the base CTS has the CTS-V's reinforcement for a V8/SC V8. Leaving that extra weight out could be critical for the CTS's base curb weight of 36xx. I know for a fact it won't have the convertible built in.

So, what are we anticipating? Well, the entire.power train will be heavier than the 5th Gens. If we look at the Corvette gains, it pushed up to almost 200lbs. What some.here are trying to get over is, Chevy knows a 3900-4000lbs Camaro is a death sentence... They also knew a 3400lbs Corvette wouldn't fly either but, ta-da!!! They did it anyway...

Right off the bat, the electric heat/cooled seats, the new camera systems, the C7's Infotainment center, the LT1, new Tremec, new 5 link IRS, larger brakes, beefy suspension, increased airbags (knees), additional speakers and an amp in the "premium" version, new interior... The convertibles are now 20-25% stiffer, usually means more metal and, initially, Hi po models were not as hi po as they are now. All that gets built in.

The Mustang gained 87lbs and here's the real feat... They took on all the stuff I mentioned above. The Camaro's new 5 Link is heavy, about the same as the 5th Gens 4.5 link. Can you see the weight in any of those features? I see a quite a bit. In fact, both the S550 and C7 could have taken on very similar weigh. I still can't say for sure what else the Mustang has that I haven't figured yet.

Many of you on here swore the Mustang was gaining 200-300lbs overnight. I estimates that the structure itself.was lighter, far lighter judging from mass reduction alone. There was a lot of mass removed like it or not. Neither ATS nor CTS have any state of the art, new engineering methods applied to the Alpha. Its just another borrowed sedan chassis chopped and stretched to fit a Camaro, just as before. Why anyone is happy about this is beyond me.

I try to guess as accurately as I can, keep in mind also, I have an education in some of these areas as well as experience. I'd say my S550 structural losses were pretty close, especially since the S550 only gained 87lbs. I told your favorite insider Marshall there is no way a 200-300lbs increase was happening, not with a platform as small and compact as the S550. As I speculated before, if it will gain weight, it won't be from the dumb sh!t he claimed. Features are features, wanna race, remove them.

But my speculation is just that, speculation from a lot of educated guessing and assessing. Camaro5 told you the 6th Gen was ATS based, not me. I think they equally as guilty as I am for "not knowing what they are talking about". That was suppose to be fact... Their speculation is often viewed as fact. They are changing their tone now after seeing a full sized WB mule right? If you prefer their guess work compared to mine...

...heres the door...

www.camaro5.com

Enjoy your full size Camaro on a borrowed, 4 door sedan platform. Literally the same platform they just got rid of...

 

[ChefBorOzzy]

You're so silly.. I see you didn't go read the list of standard features on the 2SS and keep on bringing up new features, air bags, etc..

Also, a base Vette is below 3300 pounds. Ta da!

Now to unsubscribe from this thread and chime back in next year.

 

[Brent302]

You're so silly.. I see you didn't go read the list of standard features on the 2SS and keep on bringing up new features, air bags, etc..

Also, a base Vette is below 3300 pounds. Ta da!

Now to unsubscribe from this thread and chime back in next year.

Defending Chevy and Dodge on a Mustang forum??? Man you love fat cars...begone troll.

 

[DHG1078]

Defending Chevy and Dodge on a Mustang forum??? Man you love fat cars...begone troll.

If the 'vette is a fat car, what is the mustang?

 

[Brent302]

If the 'vette is a fat car, what is the mustang?

Talking about the Camaro... That's what him and ThePill are arguing about. Dont get your panties ruffled.

 

[DHG1078]

Talking about the Camaro... That's what him and ThePill are arguing about. Dont get your panties ruffled.

My panties aren't ruffled. They also used the 'vette.

 

[Brent302]

My panties aren't ruffled. They also used the 'vette.

At least you admit to be wearing panties [emoji106] lol

Come on you walked into that. [emoji129]

 

[DHG1078]

lol I did.

 

[thePill]

He fails to realize that the new heated/cooled seats could weigh nearly 90lbs compared to the 45lbs Recaros. That's just seats...

I'm not comparing base models, they are rare. I'm referring to the popular models tested, not the best weight case scenario. Why use the lowest advertised curb weight then selectively highlight the best performance results? What a tool box...

I'd rather use the performance models curb weights and not fluff the numbers in my favor using multiple sources or the manufacturers simulations. I think he's been unsubscribed for some time now.

It sucks, I know... I wish the Mustang didn't come loaded and with extra airbags. I would especially pass on a Premium now that a base, PP and Recaros can be matched.

 

[DHG1078]

It sucks, I know... I wish the Mustang didn't come loaded and with extra airbags. I would especially pass on a Premium now that a base, PP and Recaros can be matched.

Depends on what you want the car for. If you want a stripper model that you want for the sole purpose of racing, then that would be a nice option. Most people want a car they can be comfortable in and have all the latest gadgets. These are mostly the people who buy a car for the image and not for it's capabilities. Some people aren't necessarily concerned with getting 100% performance, but still want a comfortable car they can drive every day and still be competitive at the track on the weekend.

As far as airbags and other added safety features, I bet that has more to do with govt. regulations than anything and Ford has no option but to include them.

I'm all for having a stripper model, I do enjoy how basic my '01 bullitt is compared to the new cars and it had a fairly premium interior for it's time lol. I gotta admit though that all these added luxuries are rather nice. We just bought a car (fusion so not performance oriented) with dual-zone climate control and MFT, and I can't believe how much i like them. Dual zone is fantastic since my wife and I have different comfort zones. I would say there is a 95% chance I would add them to any new mustang or whatever performance car I buy in the future.

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