Is the GT500 announcement expected to impact GT350 prices?

[nastang87xx]

All shenanigans...let's be real, we all want one lol. And keep our 350's too.

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[Kurac]

I’m surprise at how many people like the looks of the 500. The only things that appeal to me are the exposed carbon rims and driveshaft of the TP trim level, cobra puddle lights, and sound of the motor. Sounds almost as good as the Voodoo, or just as good, but different. The straight line speed will be fun too. But for the price +ADM this thing will command, I’m much more interested in the C8 Vette....and keeping the R.

 

[firestarter2]

I’m surprise at how many people like the looks of the 500. The only things that appeal to me are the exposed carbon rims and driveshaft of the TP trim level, cobra puddle lights, and sound of the motor. Sounds almost as good as the Voodoo, or just as good, but different. The straight line speed will be fun too. But for the price +ADM this thing will command, I’m much more interested in the C8 Vette....and keeping the R.

I think the gt350 looks better

 

[Hack]

I think that as soon as it becomes apparent that the new GT500 smokes the GT350R on the track, which I firmly believe it will, those with the means to do so will be dumping their GT350/R in favor of the new hotness as fast as they can.

My own plan is to finish paying off the GT350 and then assess the situation. I don't plan on ditching the GT350, but I may look at adding a supercharger at some point.

I don't know about the tracks you go to, but at the track events I attend, driver skill has more variation than car capability. Of course the GT500 will be capable of lapping faster, but on an average track day, what will happen? Lots of different things.

And maybe you have the money to swap cars every time another car passes you on track. I don't. I would rather spend my cash on more track days at this point. I like how my GT350 works well enough - it's fun on track. And for me a big part of the fun is the manual transmission. I think the GT500 is super cool, but I don't want one - at least not to replace the GT350. I'd love to have a GT500 just to play with for a few weeks, but not to hang onto. I don't see it being a replacement for the GT350.


I would expect the GT500 to be quicker on longer straights, but it might be a wash in corners, unless they are super high speed corners. And the GT500 driver will need to be very gentle with their right foot. It will be easy to spin the tires and that will slow down the car big time.

 

[UnhandledException]

I’m about to hit 39,000 miles, very good ones. At this rate, I will hit 50,000 by the end of summer.

At 4220 lbs, gt500 is way too heavy. Thats how much an M5 weighs to give you an idea. At 3760 lbs, i consider my car to be on the heavy side already and I can feel that weight as is.

This car needs to be 3500 lbs next time

 

[raiderjatt02]

I would rather spend my cash on more track days at this point. I like how my GT350 works well enough - it's fun on track. And for me a big part of the fun is the manual transmission. I think the GT500 is super cool, but I don't want one - at least not to replace the GT350. I'd love to have a GT500 just to play with for a few weeks, but not to hang onto. I don't see it being a replacement for the GT350.

This. This right here just about sums up my exact feelings on the GT500. I'd love to drive one for a little while but it's not enough to make me want to replace my GT350.

 

[Colleton]

I don't know about the tracks you go to, but at the track events I attend, driver skill has more variation than car capability. Of course the GT500 will be capable of lapping faster, but on an average track day, what will happen? Lots of different things.

And maybe you have the money to swap cars every time another car passes you on track. I don't. I would rather spend my cash on more track days at this point. I like how my GT350 works well enough - it's fun on track. And for me a big part of the fun is the manual transmission. I think the GT500 is super cool, but I don't want one - at least not to replace the GT350. I'd love to have a GT500 just to play with for a few weeks, but not to hang onto. I don't see it being a replacement for the GT350.

I would expect the GT500 to be quicker on longer straights, but it might be a wash in corners, unless they are super high speed corners. And the GT500 driver will need to be very gentle with their right foot. It will be easy to spin the tires and that will slow down the car big time.

Honestly, unless the track has a very long straight... the average driver would likely find the GT350 easier to drive fast than the GT500 (unless they can't shift a manual). All I'm trying to say is that even if the GT500 is faster around tracks while being driven by a pro, that doesn't mean everyone will be faster in a GT500. Putting down the cash to buy a more powerful car does nothing for a driver's skill set.

The GT500 was built to compete with and (hopefully) beat the ZL1. As such, it will outperform the GT350/R. End of story, anything else is wishful thinking.

Probably not popular to say this, but most people don't buy these cars to track them. Just like most S197 GT500 buyers didn't buy them to take to the drag strip. They buy them for bragging rights/ego gratification. A bit of street driving now and then, hit some car shows for trophies, brag to their friends about their car. When the magazines start reviewing and comparing people are going to gravitate to the new hotness.

FWIW, I had an '09, an '11, a '13 and a '14 GT500. I DD every one of them and I took them to the drag strip (I was very much a novice, but I did enjoy it). I also DD my GT350 for the 1st year of ownership (before the fearmongering on this forum got to me).

As for me, Hack, I think that unless I'm very lucky and/or patient, the new GT500 will be beyond my reach. At the present, as I said above, I'm planning on keeping my GT350. It's pretty much the perfect Mustang IMHO. I may supercharge it or I may look for an unmolested '14 GT500 to go with it (more likely). We'll see.

 

[Bossing]

The major advantage, obviously, is the Supercharger w/ DCT in the new GT500.... the R will still be desirable and price impact is still up in the air but with the GT500 coming out, it'll certainly make the GT350/GT350R units more negotiable or attainable w/o ADMs so to speak. That's my thought on this topic.

The GT500 looks cool but personally I am not eager to get one right away.... let the first year gremlins be sorted out plus those ADMs will be ridiculous anyway. Like every Mustang, improvements and/or corrective actions will be executed year after year. And this won't be an extremely limited production Mustang.... Ford will make thousands. Supposedly a target of approx 5,000 units per year... and they will depreciate just like previous GT500's. The GT350/GT350R is a good deal and still a lot of car.... plus the added bonus of all-motor and manual is a nice incentive now. Oh... and the lower weight.

On one of the yt videos out there, I believe a Ford engineer when asked stated "yes... over 3,800 lbs" so for me that's another turnoff. And i'm not a fan of that rotary shifter dial. It fits the Ford GT (and it's also in the new Explorer) but not in this S550 GT500.... my Raptor has a better looking and proper automatic shifter! Anyway, that's my opinion. If indeed it'll be tipping the scales at 3,800 lbs more or less (due to the DCT, Eaton, and other components) I wonder if that will be the curb weight of a fully loaded (CF Pkg + Track Pkg) GT500 version. Personally, I just can't fathom a high-3,000 lb sports/track car.... heck my GT3 (with the PDK) tips the scale at 3,153 lbs but I know it's not an apples-to-apples comparison.

For GT350/GT350R owners, I guess this would be a nice addition if you want another S550 in your stable.... but IMHO I wouldn't be so quick to give up or sacrifice an R (or maybe even a non-R) for the GT500 just yet especially if you truly appreciate and embrace the naturally-aspirated higher-revving Voodoo and the 6-spd manual. That's my 2 cents.

 

[JT1]

I was absolutely sure I didn't want a DCT...Until I saw the video of, I think his name is Treynor, running a GT4 at an HPDE.
Now I don't know what I want.

I'll be awful PO'ed if I trade my GT350 to find I really do need a clutch pedal to have fun.

I also wish I knew if GT350s reliability was poor, or not. I stopped studying GT500s when I sold my 14, but I don't remember hearing many, if any stock engine failures. I'm wondering how long I can track the GT350 before I need to potentially drop 27K for a new engine.

Further, there is NO DATA if the new GT500 will be any better or worse than the GT350. At least I was lucky enough to get a GT350 with normal oil consumption (so far).

 

[Hack]

The GT500 was built to compete with and (hopefully) beat the ZL1. As such, it will outperform the GT350/R. End of story, anything else is wishful thinking.

If two pro drivers are pushing at 9+/10s, yes that is true. I'm not worried about trying to beat a pro driver. And I would assume that a GT500 will be faster than my car. I have the lowly GT350 non R with Pilot SS tires. It's fast enough for me. I don't have to have the fastest car on track in order to have fun. I will brag when I pass the occasional Z06 or ZL1 on track, though.

Probably not popular to say this, but most people don't buy these cars to track them. Just like most S197 GT500 buyers didn't buy them to take to the drag strip. They buy them for bragging rights/ego gratification. A bit of street driving now and then, hit some car shows for trophies, brag to their friends about their car. When the magazines start reviewing and comparing people are going to gravitate to the new hotness.

I can only speak for myself. I can't imagine buying a GT350 and not tracking it. I think most GT350 owners DO track their cars. Of course neither of us knows exactly what the percentage is. Definitely the GT500 will have more bragging rights. It will have that HP number.

FWIW, I had an '09, an '11, a '13 and a '14 GT500. I DD every one of them and I took them to the drag strip (I was very much a novice, but I did enjoy it). I also DD my GT350 for the 1st year of ownership (before the fearmongering on this forum got to me).

I've never been to the drag strip, but it's good to hear you used the cars for what they were intended for.

As for me, Hack, I think that unless I'm very lucky and/or patient, the new GT500 will be beyond my reach. At the present, as I said above, I'm planning on keeping my GT350. It's pretty much the perfect Mustang IMHO. I may supercharge it or I may look for an unmolested '14 GT500 to go with it (more likely). We'll see.

You should take the GT350 to the road course. Give it a shot.

 

[Allentown]

I didn't read the whole thread but I think it is already happening. I live in a notorious ADM mark up region and i am actually seeing "internet specials" at MSRP. GT350s are sitting at the dealerships longer also. The real drop though will be in the used market. Halo cars devalue the previous halo.

Example: When the 2013 GT500 came out with 662hp, i picked up a 2011GT500 with glass roof (only 550hp), SVT package, black matte stipes on black paint for 42k..not from a private buyer, but from a dealership. It had an after market Roush exhaust, SVT pully and tune and an intake on it. They warantied everything no extra charge.

I suspect once the GT500s have been around a while the used market for someone wanting to pick up a gently used GT350 will look very good. I think it is already improving.

In fact there are 3 or 4 GT350s within an hour drive from me for only 46k to 47k with less than 10k miles on the clock (one has 412 miles on it).

I've never met a person that bought a Shelby Mustang because Shelby was a racer at some point. Just like no one(Well, probably a few do) buys a Bullitt because they think McQueen was a great actor or driver, they buy it because of the movie connection. No one would buy a YENKO because it was a "cool dealership" they would buy it because it's a name associated with a 60's beast of a Camaro.

I wouldn't be so sure about not buying a Shelby because of the legend of Caroll Shelby (unless all your friends are millienials) One big reason for me buying so much steeda gear is that they actually go on tracks and win races with Steeda gear. No "cool movie" necessary. If car has a heritage of racing heritage that is track proven, or is endorsed by someone in that field, that means something. Okay....yes most of us know that can all be just an endorsement deal with marketing hype, but that wasn't really the case with Caroll Shelby.

Back when i was an owner of wondering if they would ever come out with an RX9...a Paul Newman edition would have certainly gotten my attention (and there was never a movie about Newman racing mazdas) and for no other reason than...Paul Newman (although i assume it would have been a heavily beefed up edition).

Now, am i sitting around waiting for the Paul Walker edition of the new toyota Supra? No. (Nothing against Walker but no). Oh and there WAS some cool movies.

Verdict, it isn't the movies, it is the lure of being endorced and or used by true racers, either the cars themselves, the driver who it is themed on or both. (Yes i know Walker was actually getting into racing but he didn't live long enough to gain the heritage he maybe would have deserved later)

I haven't modified my argument at all. You just seem to have issues understanding it. Just because content is there doesn't mean anyone cares to watch it. The only people I know that actually care who Shelby was are easily 50 or 60+. Those are not the same age as the people I see buying the cars. Even then if you ask a 20 or 30 something with a Shelby who he was they will likely just say a guy that made great Mustangs, if they know he was a driver, that would likely be secondary to them. It's not about "car guys forgetting" it's about the new market likely never even hearing about Shelby unless they saw a Shelby Mustang or grew up in a house that cares about racing/mustang, or are just into cars in general. Ask the average Kid who/who Shelby is and they will connect it to Mustangs before they connect it to a racer driver.

If Shelby had no connection to the Mustangs and was just a driver, no one would give 2 shits about him today. He would be just a forgotten as the Shelby Dakota.

To spell this out as it seems to get lost.
The fact that Yenko was a dealership, Dayton was a race, Shelby was a racer, and McQueen/Bullitt was a movie doesn't REALLY matter. The point is they are all "insert cool classic name/imagery here associated with muscle cars" to marketing. Few really care about the pre-name association history. Even if they know it, it's likely playing 0 part in their purchase.

1) I am not 50 and shelby is one of my heros
2) The bulk of people who can afford GT500s/bullets and the bulk of people who actually buy these cars and come to cars and coffee and the local mustang club meetings are easily close to 50 (and well over) so they in fact ARE the ones buying these cars.

Also a little inaccurate. Mcqueen wasn't just IN a car movie. He was also a VERY accomplished driver who participated in real racing (same as Newman and Shelby)

"Think of a Hollywood actor who raced and an image of Steve McQueen will float before your eyes. He was a racing legend, a man so obsessed with the sport he not only made a film about the Le Mans 24 Hours, but also raced at a very high level.

So high indeed that at the Sebring 12 Hours in 1970 (with Le Mans and the Daytona 24 Hours, one of the holy trinity of sports car racing), he failed to win only because Ferrari put future Formula One World Champion Mario Andretti into a car he was not originally scheduled to drive, to pip McQueen’s Porsche at the post. And McQueen drove with a foot in plaster. It’s such an incredible story, it’s a wonder no one has made it into a film." Of course much of the credit goes to his co driver Peter Revson but i digress.

What bothers me about the Bullitt is that you can replicate it on the aftermarket to the dotted i, crossed t, and curly q. The GT350? Good luck...

That is not exactly true. I haven't found anyone doing a fully warranted GT350 manifold, TB and Tune for the non bullets for 2018s. I suspect fords power pack will eventually have it.

AS far as a GT350, that is true and ford does that on purpose. But why would you want a slower GT350 when you can get a faster A10 and put all the suspension and cooling on it to keep up with it on the track for less? (Other than resale value obviously). (Sorry i couldn't resist pointing that out).

I personally am having a blast with the GT350 and have a long way to go in really ringing it out at the track (as much as I am trying). It is an awesome track car that I feel comfortable with and brings a monstrous grin at every mile. Additional horsepower in a car with similar weight and balance would be wasted on me. At $60,000 and even carrying track insurance I am nervous of wading it up with a dumb move on my part or an incident with another car. I don't have the pocketbook or balls to pay $100,000+ for a GT500 and go 10/10ths with it. This is the sweet spot for me personally, and I'm sure there are several drivers out there with a similar mindset. The GT350 provides me with confidence on the track and challenges me plenty.

Or just a $37k GT with 8k in mods then. Same argument.

My GT500 was brilliant for one thing...bulling people on the highway. From a dig it sucked and pushing on corners would have been suicide.

 

[firestarter2]

If two pro drivers are pushing at 9+/10s, yes that is true. I'm not worried about trying to beat a pro driver. And I would assume that a GT500 will be faster than my car. I have the lowly GT350 non R with Pilot SS tires. It's fast enough for me. I don't have to have the fastest car on track in order to have fun. I will brag when I pass the occasional Z06 or ZL1 on track, though.


I can only speak for myself. I can't imagine buying a GT350 and not tracking it. I think most GT350 owners DO track their cars. Of course neither of us knows exactly what the percentage is. Definitely the GT500 will have more bragging rights. It will have that HP number.



I've never been to the drag strip, but it's good to hear you used the cars for what they were intended for.



You should take the GT350 to the road course. Give it a shot.

There is no magic sauce for handling. Anything that made the GT500 faster on the track (except) power Ill just add to my car. There will always be someone faster on the track.

 

[key01]

Or just a $37k GT with 8k in mods then. Same argument.

This discussion is GT350/500 specific. Lots of less expensive highly modified cars can be trackable and fun.

 

[Allentown]

This discussion is GT350/500 specific. Lots of less expensive highly modified cars can be trackable and fun.

With a fair amount of "Bullet vs GT500" thrown in for good measure.. ;)

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