S550 Accident/Repair

[MSMStannyl]

UPDATE #1 (8/7/15):

- See post #28 for the Initial Estimate documentation.

- See post #29 for the Supplement documentation.


So I've been meaning to post my story on here for a while but just haven't had time. I'm just finally getting around to it. Basically, I figured I'd share this so that others can see what to expect in regards to getting (what I thought was minor) damage repaired. I also wouldn't mind some input from anyone in the know on whether this is acceptable and/or suggestions for moving forward. With that said, here's the story. I tried to break it down into sections so you can read what you want:

GENERAL:
Bought my 2015 Mustang GT Premium back in February (2015) and have been loving every day with it over these last few months. Car is Triple-Yellow with the 20" Foundry Wheels, 6-speed manual with the 3.55 axle.

ACCIDENT:
On 7/4/15, I was driving my dad around while car shopping for him. I was at an intersection making a right on red and was stopped, waiting for cross traffic. While stopped a woman in a Volvo SUV (apparently without the collision mitigation options!) stopped behind me. I saw that the cross traffic light turned yellow. There was 1 last car coming but he was going slow enough where I thought he was stopping. I left off my brake and prepared to let off the clutch to get going when he ran the yellow. I went back on the brakes (being a manual on a flat surface, my car didn't actually move). Lady behind thought I went (not sure why since there was still obviously a car coming!) and basically accelerated into the back of my Mustang. I would imagine it was pretty slow but the impact was pretty harsh. In any case, we pulled over in a nearby lot and exchanged info. I was pretty surprised at how minimal the damage appeared compared to what I had felt during the impact.

It turned out that both she and I had GEICO as insurance providers. She called them on her cell phone to report the accident. I filled out a report on the GEICO app. No police were called. After getting each others information, we went our separate ways. Within 10 minutes, I got a call from GEICO saying they had gotten both reports and that they had already determined her to be at fault and would remove any claim from my policy and put it through her policy. We also set up a date/time for the initial estimate and rental car stuff.

INITIAL ESTIMATE:
The following Tuesday (7/7/15) I had an appointment with the GEICO adjuster. He spent about 10 minutes taking pictures and checking everything out. All said and done, the initial estimate was for $1507 and 3 days worth of repair time.

***As a side note, did anyone know that our tail lights are $900! The estimate called for my left tail light to be replaced. The 3 diagonal lights were fine but the black plastic housing had a small crack in the bottom.***

I took this estimate to the body shop. They were really busy so we set up a date about 2 weeks ahead for me to drop it off. I was ok with this as the damage was barely noticeable so I figured I would enjoy driving my car in the meantime.

BODY SHOP/SUPPLEMENT:
Here's where things get interesting. I dropped the car off the morning of 7/22/15 (my rental car saga is almost as interesting but I'll save that for another day). I didn't hear anything back from them until 7/27/15. During the time in between, they had disassembled the rear by removing the bumper cover and tail lights to check for damage underneath. It was at this point that a supplement was written and later approved by the GEICO adjuster...for about $8600!!!
I'm no body shop expert but this blew my mind. I never imagined it would/could be that much higher than the initial estimate. At the end of the day, I'm ok with it as I want my car repaired as perfectly as possible but it just took me by surprise. Apparently they wanted a supplement of $10,000 but the GEICO adjuster negotiated down and approved the $8600 putting the total damages at just over $10,000 (not including rental car)!

So that's where I'm at now. Just waiting to get my baby back! If there's a bright side it's that it will probably feel like a brand new car when it's back in my hands. At this point I'm being told that will be sometime next week.

QUESTIONS:
My questions to some of the "experts" on here are as follows. Any info you can give me would be good to know as I move forward:

- First, what are your thoughts on $10K worth of damage? I was told by the body shop that the supplement included "finesse" time which is extra time/money paid by the insurance company on newer/nicer cars to make sure the repair is perfect.

- Diminished Value. Do I have a case for it? I feel like I do but what do I know? The bottom line is that my car will not be worth what it was right before the accident when a potential buyer finds out about $10k+ in damages. I feel I am owed that difference. How is that calculated? What do I do? Anyone dealt with this before or have any suggestions? I'd really prefer not getting lawyers involved.

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[Zemedici]

I'm assuming this was a low speed collision/impact from your story, and I do find it a bit hard to believe $10,000 in damage was caused, seeing as the bumper is $200....did your exhaust move? Taillights are expensive, decklid is NOT expensive, bumper bar is NOT expensive.

Seems odd...

 

[fionic]

"No police were called

bad idea.

 

[Blk2015GT]

Sounds like the body shop is trying to rip off your insurance. There is no way The bumper (including the supports under), 2 taillights and the rear blackout panel cost near half that even after paint.

 

[MSMStannyl]

"No police were called

bad idea.

Why? For a minor rear end hit? Regardless, that part was over 10 minutes after the accident when she and the insurance established it was her fault. This is no longer an issue. All of the repairs/damages/rental are coming from her policy, not mine. I'm not dropping a single $.

Sounds like the body shop is trying to rip off your insurance. There is no way The bumper (including the supports under), 2 taillights and the rear blackout panel cost near half that even after paint.

Could be. Keep in mind, however, that they don't just throw out a number and get it. They fill out the supplement and then GEICO sent an adjuster to review it. $8600 is what GEICO approved for the supplement.

I'm not saying it's not possible but it does seem like there's at least some sort of checks and balances system in place for these supplements.

As for the parts, I don't have any details on paper but from what they told me, here is what the $10K will consist of (at a minimum):

- Left Tail Light Assembly
- Bumper Cover
- Bumper Beam
- Sheet metal piece that was dented/crushed inwards. (Existing piece will have it's spot welds drilled out and it will be removed. New piece will be welded into place. It's hard to see in the pic but it's the panel that sits right below where the left tail light would be. There's a rectangular impression "stamped" on it.)
- Lots of labor
- Painting
- "Finesse Time" which is apparently a thing.

Bottom line, none of this is coming out of my pocket so it could be $20k for all I care, as long as she's perfect when I get her back. I was just shocked that something that seemed so minimal could balloon into this. In my eyes, this makes even more of an argument for diminished value because we're no longer talking about $1500 in damage from a minor tap. We're now talking about $10k in damage! I should also add that, assuming I do get it back next week, they will have had my car for about 3 weeks for this (although I know for a fact that it sat for about 1.5 weeks after the supplement was issued).

 

[MSMStannyl]

I'm assuming this was a low speed collision/impact from your story, and I do find it a bit hard to believe $10,000 in damage was caused, seeing as the bumper is $200....did your exhaust move? Taillights are expensive, decklid is NOT expensive, bumper bar is NOT expensive.

Seems odd...

Nothing I saw made it appear that the exhaust was touched at all. Looked perfectly fine. Like I said, I had a hard time convincing people I had been rear ended until I showed them some of the panel misalignments up close.

The woman that hit me was driving a 2008 Volvo XC70 SUV. The epicenter of the impact was on the left side of my bumper cover, just under the tail light. That, in turn, pushed some other things out of alignment and as we can now see, pushed in the bumper beam and crushed a portion of sheet metal below the tail light.

 

[Zemedici]

Nothing I saw made it appear that the exhaust was touched at all. Looked perfectly fine. Like I said, I had a hard time convincing people I had been rear ended until I showed them some of the panel misalignments up close.

The woman that hit me was driving a 2008 Volvo XC70 SUV. The epicenter of the impact was on the left side of my bumper cover, just under the tail light. That, in turn, pushed some other things out of alignment and as we can now see, pushed in the bumper beam and crushed a portion of sheet metal below the tail light.

yeah I'm gonna call BS on that much damage then...I just don't see it. The parts damaged aren't expensive. (I sell ford parts, and ran a collision center at my previous job)

A lot of the things described can be fixed, as their structural integrity is not damaged from such a low-speed impact.

 

[krt22]

The alignment between the rear quarter and trunk on the collision side is all screwed up as well, so I wonder how much "finessing" that takes

 

[MSMStannyl]

yeah I'm gonna call BS on that much damage then...I just don't see it. The parts damaged aren't expensive. (I sell ford parts, and ran a collision center at my previous job)

A lot of the things described can be fixed, as their structural integrity is not damaged from such a low-speed impact.

Any thoughts or advice on a diminished value claim?

 

[MurderPony]

I am literally an EXPERT in California on everything relating to vehicle damage and estimating. I review and rule on cases for all of the major insurance companies all over the country.

Not sure what state you live in but I can assure you Finesse time does not exist in CA unless somebody is taking money under the table. Paying someone to do a Better Job on a new car implies they won't do a good of a job on an older car which would put them in a tough position legally. I don't see 10,000 in damages in those photos. When I was reading your post I assumed they discovered rear body and side member damage after they disassembled it which might explain it but again I do not see that in those photos. Large supplements are not that unusual but they can be minimized with a proper initial inspection. For example most estimators are lazy and don't take the time to look under the car, up behind the bumper, open trunks and lift up carpet, pull back weatherstrip to look for separation of pinch welds, check gaps, etc....

Generally speaking you Absolutely have a DV claim. You usually can't file it against your own company but you can file it against the company that hit you even if they are both the same company. Some states have a very specific DV structure with charts that show you what you are owed while States like CA does not. It's easy to prove the value will be diminished but it's very difficult to prove how much often resulting in low settlements.

Post pictures of each page of the estimate and I can tell you if it's legit or not.

 

[bluebeastsrt]

I'm in the school of thought that's as long as they repair Your car to like new condition it's the insurance company's problem if the body shop is trying to get over on them. They need to do their do diligence.

 

[MurderPony]

I'm in the school of thought that's as long as they repair Your car to like new condition it's the insurance company's problem if the body shop is trying to get over on them. They need to do their do diligence.

Yes except that dollar amount stays with the vehicle as apart of its history and is open to interpretation so the smaller the better.

 

[krt22]

I'm in the school of thought that's as long as they repair Your car to like new condition it's the insurance company's problem if the body shop is trying to get over on them. They need to do their do diligence.

I would be weary of any dishonest shop. If they are trying to get over on the insurance company, then they are also likely to do sub-standard repairs and/or use used/remanufactured/replica parts.

 

[ConspicuousConsumption]

I am literally an EXPERT in California on everything relating to vehicle damage and estimating. I review and rule on cases for all of the major insurance companies all over the country.

Not sure what state you live in but I can assure you Finesse time does not exist in CA unless somebody is taking money under the table. Paying someone to do a Better Job on a new car implies they won't do a good of a job on an older car which would put them in a tough position legally. I don't see 10,000 in damages in those photos. When I was reading your post I assumed they discovered rear body and side member damage after they disassembled it which might explain it but again I do not see that in those photos. Large supplements are not that unusual but they can be minimized with a proper initial inspection. For example most estimators are lazy and don't take the time to look under the car, up behind the bumper, open trunks and lift up carpet, pull back weatherstrip to look for separation of pinch welds, check gaps, etc....

Generally speaking you Absolutely have a DV claim. You usually can't file it against your own company but you can file it against the company that hit you even if they are both the same company. Some states have a very specific DV structure with charts that show you what you are owed while States like CA does not. It's easy to prove the value will be diminished but it's very difficult to prove how much often resulting in low settlements.

Post pictures of each page of the estimate and I can tell you if it's legit or not.

Nice to have an EXPERT on here! You should write up an essay and see if the mods will sticky it, talking all about this kind of stuff. :cheers:

 

[MSMStannyl]

I am literally an EXPERT in California on everything relating to vehicle damage and estimating. I review and rule on cases for all of the major insurance companies all over the country.

Not sure what state you live in but I can assure you Finesse time does not exist in CA unless somebody is taking money under the table. Paying someone to do a Better Job on a new car implies they won't do a good of a job on an older car which would put them in a tough position legally. I don't see 10,000 in damages in those photos. When I was reading your post I assumed they discovered rear body and side member damage after they disassembled it which might explain it but again I do not see that in those photos. Large supplements are not that unusual but they can be minimized with a proper initial inspection. For example most estimators are lazy and don't take the time to look under the car, up behind the bumper, open trunks and lift up carpet, pull back weatherstrip to look for separation of pinch welds, check gaps, etc....

Generally speaking you Absolutely have a DV claim. You usually can't file it against your own company but you can file it against the company that hit you even if they are both the same company. Some states have a very specific DV structure with charts that show you what you are owed while States like CA does not. It's easy to prove the value will be diminished but it's very difficult to prove how much often resulting in low settlements.

Post pictures of each page of the estimate and I can tell you if it's legit or not.

Will do. It's supposed to be online but I was having a hard time finding the supplement, perhaps because the claim in not on my policy but on hers (the lady that hit me). I'll find it and post. I do have the initial $1507 estimate paperwork though.

BTW, I'm in Baltimore MD.

I'm in the school of thought that's as long as they repair Your car to like new condition it's the insurance company's problem if the body shop is trying to get over on them. They need to do their do diligence.

Exactly. They approved it after negotiation.

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