Tires that Hold on Dry Asphalt at 600+ RWHP (not DR)

[dubster99]

If you're making enough power, no street tire will hook. Not sure why people don't understand this. My 305 nt555g2 spin in third gear doing datalogs, and that's rolling in from 3k. At 5k they spin violently to redline. Nobody gives a shit what G force they're pulling on their accelerometer.

You could get Nitto NT555R drag radials to last over 5k.

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[Mustang_Owner]

"NT555R DR should last over 5K"

Thanks, I would consider them, but they don't make a 19" tire and my wheels are 19".

"No street tire will hook"

Tire choice is one of the most important factors on a FI GT in my opinion. Better tires (softer compound) = better grip. At some point, the compound is too soft and you can't get 5000+ miles use. Also, some tires don't have any wet performance at all (such as those with no grooves), so I don't want those. If you read the opening post, I'm not asking for dead hooking in 1st, just 2nd which I believe is possible with the right tire choice. I'm looking for other things too, but you probably didn't read the first posts.

"Nobody gives a shit what G force they're pulling on their accelerometer."

Sure there are lots of varying conditions (tire pressure, temperature, tire size, road type, and overall power), but generally the higher the forward G-force, the better the traction on a particular tire given similar conditions.

Tonight, I reset my car acceleration detector and re-measured on asphalt. I found at 80 degrees F, I can get 0.80 G-force in 2nd as I continue to slowly apply more gas just to the point of slipping. It took several attempts to get the 0.80 (tires were probably heating up), so my 0.90 was really an all-time best with the 325/30R19 MPSS.

I am hoping people post their forward G-force acceleration, outside temp, tire pressure (if they don't keep the tires close to 35 psi), road (ideally virgin asphalt, not at a racetrack with lots of rubber put down), tire model, and tire size so I can compare tire grip. It seems like scientific somewhat objective way to determine actual grip (since all the 15+ Mustangs accelerometers are probably calibrated the same).

 

[ahl395]

I probably should not even respond to the last post, but ...

"No street tire will hook"

Tire choice is one of the most important factors on a FI GT in my opinion. Better tires (softer compound) = better grip. At some point, the compound is too soft and you can't get 5000+ miles use. Also, some tires don't have any wet performance at all (such as those with no grooves), so I don't want those. If you read the opening post, I'm not asking for dead hooking in 1st, just 2nd which I believe is possible with the right tire choice. I'm looking for other things too, but you probably didn't read the first posts.

"Nobody gives a shit what G force they're pulling on their accelerometer."

Just because you don't understand that G-force directly measures stickiness during acceleration doesn't mean you can speak for the majority of people who do understand this concept. Sure there are lots of varying conditions (tire pressure, temperature, tire size, road type, and overall power), but generally the higher the forward G-force, the better the traction on a particular tire given similar conditions.

Tonight, I reset my car acceleration detector and re-measured on asphalt. I found at 80 degrees F, I can get 0.80 G-force in 2nd as I continue to slowly apply more gas just to the point of slipping. It took several attempts to get the 0.80 (tires were probably heating up), so my 0.90 was really an all-time best with the 325/30R19 MPSS.

I am hoping people post their forward G-force acceleration, outside temp, tire pressure (if they don't keep the tires close to 35 psi), road (ideally virgin asphalt, not at a racetrack with lots of rubber put down), tire model, and tire size so I can compare tire grip. It seems like scientific somewhat objective way to determine actual grip (since all the 15+ Mustangs accelerometers are probably calibrated the same).

Even hooking in 2nd with street tires sounds unlikely to me.

I would post my G forces as I think that would be some comparison, but it's 40F outside here :lol:

 

[Mustang_Owner]

Unfortunately, at 40F you probably don't get 'good' traction on any tires. I just happen to live in South Florida where the temperatures are generally 70F to 95F most of the year and I am close to sea level so I get slightly more air pressure. I suppose if you posted the forward acceleration of what you measured at 40F on your tire and somebody else posted a significantly higher g-force acceleration at 40F on their tire, their tire is better for traction. I am not going to buy a 4WD car nor put on full stickies anytime soon. Instead, I'm going to do the most research possible to rank the stickiness of tires, then pick the stickiest, widest, 19" tire that does not slip off the road when wet and still gets 5K+ miles.

My first goal is to make a ranking of tire stickiness. Here's an attempt, but it is probably not right. Anybody want to try to put these tires in order from 'most' to 'least' sticky?

A7/R7 (not considering b.c. they will slip off the road in any wet conditions)
NT05R (not considering b.c. they will slip off the road in any wet conditions)
R888R (they look like they have very poor wet condition traction)
CECS
Trofeo R
MPS4
ET SS
MPSS

Anybody know of somebody who has already tried many of these tires and reported some objective numbers? All I have to go on for somewhat objective comparative measurements at the moment is treadwear and some generic traction like "AA" that doesn't do much to compare several "AA" rated tires.

 

[Cobo_pro]

MPS 4S have done me right. To all the "no tires will hook", that's an absolutist view, they make tires for Ferrari Lamborghini and the Ford GT.... That being said, many people don't want to spend the money that the Michelin PS4 s cost, but I see them as worth it.... Just like the dude above though, I'm in sunny south Florida

 

[Coyote Red]

Tyres

I am on the coastal bend of Texas and have also been searching for "sticky" street tires as I road warrior my pony as a DD. I had a sidewall puncture in hurricane Harvey and needed two rears, so Firestone had in stock the Bridgestone S0-4 pole position with a 280 tread wear rating. They "hook" ok but I can bark 2nd gear. Wet traction is decent. I want to learn to do this acceleration g testing as I am buying 2 more tires soon but am not fully satisfied with the bridgestones. As you have said if I go too low on the tread wear I have to buy tyres too often. Thanks for the post, I'll follow this.

 

[Coyote Red]

Putting power down

Less tire discusson, more suspension discussion to get it put down. The S550 in stock trim does not transfer or hold steady power for squat. Better tires will help, but ultimately needs the suspension tailored for putting down decent power.

I've started my suspension upgrade & BMR 005&006 really do help. Vertical links with sperical bearings are next then coilovers. A stiffer rear sway may help as well, I am still researching all this and this forum helps a lot. Thanks guys!
Pony Up!

 

[Mustang_Owner]

MPS 4S have done me right. To all the "no tires will hook", that's an absolutist view, they make tires for Ferrari Lamborghini and the Ford GT.... That being said, many people don't want to spend the money that the Michelin PS4 s cost, but I see them as worth it.... Just like the dude above though, I'm in sunny south Florida

Hi Cobo_pro, can you reset your accelerometer and take a new reading of forward acceleration on dry asphalt (not a racetrack) just before the tires slip with your MPS 4S and let me know what it is and what the temp was? Feel free to try in 1st or 2nd when the weather is as hot as possible and no rain that day. Also, tell me what size rear tires you have. Thanks!

 

[Mustang_Owner]

Just for reference, I found a new 2019 corvette zr1 is coming out with 755 HP. Many Mustang turbo/super charged cars are probably around that HP now (at the crank) on 93 pump gas. They are using Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 335 wide tires, probably the same ones used on the Z06. I found these current 650 HP car tires for the viper and supercharged corvette. They both have a tread rating of around 200, so my next tires will probably have a 200 or less tread rating also (if that makes a more sticky difference). Unfortunately, neither fits the mustang:

 

[dubster99]

Let me know how that works out for you. I personally know someone who ran the sport cup 2 (305) at 650whp and they didn't hook until 3rd gear.

Just because a tire comes stock on a high powered car doesn't mean it actually hooks in low gears.

 

[Cobo_pro]

Hi Cobo_pro, can you reset your accelerometer and take a new reading of forward acceleration on dry asphalt (not a racetrack) just before the tires slip with your MPS 4S and let me know what it is and what the temp was? Feel free to try in 1st or 2nd when the weather is as hot as possible and no rain that day. Also, tell me what size rear tires you have. Thanks!

I would love to, as soon as I get a tune revision back for my gt350 manifold. The tires are 305, and I have 3.31 gears

 

[Cobo_pro]

Just for reference, I found a new 2019 corvette zr1 is coming out with 755 HP. Many Mustang turbo/super charged cars are probably around that HP now (at the crank) on 93 pump gas. They are using Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 335 wide tires, probably the same ones used on the Z06. I found these current 650 HP car tires for the viper and supercharged corvette. They both have a tread rating of around 200, so my next tires will probably have a 200 or less tread rating also (if that makes a more sticky difference). Unfortunately, neither fits the mustang:

The 335 will fit with (I believe) a 11" rear rim. I'm staggered at 10.5 which is why I chose 305. Were I buying rims again, I would have gone with 11" rear

 

[Cobo_pro]

Hi Cobo_pro, can you reset your accelerometer and take a new reading of forward acceleration on dry asphalt (not a racetrack) just before the tires slip with your MPS 4S and let me know what it is and what the temp was? Feel free to try in 1st or 2nd when the weather is as hot as possible and no rain that day. Also, tell me what size rear tires you have. Thanks!

I just noticed you're in Davie, if you wanna drive here to Naples I'll take you for a spin

 

[Cobo_pro]

Unfortunately, at 40F you probably don't get 'good' traction on any tires. I just happen to live in South Florida where the temperatures are generally 70F to 95F most of the year and I am close to sea level so I get slightly more air pressure. I suppose if you posted the forward acceleration of what you measured at 40F on your tire and somebody else posted a significantly higher g-force acceleration at 40F on their tire, their tire is better for traction. I am not going to buy a 4WD car nor put on full stickies anytime soon. Instead, I'm going to do the most research possible to rank the stickiness of tires, then pick the stickiest, widest, 19" tire that does not slip off the road when wet and still gets 5K+ miles.

My first goal is to make a ranking of tire stickiness. Here's an attempt, but it is probably not right. Anybody want to try to put these tires in order from 'most' to 'least' sticky?

A7/R7 (not considering b.c. they will slip off the road in any wet conditions)
NT05R (not considering b.c. they will slip off the road in any wet conditions)
R888R (they look like they have very poor wet condition traction)
CECS
Trofeo R
MPS4
ET SS
MPSS

Anybody know of somebody who has already tried many of these tires and reported some objective numbers? All I have to go on for somewhat objective comparative measurements at the moment is treadwear and some generic traction like "AA" that doesn't do much to compare several "AA" rated tires.

Car and driver just did a comparison test in July.

https://www.caranddriver.com/features/2017-performance-summer-tire-test-feature

 

[Mustang_Owner]

Thanks for the link cobo_pro! Your tire was ranked at the top of the 5 they tested. That CECS tire looked about the same and slightly better in wet conditions. I can't believe they found a 0.95 and 0.94 G on those tires, but maybe their G-force meter is more accurate than the ones in our cars. I agree with the ranking of the P-zero since in wet conditions, they don't hold well at all from my personal experience.

I found all of these tires have a treadwear of 200 or less and would fit my 19 x 11.5" wheel:

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