install headers without tune

[AZ18yote]

Didnt want to start a new thread. Has anyone done catted headers without a tune? If so what do you think the HP gain was? Wondering if its possible to get to 500 crank hp and keep the warranty.

Keeping the warranty is a misnomer. A tune won't void the warranty, but they can deny a warranty claim if they blame the tune for it. Same with the headers. They won't void the warranty but dealer can deny warranty claim if they blame the headers for whatever the issue is you are taking it in for.

But if you take it in for something unrelated it should still be covered. If you need ac replaced or power window motor etc they won't deny warranty claim because of a tune, headers, super charger etc.

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[Performance nut]

Didnt want to start a new thread. Has anyone done catted headers without a tune? If so what do you think the HP gain was? Wondering if its possible to get to 500 crank hp and keep the warranty.

I did on a GENII engine. Many said my engine would die, bad things would happen. Worst thing that happened was a check engine light (even with green cats). I dyno'ed but I don't recall the numbers. I remember it was just shy of my goal. The gains are linear with what tuning results get. In other words if a tune gets 20 and tune plus headers gets you 30, headers alone gets you 10.

What I do remember is it wasn't worth it. When I got my 2018, I got an E85 tune and called it a day. Unless you are going max effort, headers don't do much. Can't remember the name but Lethal did a project car that posted dyno and track results after every mod. Headers and intake were the lowest gains. IMO, wasn't worth it.

 

[paulm1]

thank you, that was exactly what i wanted to know.

 

[GrayMater22]

Didnt want to start a new thread. Has anyone done catted headers without a tune? If so what do you think the HP gain was? Wondering if its possible to get to 500 crank hp and keep the warranty.

I would also be interested in any experience or answers to this question, mine is tuned with 114mm maf, so I would be surprised if adding 1 3/4" Kooks with high flow cats would even need a tune revision.

 

[EFI]

adding 1 3/4" Kooks with high flow cats would even need a tune revision.

As others have mentioned, it doesn't "need" a revision as the ECU is sophisticated enough to be able to maintain driveability even with the new pipes. Now it could use a new tune if you want to get the most out of those new pipes.

 

[HKusp]

As others have mentioned, it doesn't "need" a revision as the ECU is sophisticated enough to be able to maintain driveability even with the new pipes. Now it could use a new tune if you want to get the most out of those new pipes.

What he said^^^^. The PCM has enough parameters to take advantage of headers without a re-tune. I ran catless headers N/A for about 14 months before I went FI. No issues at all.

 

[GrayMater22]

What he said^^^^. The PCM has enough parameters to take advantage of headers without a re-tune. I ran catless headers N/A for about 14 months before I went FI. No issues at all.

Thank you for the response, that is what I was hoping for because I really like the tune and it is a locked tune, so I would have to get a whole new tune if retune was necessary.

 

[junits15]

I would also be interested in any experience or answers to this question, mine is tuned with 114mm maf, so I would be surprised if adding 1 3/4" Kooks with high flow cats would even need a tune revision.

A tune will allow you to get a little more power, that's it. They will change the cam phasing, unrelated to the changes that they did for that maf tube.


I seriously would not pay the cost of an update just for headers, they really are subtle. I'd stack a few mods up before getting a tune update. I'd take the money that headers cost, get an e85 tune and spend the rest elsewhere.

 

[Unvaxxed]

My tuner told me that adding headers should not affect the tune much, just log it and send it to your tuner to verify.

 

[rolfe.oliver]

My tuner told me that adding headers should not affect the tune much, just log it and send it to your tuner to verify.

Log is not even required. If you are in a revision window, then no harm, no foul. But for anyone wanting to get headers/cat-deletes, you do not need a tune. No reasonable tuner will disable rear 02 sensors, so you will need some "extensions/defoulers" to try and avoid p0420/p0430 codes for cat inefficiency.

 

[hlfbkd420]

Keeping the warranty is a misnomer. A tune won't void the warranty, but they can deny a warranty claim if they blame the tune for it. Same with the headers. They won't void the warranty but dealer can deny warranty claim if they blame the headers for whatever the issue is you are taking it in for.

But if you take it in for something unrelated it should still be covered. If you need ac replaced or power window motor etc they won't deny warranty claim because of a tune, headers, super charger etc.

Agreed. And can confirm. Took the manifolds and cats off my 2nd 2018+ Mustang at 1000 miles, right after the blower was installed. Drove it for 2 years without tuning it. Ran just fine, no CEL's, but still wouldn't get me passed emissions here because I had 3 sensors that wouldn't ready up. If you use Big Daddy O2 Spacers, it should work without a tune or CEL.

I popped cylinder 6 and warranty denied at 20,000 miles. They did not mention the tune until they couldn't figure out how to get the new engine running right. Warranty denied immediately because of the headers.

In my case, the tune allowed Torque Management to be changed, and also to remove Cat Protection since they aren't there any more. I need them back on my car again. The cooling benefits of headers in my case were highly worth it.

 

[JimmyNY]

Does anyone have an email of Big Daddy? Not sure which O2 Simulator to get for my Mach 1.

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