Front End Noise Mystery

[308 Cal. Bullitt]

So both your cars are V8 5.0L GT's?

I have 1 or 2 more tests I want to perform next time I drive my car. I am identifying something that may be relevant to this topic.

Unless it drys off qwik today, it may be a few days till I wrap up this exercise in scuffing ~$2800 performance tires, by sawing at the steering wheel, for no logical reason that benefits ourselves.

btw, is this knock a European car mdl thing?

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[kilobravo]

I tested my '20 a couple times yesterday and when it's full left stopped and I add a bit of throttle, I hear a very slight "thud" that sounded like the fender well flexing. Didn't happen at full right.

I don't know if it's the same little noise or not but it doesn't sound quite the same as the video.

 

[deepimpact]

It may be half-knowledge on my part, but my gut feeling tells me that it's either the springs or something that's rubbing against each other. It's definitely felt in the pedal. I don't know if its normal or a connected issue but I can also feel the road in the pedal sometimes, If I drive over uneven surface, for example not very even asphalt, I can feel a very tiny feeling in the pedal. Maybe it's same same element transferring that ground contact to the pedal... I
When I turn the steering wheel all the way to the left and start driving, it also feels weird. Very difficult to describe.

I'll try to install a camera soon and hopefully see what's happening. Actually, Ford could analyze it better, but they don't. With the right tools and time, they would surely quickly locate the noise. However, they just replace components and hope that the noise will go away.

The warmer it gets, the stronger the noise. If the weather is cold and I start the vehicle and drive, it doesn't happen. But if I have been driving for about 20 minutes, stop, and then start driving with the steering wheel turned fully to the left, the noise happens again.
No idea.

 

[308 Cal. Bullitt]

The warmer it gets, the stronger the noise. If the weather is cold and I start the vehicle and drive, it doesn't happen. But if I have been driving for about 20 minutes, stop, and then start driving with the steering wheel turned fully to the left, the noise happens again.
No idea.

Angeldeath's reply to us had conveyed that his own results were-
Temp didn't matter - car warmed up didn't matter....
your results appear to be different, but in the end,
the knock is the knock is the knock,
if you have it.
We do not have it. I may have an idea why, but 1st, a few things being said by Ford over the last few yrs.

Its been said (by FoMoCo engineers) that the Shelby GT500 had received a updated Electronic Power Steering rack for 2020+ model Yrs. Then it was said the 2024 S650 got a steering shaft size upgrade of either 200%/300% larger than the S550 diameter. I fail to recall exactly what the % increase was now.
As for our own car, I cannot verify exactly what changes Ford made on the GT500 EPS units, that made them different/improved.

What I can say , is the behavior of our steering rack, is possibly different than anybody else's in this thread, to date.
Unless everyone has failed to mention what we are about to speak to...

We did tests on 2 different days, to make sure I wasnt getting inconsistent results.

When we turn the rack to full left lock-
So that the steering wheel cannot possibly turn any further left....

...followed by starting to pull forward...

our steering wheel turns just a little bit more to the left, as we start to roll forward.
Something allows this to happen, in either software, or by other means. It certainly is a good idea, to not put that full load against the rack, from the very start.

So I ask...??
Anyone else have this situation, & just felt it wasn't necessary to mention it?

 

[AngelDeath]

Angeldeath's reply to us had conveyed that his own results were-
Temp didn't matter - car warmed up didn't matter....
your results appear to be different, but in the end,
the knock is the knock is the knock,
if you have it.
We do not have it. I may have an idea why, but 1st, a few things being said by Ford over the last few yrs.

Its been said (by FoMoCo engineers) that the Shelby GT500 had received a updated Electronic Power Steering rack for 2020+ model Yrs. Then it was said the 2024 S650 got a steering shaft size upgrade of either 200%/300% larger than the S550 diameter. I fail to recall exactly what the % increase was now.
As for our own car, I cannot verify exactly what changes Ford made on the GT500 EPS units, that made them different/improved.

What I can say , is the behavior of our steering rack, is possibly different than anybody else's in this thread, to date.
Unless everyone has failed to mention what we are about to speak to...

We did tests on 2 different days, to make sure I wasnt getting inconsistent results.

When we turn the rack to full left lock-
So that the steering wheel cannot possibly turn any further left....

...followed by starting to pull forward...

our steering wheel turns just a little bit more to the left, as we start to roll forward.
Something allows this to happen, in either software, or by other means. It certainly is a good idea, to not put that full load against the rack, from the very start.

So I ask...??
Anyone else have this situation, & just felt it wasn't necessary to mention it?

One of the reason why I say temp doesnt matter is I drive my car from April to Oct and I can replicate it as soon as I get in the car, doesnt need to be warmed up, the video deep impact posted IS the noise thats heard and it doesnt seem that its only to the 500 models or to one particular year. When you say you let it roll forward are you letting the car itself roll or are you gently giving it gas? In my attempts I always am pressing the pedal, not hard, as its been said already as if you are wedged between two cars and have to jimmy yourself out of it by going back and forth so in that instance you cannot really step on the gas pedal other than lightly.

If you follow the thread back from when i first posted about this in March of 21 people with 350 & 350R's also have stated this noise/occurrence, When I get my car back, I am going to make a video of this and try to get this as clear as possible so there is no misunderstanding, again there are some that do not have this as its been stated, either its true they dont have it, or they cant replicate it as they dont do it correctly.

308, I do not recall my steering going more left after being hard locked left, and if it does that could be some give once the car moves and the rack adjusts.

 

[deepimpact]

A guy send me this video where he captured the exact same noise very well.

 

[deepimpact]

Angeldeath's reply to us had conveyed that his own results were-
Temp didn't matter - car warmed up didn't matter....
your results appear to be different, but in the end,
the knock is the knock is the knock,
if you have it.
We do not have it. I may have an idea why, but 1st, a few things being said by Ford over the last few yrs.

Its been said (by FoMoCo engineers) that the Shelby GT500 had received a updated Electronic Power Steering rack for 2020+ model Yrs. Then it was said the 2024 S650 got a steering shaft size upgrade of either 200%/300% larger than the S550 diameter. I fail to recall exactly what the % increase was now.
As for our own car, I cannot verify exactly what changes Ford made on the GT500 EPS units, that made them different/improved.

What I can say , is the behavior of our steering rack, is possibly different than anybody else's in this thread, to date.
Unless everyone has failed to mention what we are about to speak to...

We did tests on 2 different days, to make sure I wasnt getting inconsistent results.

When we turn the rack to full left lock-
So that the steering wheel cannot possibly turn any further left....

...followed by starting to pull forward...

our steering wheel turns just a little bit more to the left, as we start to roll forward.
Something allows this to happen, in either software, or by other means. It certainly is a good idea, to not put that full load against the rack, from the very start.

So I ask...??
Anyone else have this situation, & just felt it wasn't necessary to mention it?

Lol i dont know

Angeldeath's reply to us had conveyed that his own results were-
Temp didn't matter - car warmed up didn't matter....
your results appear to be different, but in the end,
the knock is the knock is the knock,
if you have it.
We do not have it. I may have an idea why, but 1st, a few things being said by Ford over the last few yrs.

Its been said (by FoMoCo engineers) that the Shelby GT500 had received a updated Electronic Power Steering rack for 2020+ model Yrs. Then it was said the 2024 S650 got a steering shaft size upgrade of either 200%/300% larger than the S550 diameter. I fail to recall exactly what the % increase was now.
As for our own car, I cannot verify exactly what changes Ford made on the GT500 EPS units, that made them different/improved.

What I can say , is the behavior of our steering rack, is possibly different than anybody else's in this thread, to date.
Unless everyone has failed to mention what we are about to speak to...

We did tests on 2 different days, to make sure I wasnt getting inconsistent results.

When we turn the rack to full left lock-
So that the steering wheel cannot possibly turn any further left....

...followed by starting to pull forward...

our steering wheel turns just a little bit more to the left, as we start to roll forward.
Something allows this to happen, in either software, or by other means. It certainly is a good idea, to not put that full load against the rack, from the very start.

So I ask...??
Anyone else have this situation, & just felt it wasn't necessary to mention it?

Lol. I am experiencing the same:

When we turn the rack to full left lock-
So that the steering wheel cannot possibly turn any further left....

...followed by starting to pull forward...

our steering wheel turns just a little bit more to the left, as we start to roll forward.
_
I have a 21 GT Automatic

 

[deepimpact]

Summary of the noise issue with my car:

• The noise does NOT occur when the car is stationary. It only happens when full lock turning left from a stationary position, for example when exiting a parking spot.
• The noise does NOT occur in reverse.
• The noise does NOT happen when the car is cold or when the weather is cold (below 15°C), unless...
• ...the car has been driven for 10-15 minutes, after which the noise usually occurs. This suggests that some component is getting warm (the spring, perhaps?).
• The noise almost ALWAYS happens when the weather is warm (20°C).

What has been done so far:

• The universal joint has been replaced.
• The left strut mount has been replaced.

 

[308 Cal. Bullitt]

After turning the wheel to full left lock,
(& then releasing the foot brake)
...yes...
We have to step on the throttle pedal, for
the car to drive forward in a locked left turning direction.

With the Tremec DCT 9070 transmission, I must use some throttle, at full left lock, to get the car to drive in circle.


Our driving season is fast coming to an end here as well.
Nov is usually about it, till next March/April.

W/other 4x4 & 1 ton dually veh's, that I pay license, tax, insurance on....
Putting winter tire/wheels, in place of PS4S summer tires, just is not practical for us.

I think those here who have the "knock" issue should try to replicate it on a low cut grass lawn, where tire friction is diminished a bit.
It costs nothing.

 

[kilobravo]

I think those here who have the "knock" issue should try to replicate it on a low cut grass lawn, where tire friction is diminished a bit.

.308: First, that's an excellent eye deer testing with less friction. Good headwork!

Secondly, your car sure looks familiar! <grin>

 

[Sonia]

My 2020 has been making this noise for the past 18 months. Armed with everyone's knowledge from this thread, I asked the dealer to investigate the noise again. They still can't find the root cause of the noise. They talked to someone over at Ford Engineering and it's been decided to replace my steering column to see if that sorts out the issue. I doubt it will, seems like just throwing parts at something, but I'll report back after the install.

I need assistance on have a 21 mustang Gt convertible, it started making that popping sound around November. It doesn't happen all the time but when I'm backing out of my parking spot at work turning left it does. The dealership replaced some bearings on the frame but it's still doing it, they heard the noise 1 time from the dealership but couldn't seem to duplicate it. What should I do?

 

[CaptDave]

I need assistance on have a 21 mustang Gt convertible, it started making that popping sound around November. It doesn't happen all the time but when I'm backing out of my parking spot at work turning left it does. The dealership replaced some bearings on the frame but it's still doing it, they heard the noise 1 time from the dealership but couldn't seem to duplicate it. What should I do?

These are the notes from my service document when I had this done. I'd recommend you show your service advisor this and see if it helps them at all. Mine was covered under warranty.

"Performed electronic chassis ear diagnosis. Necessary additional diagnosis. Needed to rack vehicle 7 plus times for chassis ear node placements across whole front end to isolate noise coming from firewall area. Pin pointed noise coming from steering shaft. Replaced lower and upper steering shaft per hotline and performed post repair road test to verify noise is no longer present."

 

[Sonia]

These are the notes from my service document when I had this done. I'd recommend you show your service advisor this and see if it helps them at all. Mine was covered under warranty.

"Performed electronic chassis ear diagnosis. Necessary additional diagnosis. Needed to rack vehicle 7 plus times for chassis ear node placements across whole front end to isolate noise coming from firewall area. Pin pointed noise coming from steering shaft. Replaced lower and upper steering shaft per hotline and performed post repair road test to verify noise is no longer present."

I sent it to them and they said " interesting" and asked when components from their shop could come to my work to hear it pulling out of a parking space, I said sure. It doesn't do it everytime so I'm hoping it does when they come, mine only has 34500 miles on it and this started in November
Thank you

 

[CaptDave]

I sent it to them and they said " interesting" and asked when components from their shop could come to my work to hear it pulling out of a parking space, I said sure. It doesn't do it everytime so I'm hoping it does when they come, mine only has 34500 miles on it and this started in November
Thank you

No problem. You should also mention to them the shop had to get on the hotline with Ford engineering to get this figured out for mine. I bet there'd be a record of that somewhere with additional details.

 

[Sonia]

No problem. You should also mention to them the shop had to get on the hotline with Ford engineering to get this figured out for mine. I bet there'd be a record of that somewhere with additional details.

You're the best thanks again.

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