Ford Racing ProCal Tune

[JonD]

Really? You haven't read that when you buy this tune your power train warranty goes from 5/60 to 3/36? This is "explicit" in the purchase agreement. Otherwise, it wouldn't affect your warranty, just as aftermarket tunes don't affect your warranty.

I've had aftermarket tunes on my current Focus, three M3s and an Audi RS6. Every one of these cars were covered for engine issues under the factory warranties. Why? Because it's illegal to deny them. Why this gets argued on forums escapes me.

First of all I wasn't arguing if that's where you took the questioning
Second of all I ask because I have a dealer who told me my extended warranty will remain untouched after a Tune so I have requested it in writing from the dealership.

I just bought the car and have read hundreds of pages of whining and it seems that everyone is a damn expert over the next on the FP Tune. I can interpret the print on the FP Tune page and understand the FP warranty department will cover up to 3/36 but what about AFTER that... they still have to prove any Tune caused the issue so the whole FP Tune debate I have seen feels like a mute point since every tune would would need to be proved if what you're saying is correct. Correct me if I have misread what's been posted please

I'll share once I get the letter or refusal to write my letter

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[TheLion]

Engine, driveline and suspension concerns not caused by the use of Ford Performance or mountune parts remain eligible for
warranty coverage according to the terms of the New Vehicle Limited Warranty.

That's text straight from Ford Performance documentation regarding warranty impact of their equipment. By that language it could be argued that other after market modifications may also apply. Yes, each dealer is different in how much grief they may try to give you, however legally, at least with Ford Performance, they cannot win this particular argument and I really have a hard time believing if you present this documentation they would even dare try.

Usually dealerships in my experience, when confronted with actual proof, but also with humility and respect to them on your part (aka don't be the irate jacka**), will acquiesce to their obligations, at least related to warranty service. Also the types of modifications you do also have an impact. Inter coolers for example aren't power adders. It's added cooling. The user manual actually states that ALL cooling systems need to be UPGRADED for track use. An upgraded FMIC falls in line with a user manual recommendation, especially when combined with a Ford Performance calibration pushing more power through the engine. It doesn't alter boost, timing, fueling, or PCM function / safety's either.

The issues arise when using non warranted modifications, how those modifications affect the function of the vehicle and how a particular dealer perceives them. The Magnuson-Moss laws only apply to aftermarket OE replacements by the way (think auto-zone brand OE replacement struts being blamed on alignment issues for example because you didn't' use the Motorcraft / OE ones from the dealer). If you do a bit of searching, you can find actual legal explanations by specialty lawyers on these topics which clarify this. So after market parts the fundamentally alter the vehicles function are a grey area, making them high risk.

This thread, again, started by ME, is intended to be ALL things Ford Performance tune related. The PRIMARY reason I am using their software is to maintain the warranty for the first 36k / 3y. It's a good window for "sea trials" as it were to have confidence there are no factory defects which would otherwise have a high risk of being blamed on aftermarket performance modifications falling into the "grey area" category such as an after market tune or down pipe. One example is the gentlemen who had a cam bolt shear off recently at 18,000 miles and got stock footing the bill for a new engine. He was running several after market performance modifications, but one in particular threw up red flags for his dealership, a Cobb Stage 3 93 tune. He was denied warranty even though the cam bolt failure is a result of improper torquing or material defect. It's an extremely rare failure, first one I've ever seen documented in any ecoboost engine.

With Ford Performance software / CAI:

1. Your covered fully for at least the first 36k miles / 3 years regardless of how severe the failure or the cause (unless you perform other modifications which might be suspect). Your original new vehicle warranty is still also valid (aka the 60k power train warranty) if the failure is not deemed to be directly related to the modification.

2. The FP software pushes the engine harder than the factory software, so during that time you have increased the probability that any defects, if they exist will, manifest earlier on while its still covered, which is good as you would't want that to happen out of warranty where you then foot the bill. This is what I refer to as the "sea trials" period. It's not a breaking period as in establishing wear patterns and settling, but a stress test period to find manufacturing / assembly / materials flaws.

3. If the FP software is good enough for you, there's nothing wrong with just leaving the car at that, it's at least as fast as the brand new 2016 Camaro V8 A8 (13.5 quarter mile) if not a bit faster, but has been extensively tested over all the conditions the OE software expected to operate under reliably. Your added risk is extremely low. Ford Performance released a press article recently stating that after 60k miles, they did not find any signs of increased wear, which is an excellent sign for the long haul. There's lots of headroom in the Ecoboost 2.3L from the factory, but knowing where the upper limits are is where the R&D expertise and testing comes in.

Do I want to go back to the Livernois 91 tune? Absolutely, there's a very significant difference in performance between the two (plus I have more upgrade paths with Livernois in that I can use their high flow Down Pipe and 160F thermostat), but the Ford Performance tune is still a great upgrade and really how I expected the car to be from the factory. It's very daily drive able setup and has enough punch to at least make the car fun to drive (feels like an actual sports car) and competitive within its class.

Basically the Ford Performance tune upgrades your EB mustang (with an inter cooler) to match a stock WRX STi, stock Focus RS or 2016 Camaro V6 A8, all of which are significantly more expensive cars all without risking warranty repair issues within the first 36k miles. For $500 (levittown ford) that's a heck of an upgrade! Or if your like JBailer, it just makes the car far more predictable and usable. Lets face it, the factory PCM software is a significant flaw in this particular offering of the S550 Mustang. That and the inadequate inter cooler. Fix those two things and it's a world of difference. You go from being the slowest, most inconsistent and unsatisfying car of the above mentioned competitors to one of the best.

 

[Radiation Joe]

I apologize. I did take it as an argument. And I stuck my foot in my mouth with the original statement that purchasers of the Ford tune were giving up some of their factory warranty.

Now, I actually went back and read the Ford warranty information for these tunes. The 3/36 is for the parts associated with the tune. Nowhere does it say anything about changing the factory power train warranty. In fact, it says:

"Ford Motor Company, The American Road, Dearborn, MI 48025, provides a Limited Warranty on select Ford Performance Racing Parts and mountune® Performance Parts as described herein when installed on late model Ford vehicles. This warranty works in conjunction with -- and does not void -- the Manufacturer's New Vehicle Limited Warranty. It is valid for the original retail purchaser of the vehicle and is transferable to subsequent vehicle owners."​

 

[apx632]

You'll never win with these guys. You are correct. Burden of proof is on the dealer.

What people are missing here is that an aftermarket tune can not void your warranty under Magnuson-Moss. It has to be proven to have caused a covered failure. However, when you purchase a Ford Performance tune, you are explicitly giving up the factory warranty.

Fools and their money ...

Exactly right sir

 

[Rick B]

As I had reported in another thread I went to my dealer to have the tune installed Only to be turned away cause they didn't know how to install it.
So the tech at my Ford dealer called Ford Performance line and spoke with one of the Engineers. He in turn called me back in and installed the tune. In addition he handed me a thumb drive with a copy of of the stock tune. It cost me $90.40 (I already had installed the Ford CAI). Not a word was said about the CAI, and I was able to watch the complete installation of the tune. Cheap installation as compared as to what others have reported paying

 

[JonD]

My dealer will let me install my MIT pipe with green filter and only charge 1 shop hour of $80 for the actual Tune install which works for me

 

[jbailer]

My dealer will let me install my MIT pipe with green filter and only charge 1 shop hour of $80 for the actual Tune install which works for me

That's not bad at all. I figure they want an hour labor to do anything. It's a lot better than shops saying 2-3 hours labor for the whole thing. Especially when installing the tune took 16 minutes.

 

[JonD]

That's not bad at all. I figure they want an hour labor to do anything. It's a lot better than shops saying 2-3 hours labor for the whole thing. Especially when installing the tune took 16 minutes.

I thought that was a pretty good deal with all things considered.

FP did verify that if a dealership tells me the extended warranty up to 100k wouldn't be affected by the Tune that I need to get that on paper or else I'll be stuck at the 3/36 (although the dealership would need to prove the tune did something period).

This is our daily driver so if the dealership won't toss it on paper for me I'll have to decide if I want to skip a tune all together and just go full bolt on with items I can take off and leave no history to be questioned :shrug:

I sold my last car that was an 05 SRT-4 with a full AGP turbo kit and man that thing was a tank but lacked the electronic amenities these cars have so it was easy to mess with and they took mods like a champ

 

[jbailer]

I thought that was a pretty good deal with all things considered.

FP did verify that if a dealership tells me the extended warranty up to 100k wouldn't be affected by the Tune that I need to get that on paper or else I'll be stuck at the 3/36 (although the dealership would need to prove the tune did something period).

This is our daily driver so if the dealership won't toss it on paper for me I'll have to decide if I want to skip a tune all together and just go full bolt on with items I can take off and leave no history to be questioned :shrug:

I sold my last car that was an 05 SRT-4 with a full AGP turbo kit and man that thing was a tank but lacked the electronic amenities these cars have so it was easy to mess with and they took mods like a champ

I was in the same position. This is my only car so I have to depend on it for work. I bought the extended warranty when I purchased it, I think it was 6 years 100k miles. The only reason I went ahead and did the FP tune was I felt comfortable with the reliability and I have a feeling there's plenty of use for the warranty with things like my AC going out.

 

[JonD]

I was in the same position. This is my only car so I have to depend on it for work. I bought the extended warranty when I purchased it, I think it was 6 years 100k miles. The only reason I went ahead and did the FP tune was I felt comfortable with the reliability and I have a feeling there's plenty of use for the warranty with things like my AC going out.

That is a great point since there are so many items on these cars and for a daily driver it helps if something rediclous decides it wants to take a dive

 

[TheLion]

There you have it. Hopefully this issue can be laid to rest now. BTW anyone else do any instrumented testing?

I know one guy on there with a 3.15 Auto ran a best of 13.54. He does not have any other upgrades. I'm expecting to see FP tuned EB's with full bolt ons to run low 13's, maybe even eek into high 12's like some full bolt on Cobb Stage 1 cars have under the right conditions.

 

[JonD]

Once installed I will show some track times from Arizona (Junk 91 and VP blend) prior to adding the CP-e FMIC and Full-Race 3" TB

 

[jbailer]

Once installed I will show some track times from Arizona (Junk 91 and VP blend) prior to adding the CP-e FMIC and Full-Race 3" TB

Are you comfortable with adding the DP and not being able to tune for it? I thought tuners had said that at least if was an OR DP you needed to tune for it.

 

[JonD]

Are you comfortable with adding the DP and not being able to tune for it? I thought tuners had said that at least if was an OR DP you needed to tune for it.

After talking to my brother, tuner in AZ, there should be no reason the Tune couldn't adjust for the exhaust within a safe range.

I'll see if he can give me any more details

 

[jbailer]

After talking to my brother, tuner in AZ, there should be no reason the Tune couldn't adjust for the exhaust within a safe range.

I'll see if he can give me any more details

That would be awesome. If I remember right back in late 14 and early 15 when people were first modding they were having trouble when they added a ORDP. I remember one of the problems was exhaust smoking but I don't recall the technical details.

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