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BMR Tech Tip: Check those axle-to-spindle retaining nuts!

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TexasRebel

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Hope he answers, but here is my guess. Having never done this I can only guess the metric 31mm fits slightly tighter. 31mm is only 1/32" smaller than 1 1/4", so in SAE it would be a 1 7/32" socket which is pretty non standard unless your a master tool collector. Lots of time I switch back and forth between metric and standard as one usually fits tighter if I'm fighting a stubborn bolt. I haven't kept up with this posting has anyone mentioned what the thread size is, that would tell you if the factory wanted an SAE or metric socket on it.
Knowing that every other thread on the car is metric... I'll wager the lugs are, too.
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robwlf

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mines been clicking for a bit now . i pulled the tires checked the nuts.. they didnt budge one bit . checked for play and theres none. im at a loss lol .. im going to order 2 new axles nuts. replace and locktite them .. and when the weather breaks im going to get under it and check the ds nuts.. i rechecked most of the suspension stuff when i did springs. but it was doing it before i even did the springs
 

Bartly

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Knowing that every other thread on the car is metric... I'll wager the lugs are, too.
I think you are right, I had to go re-read some of this thread and there were two metric #s being thrown around. Sorry didn’t get far enough to see what the final answer was, too easily distracted.
 

moffetts

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mines been clicking for a bit now . i pulled the tires checked the nuts.. they didnt budge one bit . checked for play and theres none. im at a loss lol .. im going to order 2 new axles nuts. replace and locktite them .. and when the weather breaks im going to get under it and check the ds nuts.. i rechecked most of the suspension stuff when i did springs. but it was doing it before i even did the springs
Get a big piece of pipe and use it to get yourself more leverage on your breaker bar. There's "tight" and then there's "tight" when it comes to these things. You need to be basically fusing atoms together in order for them to be tight enough to not cause clicking and popping.
 

ronemca

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Get a big piece of pipe and use it to get yourself more leverage on your breaker bar. There's "tight" and then there's "tight" when it comes to these things. You need to be basically fusing atoms together in order for them to be tight enough to not cause clicking and popping.
In your mention of "these things" are you referring to the spindle retaining nuts? The 32mm ones that are the focus of this thread? Because if you are...

I heartily disagree with your counsel.

It's been offered more than once that the spec is 98 ft./lbs., and some have suggested and/or agreed with 150-ish. I haven't looked it up, so I am not in a position to say either is right or wrong, but atom-fusing tight - although an excellent & amusing analogy - is most certainly WRONG.

Does anyone have a screen-cap or a link that specifies the S550 rear spindle nut tightening spec, please?
 

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5.0_SD

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I downloaded most of the service manual, I will check tonight and post
Edit: Nevermind since [MENTION=17020]Lightning[/MENTION] posted
 
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Lightning

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In your mention of "these things" are you referring to the spindle retaining nuts? The 32mm ones that are the focus of this thread? Because if you are...

I heartily disagree with your counsel.

It's been offered more than once that the spec is 98 ft./lbs., and some have suggested and/or agreed with 150-ish. I haven't looked it up, so I am not in a position to say either is right or wrong, but atom-fusing tight - although an excellent & amusing analogy - is most certainly WRONG.

Does anyone have a screen-cap or a link that specifies the S550 rear spindle nut tightening spec, please?
Sure do
86A927FC-E693-4A81-8ACB-0BC1A1323249.jpeg
 

moffetts

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In your mention of "these things" are you referring to the spindle retaining nuts? The 32mm ones that are the focus of this thread? Because if you are...

I heartily disagree with your counsel.

It's been offered more than once that the spec is 98 ft./lbs., and some have suggested and/or agreed with 150-ish. I haven't looked it up, so I am not in a position to say either is right or wrong, but atom-fusing tight - although an excellent & amusing analogy - is most certainly WRONG.

Does anyone have a screen-cap or a link that specifies the S550 rear spindle nut tightening spec, please?
Yes. Disagree all you want, but 98 and even 150 is not tight enough. Not even close. I've seen 150 + 1/8 of a turn, which is kind of silly because that means the actual torque spec is higher than 150. Ford's spec is 98 + 1/8 of a turn, but damn if so many people aren't having trouble with the nuts coming loose....
 

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Fair enough - I am not attempting to be confrontational or disrespectful. But IMO [fasteners coming loose] and [insufficient tightness] are not synonymous.

IMO, it is possible to OVER-tighten most fasteners, and in most cases, this creates undesirable consequences. I firmly believe that this fastener is a perfect example.

Ideally, an achieved torque should "hold" in some manner - whether thru friction, threadlocker or a cotter pin - as opposed to simply and arbitrarily ADDING torque. What if it seemed to loosen at 166 ft./lbs.? Would the answer be to tighten to 175? 195? And if it seemed to loosen again? Then 225? 360? How far would you go? And how would/could you measure & monitor the effects on the underlying bearing?

You're going to say "Oh - that's just being silly." And you'd be right. But the premise of consistency and repeatability and stress-resistance and shear and a whole raft of additional parameters (that I won't claim to grasp) is involved. And getting a bigger hammer is not the solution.
 
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moffetts

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Fair enough - I am not attempting to be confrontational or disrespectful. But IMO [fasteners coming loose] and [insufficient tightness] are not synonymous.

IMO, it is possible to OVER-tighten most fasteners, and in most cases, this creates undesirable consequences. I firmly believe that this fastener is a perfect example.

Ideally, an achieved torque should be "held" in some manner...rather than simply and arbitrarily ADDING torque. What if it seemed to loosen at 166 ft./lbs.? Would the answer be to tighten to 175? 195? And if it seemed to loosen again? Then 225? 360? How far would you go? And how would/could you measure & monitor the effects on the underlying bearing?

You're going to say "Oh - that's just being silly." And you'd be right. But the premise of consistency and repeatability and stress-resistance and shear and a whole raft of additional parameters (that I won't claim to grasp) is involved. And getting a bigger hammer is not the solution.
I agree that there is a limit and that there should be a mechanical way to hold the nuts in place like there is on so many other vehicles. In the absence of drilling out the half shafts to install a cotter pin (for example) the best we can do is torque them down (north of 250 ft lbs, in my experience) and use loctite on them. Mine need 250 + 1/8 of a turn for them to not click and clink. I wish I could give a more concise number for what has worked for me, but my wrench doesn't go past 250.
 

ctandc72

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In your mention of "these things" are you referring to the spindle retaining nuts? The 32mm ones that are the focus of this thread? Because if you are...

I heartily disagree with your counsel.

It's been offered more than once that the spec is 98 ft./lbs., and some have suggested and/or agreed with 150-ish. I haven't looked it up, so I am not in a position to say either is right or wrong, but atom-fusing tight - although an excellent & amusing analogy - is most certainly WRONG.

Does anyone have a screen-cap or a link that specifies the S550 rear spindle nut tightening spec, please?
The torque spec from Ford is essentially USELESS since they SPECIFY to add 45 degrees AFTER torque is reached. My brand new '17 (with @ 2K miles at the time) one of the axle nuts was not even close to 100 ft/lbs when I removed the axles to replace the 3.15 pumpkin with a 3.55 pumpkin. I broke one side loose with a 1/2 ratchet and almost whacked my head into the car it gave so fast. Not so with the other side.

I went 100 ft/lbs then added 45 degrees. Brand new nuts from Ford that already had loctite applied. No noises or issues the last 3.5K miles.
 

robwlf

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from the video i seen on cjpp he did 98ft lbs then went a 1/4 turn after .. also ive read a few other forums and some mech i know that work at ford they said they also do 98ft lbs then go at least a 1/4 to a half turn.. they also said popping and clicking when going from reverse to drive(or 1st) could be a sign of a bad wheel bearing even if there isnt play...
so i think im going to get a new bearing for my drivers side
(one clicking) and nut for each side and use the locktite on both nuts,then go to at least 125ft lbs
 

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I replaced a bearing that was clicking and had no play and the new one clicked too. The nut wasn’t tight enough to begin with and I didn’t tighten it enough after I replaced it. Don’t make the same mistake I did.
 

robwlf

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I replaced a bearing that was clicking and had no play and the new one clicked too. The nut wasn’t tight enough to begin with and I didn’t tighten it enough after I replaced it. Don’t make the same mistake I did.
damn maybe ill just get a new nut first and try that.. thats a easy and cheap process of elimination i guess
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