So the new gen7 whipple numbers are out........

[Jasonb543]

I just seen aikens car posting 5 second 60-130s with a stickshift. Pretty damn impressive for off the shelf and no custom tuning.

Waiting for kits to actually ship before I just blindly give them my money… and now want to see how the new procharger kits do… P1x probably all I need… make the 10r80 last a lot longer on a centri…maybe D1X who knows.

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[Angrey]

I just seen aikens car posting 5 second 60-130s with a stickshift. Pretty damn impressive for off the shelf and no custom tuning.

Waiting for kits to actually ship before I just blindly give them my money… and now want to see how the new procharger kits do… P1x probably all I need… make the 10r80 last a lot longer on a centri…maybe D1X who knows.

The 60-130 is highly dependent upon traction and suspension setup (and his interest in R/D and sales on the matter) because it's a speed to speed calculation.

The true true is trap speeds or speed achieved over a distance, which combined with the vehicle weight is a pretty tried and true estimate of how much power the vehicle is putting to the ground over the course of a run.

I've contended and I still do that if you put the same amount of energy into a Gen3, you'll get the same/similar outcomes.

Take a gen3 coyote, put on headers, dope the F out of the fuel and put on decent mods for traction and it'll dip into the 5's as well.

And remember, the improvements for that car from this point are very incremental. That's getting close to the best that car is ever going to be, with max effort. Might see some better times with hero DA and temps, but otherwise, that's it. They're out of bullets other than stripping it down to a rattle trap. For a "full weight" street car, to run basically 6 flat, it's pretty impressive. But not so much as to pay significantly more for it over a gen3 which isn't just as capable, is more capable because you can turn it up from there.

 

[Rolls]

Imagine putting your $$ down for one of these kits last year and still being told they aren't going to ship until the end of June

Upset for sure, though most the time things our out of peoples hands. You can yell and scream as much as you want but if coking coal mine shut down and there is a shortage of steel etc, shit happens sometimes!

 

[robvas]

I just seen aikens car posting 5 second 60-130s with a stickshift. Pretty damn impressive for off the shelf and no custom tuning.

Where does this stuff get posted? Instagram? Tiktok? Facebook?

I don't really go anywhere online that's Mustang-related except forums, so I wouldn't mind seeing stuff from other places. There are only a handful of people that post stuff like that here (and they do a great job of it).

 

[sms2022]

Another small shop I follow on Instagram hit 800 wheel with a whipple kit on his S650 just posted this weekend. Numbers are looking good finally!

 

[Angrey]

Another small shop I follow on Instagram hit 800 wheel with a whipple kit on his S650 just posted this weekend. Numbers are looking good finally!

It's not apples to apples. That's the point.

Take a gen3, let whipple use the same calibration, the same modifications (headers and fuel additives) and dyno it and voila, you'll almost assuredly end up with the same or very similar numbers.

There's no free lunch here. You can't take the SAME volume motor, the SAME compression, and the SAME fuel and end up with a drastically different outcome.

Is there some incremental improvements with the blower? Sure. Maybe some incremental improvements over having better uptake (with dual inlets) but you can't outsmart physics. A 307 inch V-8 at 12:1 compression on pump 93 will yield a BMEP at max effort before it runs into knock. And that holds true whether it's a centrifugal or a turbo or a PD blower. There's only SO MUCH that you can squeeze out of a coyote on pump 93 before it knocks.

Furthermore, as pointed out above, some of it is ARTIFICIAL. Meaning if the calibration is DIFFERENT when the rear wheels are spinning than on the street where that's not the case, then you end up with a situation where it's a dyno hero and the number (while shiny and attractive) is actually false.

The point is, if you apply the SAME efforts to the gen3, you'll be right in the same ballpark.

And THAT is what "they" don't want everyone to realize. They're banking on masses believing this is some sorta grand upgrade. Otherwise why would anyone spend $10k-$50k more for a new mode+whipple when they can get the SAME outcome (or better with open tune) on a gen3.

Sure there's gonna be those that just want the latest thing, but the long and short of it is that MOST of all this is hype and creative marketing.

 

[Jasonb543]

Where does this stuff get posted? Instagram? Tiktok? Facebook?

I don't really go anywhere online that's Mustang-related except forums, so I wouldn't mind seeing stuff from other places. There are only a handful of people that post stuff like that here (and they do a great job of it).

He posts on his personal page and posts also on the dragy page.

 

[sms2022]

It's not apples to apples. That's the point.

Take a gen3, let whipple use the same calibration, the same modifications (headers and fuel additives) and dyno it and voila, you'll almost assuredly end up with the same or very similar numbers.

There's no free lunch here. You can't take the SAME volume motor, the SAME compression, and the SAME fuel and end up with a drastically different outcome.

Is there some incremental improvements with the blower? Sure. Maybe some incremental improvements over having better uptake (with dual inlets) but you can't outsmart physics. A 307 inch V-8 at 12:1 compression on pump 93 will yield a BMEP at max effort before it runs into knock. And that holds true whether it's a centrifugal or a turbo or a PD blower. There's only SO MUCH that you can squeeze out of a coyote on pump 93 before it knocks.

Furthermore, as pointed out above, some of it is ARTIFICIAL. Meaning if the calibration is DIFFERENT when the rear wheels are spinning than on the street where that's not the case, then you end up with a situation where it's a dyno hero and the number (while shiny and attractive) is actually false.

The point is, if you apply the SAME efforts to the gen3, you'll be right in the same ballpark.

And THAT is what "they" don't want everyone to realize. They're banking on masses believing this is some sorta grand upgrade. Otherwise why would anyone spend $10k-$50k more for a new mode+whipple when they can get the SAME outcome (or better with open tune) on a gen3.

Sure there's gonna be those that just want the latest thing, but the long and short of it is that MOST of all this is hype and creative marketing.

Yeah I’m in agreement with you. Never said anything about that. Just pointing out that the shops are finally getting the whipple s650s to S550 numbers.

 

[Jasonb543]

The point is, if you apply the SAME efforts to the gen3, you'll be right in the same ballpark.

Doesn’t matter at all…. Gen 3 is the OLD SHIT.

We’re on the NEW SHIT.
Gen 3 may as well be a model T at this point.

 

[Angrey]

Doesn’t matter at all…. Gen 3 is the OLD SHIT.

We’re on the NEW SHIT.
Gen 3 may as well be a model T at this point.

You're probably one of those type of people that stands in line at the Apple store for the unveiling of the new Iphone 14 to blindly pay $1200 more for the "new shit." Never questioning whether it's worth the extra money over the Iphone13.

 

[sms2022]

You're probably one of those type of people that stands in line at the Apple store for the unveiling of the new Iphone 14 to blindly pay $1200 more for the "new shit." Never questioning whether it's worth the extra money over the Iphone13.

Living up to the username lol

 

[Angrey]

Living up to the username lol

I mean what'd you expect, he just compared the S550 to the Model T.

 

[engineermike]

@Angrey for once, I agree with everything you posted in #201. Whipple is running a little more boost and a lot more timing on what amounts to the same engine as gen3.

Are they running it all the time or just on the dyno? I don’t know.

Is there some improvement to knock monitoring and response in the gen3(.5) s650? I’m not sure. What I can say is the knock sensor part number is the same. In the tune, the s650 at first pass appears to have more aggressive knock sensing and response parameters but I haven’t seen a Whipple cal to compare.

Otherwise they’re basically just running it closer to the edge at least on these dyno pulls.

 

[Angrey]

@Angrey for once, I agree with everything you posted in #201. Whipple is running a little more boost and a lot more timing on what amounts to the same engine as gen3.

Are they running it all the time or just on the dyno? I don’t know.

Is there some improvement to knock monitoring and response in the gen3(.5) s650? I’m not sure. What I can say is the knock sensor part number is the same. In the tune, the s650 at first pass appears to have more aggressive knock sensing and response parameters but I haven’t seen a Whipple cal to compare.

Otherwise they’re basically just running it closer to the edge at least on these dyno pulls.

I was going to write that it's trading more risk for more output, but you bring up an interesting aspect.

Being VERY GRACIOUS HERE, maybe they've figured out a way to safely creep further up to the limits of 93 (with a different or more sophisticated knock strategy) but with them doping the **** out of the fuel, any evaluation or sense of that is gone.

And to be honest, I have to tip my hats to them. It's working. Half the mustang community is convinced it's a marked shift/improvement. So it's kinda hard to argue with their results. They've got enough people fooled and so right or wrong, the outcome speaks for itself.

 

[robvas]

He posts on his personal page and posts also on the dragy page.

"Page" being where?

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