GT350 vs 2017 ZL1

[thePill]

Do you have doubts that the Camaro weighs what Chevy says it would too?

Honestly, the decision to use a 111 inch wheelbase was the beginning of the end. Any idiot knows you can't do anything with a full-Size wheelbase. Ask the BMW people. Once you go that large, the only ways to save weight is exotic materials OR, removing structural support. Chevy took the easy way out and deleted metal... yet still charge upwards for the "lightest in class" :lol:

Wait I'm not done...

Chevy really couldn't afford to engineer a convertible or HALO reinforcement into the car. Remember thePill reported the target MSRP windows? Remember the drastic shift in 2SS MSRP? Content went from 1SS to 2SS... I'm not even sure I care what went where. By the time I figure it out the Camaro will be gone. The window was $36,500-$38,000 for the 1SS AND, I was told for a matter of fact, by MANY C5 members that the 2SS wouldn't go over $39,995... well... no... content was shifted to the 2SS so the 1SS could weigh close to 3700lbs.

Some content was deleted altogether and won't show up until the 1LE is released. Some of 2SS and 1LE standard equipment was intended for the 1SS. Funny though, the marketing hasn't changed its time to reflect the quiet changes :lol:

I mentioned this desperate move a while back and openly admitted that even GM wasn't that stupid... well, unfortunately... You would think if it's standard practice in the Corvette then it's standard everywhere. I think they would rather you pay for the things other manufacturers already offer standard. In some cases, like the very valuable vert reinforcement, has been removed altogether.

Another concern about a shorter wheelbase is the engines height. The engine in the 6th Gen Camaro apparently sits higher than the 5th Gen. C&D reported that the Camaro's CoG was an inch higher than last gen :lol:

Damned if you do... :lol:

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[thePill]

TL;DR more made up misinformation. (Outside of lower sales, although they still haven't released the 4-banger. Not sure if that will help though. Time will tell.)

ThePill also had a feeling that the Camaro wouldn't weigh what it did.

You read it just as you have read everything thePill writes.

thePill also had a feeling Chevy wouldn't be foolish enough to remove actual structure to save weight :lol: but that was incorrect as well.

Back when thePill reported the SS would use the 13.79 inch rotors from a Caddy SUV, people blew up. They will never make them that small :lol: In order to save more weight, it went down to 13.6.

Understand, not only will the 2SS and 1LE weight become standard, so will the MSRP.

The 6th Gen flopped right out of the gate. All of the poor decisions made regarding the Camaro reflect in the sales numbers. It wasn't worth it in my opinion. Once the Camaro gets rubber under it, the structure won't be able to take it... Chevy caused that when then put a 450hp engine on a chassis built for an Inline 4 and only use sub-frame connectors for rigidity.

It won't be very long before someone finds out the 2016 Camaro SS has a cooling issue...

That's funny :lol: Motor Trend never said anything about engine temperatures. They praised the 2010 SS in 2009... for handling...


...then in 2015 they bash the vehicle... about its handling :lol:


Another honest moment:

The ATS-V that Motor Trend said would destroy everything on the road? The few that attended SCCA Open at Pitt didn't do very well. It's an amazing feat that always seems to happen.

 

[thePill]

Both the Mustang and Corvette could save around 100lbs if they removed valuable parts of the structure. They would probably be cheaper too...

...but why? It's 2016 not 2006. If you removed those structural ties from the Corvette, it would be a floppy PoS. Even with a 107 inch wheelbase like the Mustang, it would be no better than the S197.

...and it kills me that Chevy rapes its most loyal by inflating the MSRP like greedy a$$h@ts.

It's a shared chassis including front and rear suspension. Shared drivetrains... They may of had a shot at competing dollar for dollar with the Mustang. Even if it did win races with its PtW ratio and is not nearly as attractive as the others in its class...

Fumble yet again. Real talk though, this sh!t needs changed by next year.

 

[Childs Play]

Both the Mustang and Corvette could save around 100lbs if they removed valuable parts of the structure. They would probably be cheaper too...

...but why? It's 2016 not 2006. If you removed those structural ties from the Corvette, it would be a floppy PoS. Even with a 107 inch wheelbase like the Mustang, it would be no better than the S197.

...and it kills me that Chevy rapes its most loyal by inflating the MSRP like greedy a$$h@ts.

It's a shared chassis including front and rear suspension. Shared drivetrains... They may of had a shot at competing dollar for dollar with the Mustang. Even if it did win races with its PtW ratio and is not nearly as attractive as the others in its class...

Fumble yet again. Real talk though, this sh!t needs changed by next year.

Serious question. Where do you get your weed from..?

 

[thePill]

Serious question. Where do you get your weed from..?

United States Government :lol: Are we not friends on FB?


You are aware that support can be gutted out too... but the Mustang and Corvette performances would suffer greatly.

It's not even a great task if you think about it. Most support probably comes as additional layers of sheet metal. The Mustang has a visible cross bar behind the seat... I think the Camaro is a straight shot.

This is the platform they needed in 2006... now that it's here, it's just slightly outdated. There was no sane way of making a 3700lbs SS... unless you actually remove hard structure completely. Right now the Convertible Camaro is just a chop top... only the sub-frame connectors hold it together.

 

[200MPHCOBRA]

1LE is going to need bigger wheels, bigger tires, bigger brakes, chassis support and probably coolers. Me thinks its going to gain weight over the SS.

All that above and a blower for a ZL1, more weight. And then getting punched out immediately by the 18 GT500. Be it V6 or V8.

 

[Childs Play]

1LE is going to need bigger wheels, bigger tires, bigger brakes, chassis support and probably coolers. Me thinks its going to gain weight over the SS.

All that above and a blower for a ZL1, more weight. And then getting punched out immediately by the 18 GT500. Be it V6 or V8.

I'm definitely interested in seeing what becomes of the next gen GT500. Should be pretty impressive.

As far as a weight gain for the 1LE. It may gain a bit. Breaks may be the 6 pot standard. Not sure.

I think the 5th gen 1LE gained... 100 lbs? That's a bad guess from using Google.

 

[thePill]

1LE is going to need bigger wheels, bigger tires, bigger brakes, chassis support and probably coolers. Me thinks its going to gain weight over the SS.

All that above and a blower for a ZL1, more weight. And then getting punched out immediately by the 18 GT500. Be it V6 or V8.

The brakes on the hot list were the 14.6 inch rotors up front. I need to look around and see what's been used in the rear. The tire issue could have been solved if they didn't settle for a p@ssy track width. Once you factor in the Full size wheelbase, the track width is inadequate. It will take more than a 285mm and a 14.6 rotor on the front to handle a GT350 in any form.

The 62 inch track was a horrible idea. That's another measurement thePill said Chevy would NEVER go as low as...

...yet here we are... waaaaaaaaaay under world class.

 

[Childs Play]

The brakes on the hot list were the 14.6 inch rotors up front. I need to look around and see what's been used in the rear. The tire issue could have been solved if they didn't settle for a p@ssy track width. Once you factor in the Full size wheelbase, the track width is inadequate. It will take more than a 285mm and a 14.6 rotor on the front to handle a GT350 in any form.



The 62 inch track was a horrible idea. That's another measurement thePill said Chevy would NEVER go as low as...



...yet here we are... waaaaaaaaaay under world class.

So since the SS outperforms the GT in stock form would you say the GT is even further under world class.....?

 

[200MPHCOBRA]

I'm definitely interested in seeing what becomes of the next gen GT500. Should be pretty impressive.

As far as a weight gain for the 1LE. It may gain a bit. Breaks may be the 6 pot standard. Not sure.

I think the 5th gen 1LE gained... 100 lbs? That's a bad guess from using Google.

100 sounds about right.

 

[5.0 435]

Chevy needs to focus on selling 6th Gen Camaro's in general.

Last generation the Zeta platform wasn't rigid enough for 580hp. I'm not convinced the Alpha is going to do a better job with more power. I have serious doubts Chevy will ever handle a GT350 period...

The CTS-V handles it just right unless you have been living under a rock. Good to see you back. The Camaro guys were worried about your where abouts.
You are really a hit over there !!!!
Keep up the great entertainment.

 

[200MPHCOBRA]

The brakes on the hot list were the 14.6 inch rotors up front. I need to look around and see what's been used in the rear. The tire issue could have been solved if they didn't settle for a p@ssy track width. Once you factor in the Full size wheelbase, the track width is inadequate. It will take more than a 285mm and a 14.6 rotor on the front to handle a GT350 in any form.

The 62 inch track was a horrible idea. That's another measurement thePill said Chevy would NEVER go as low as...

...yet here we are... waaaaaaaaaay under world class.

I don't think it will keep up with a 350 either. But I'm holding out for a 500.

 

[thePill]

The CTS-V handles it just right unless you have been living under a rock. Good to see you back. The Camaro guys were worried about your where abouts.
You are really a hit over there !!!!

thePill has been kinda, after I celebrated my birthday I started another project while I recovered. This was the last time I will need to do this because now, I am 100% retired. I was walking very well by Thanksgiving so, it wasn't as bad as the last time. Anyway, I put most of my work or at least what I'm doing on FB. There are at least two dozen M6G members that are also FB friends. I'm not totally sure they still post here... I seen Voodoo... He's an expert in physical mass. Most of my recovery programs are posted up for critique. I'm a little more indy now.

I will not return to Automotive... it's just something thePill had to do without. I am working on seat time every opportunity l get but I will never be full time.

We are shopping for a GT350 or maybe a GT500. However, I need to return to my 2014 form before I get approval. I need a manual and since retirement, it gives me something to motivate me... I return to the gym this month, I could be running an event by summer if I bust my a$$. I need to sustain 7-15 laps and it's far from my recent performance on any track.

 

[Cashcow]

ZL1 debuts in 2 days. https://www.facebook.com/chevycamaro .

 

[Childs Play]

ZL1 debuts in 2 days. https://www.facebook.com/chevycamaro .

If they address the overheating issues it should be a great car. Should be a great car anyway if you don't plan on tracking it and just having some spirited driving time on the street.

Most people who buy one won't track it, so the overheating issues aren't going to be a concern for most people if they still show their ugly face, but for track days it's maddening when it happens. Although then others would say "Why are you buying an automatic for track days?"

Guess time will tell how this pans out.

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