TR3160 Manual transmission “grind” going into 5th, hard going into 3rd

[involutions]

I’ve driven two Mach 1s. The first one had a minor “grind” going into 5th, with 3,200 miles on it. It wasn’t a full on grind, but more like the teeth on the synchros banged into each other one time as they were aligning and engaging. I chocked that up to the transmission just not being fully broken in yet.

The other is the car I bought. Same feeling, only in 5th gear (unless it’s cold outside, in which case It does it in 4th until things get warmed up.).

With 6,000 miles on it, it does this about 1 out of every 5 shifts into 5th gear. So 20% of the time. The rest of the time it goes right in no problem.

When the transmission is cold (again, cold day, before engine and transmission are warmed up, upshifting and downshifting into 3rd is almost impossible. Once it warms up, it’s much easier, but noticeably more difficult than the other gears.

I’d think with this many miles on the car this should all have smoothed out.

Anyone have similar experience? Will this get better or should I chock it up to another “normal” mustang trait? I would never entertain having the dealer attempt to fix this.

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[Hack]

I would have the dealer look at it.

There's a problem in my opinion. The Tremec is a little cold-blooded, and not as smooth shifting at the MT-82, but it should at least always go into the gears. The little notchiness in 5th sounds normal-ish to me, but the 3rd gear stuff you are saying should never happen.

I'm assuming that you aren't talking about trying to slam it into gear as fast as you can at the rev limit, but rather just normal street driving. If you are pushing it, it's entirely possible to miss 3rd gear. I've done it before, but it wasn't the transmission. Just user error, not getting it quite right.

The 3160 isn't as smooth as the MT82, unless it's very warm. It works great on the track, but not always so much on the street. I found when I bought my GT350 I had to slow down my shifts and be more deliberate compared to when I was using the MT82.

 

[Prodigal]

Mine doesn’t exhibit any of those behaviors. I don’t drive it in cold temp so I can’t say if that’s the issue but I suspect not. Get it looked at for sure.

 

[IPOGT]

My trans was occasionally weird that way from the beginning and slowly got better until now at nearly 4K miles, it’s finally nice.

 

[involutions]

Just to clarify, no I'm not slamming it into gear, nor am I shifting at 7500RPM. In fact, the more aggressive I am (or even, the less aggressive I am) the better it shifts into 5th. When I'm just driving normally, that's when I get the issue. Most of the time it goes right in nicely. Hoping this clears up with use.

I won't bother with the dealer because, based on experience for various issued at various dealerships (also as a former mechanic) the end result would be one of two responses:
#1 "We couldn't duplicate the problem; or
#2 "This is a normal characteristic"

I also don't want my car tied up for 3 months while they train their level C mechanic (who I envision as a student at the local high school) on how to R&R synchros.

The 3rd gear issue doesn't bother me because after the engine reaches temp the problem mostly goes away. More worried about the 5th gear. But I do find it odd. Otherwise, I have to push really hard, or simply skip 3rd.

Agreed, the MT82 from my 2015 GT is much easier to shift. The TR3160 feels more like the 1960s pickup truck we had on the farm. I like the solid feel of most shifts, but wouldn't mind if it was a little easier.

 

[IPOGT]

Never having an MT-82, I will say I remember my RX-7 being a lot nicer shifting overall feel, but now after break in can’t really say I have any complaints.
Do people think the GT350 feels better?

 

[Bugs]

The TR-3160 transmission on my '19 GT350 was smooth as butter till at about 15K miles when 5th gear started grinding when engaged. 5th gear synchro was failing. See post. Dealership replaced 5th and 6th synchro's, gears and related parts under warranty. Been working fine since then.

 

[involutions]

The TR-3160 transmission on my '19 GT350 was smooth as butter till at about 15K miles when 5th gear started grinding when engaged. 5th gear synchro was failing. See post. Dealership replaced 5th and 6th synchro's, gears and related parts under warranty. Been working fine since then.

I won't let my dealer work on the car unless it's an easy fix. They took a month to replace the clutch under warranty after two years of telling me the clunking noise was "normal" after several trips to the shop where they "could not duplicate complaint". Finally the disc material on one side disintegrated, and locked the disk to the pressure plate. Then they agreed I may have a problem. While the car was there they put an 8" scratch across the panted section of the splitter.

 

[Skye]

Mine can be a bit of diva when cold, but no problems once warmed up. The transmission has continued to get smoother as the smiles have increased.

I remembered one or two threads, so I did a Google search, here:

https://www.google.com/search?q=mus...HRlYCtEQrQIoBHoECCAQBQ&biw=1466&bih=743&dpr=2

This one is interesting though. Just refreshing myself with it now:

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/tremec-shifter-into-5th-not-smooth.194376/

Whatever happens, Good Luck.

 

[Hack]

I won't let my dealer work on the car unless it's an easy fix. They took a month to replace the clutch under warranty after two years of telling me the clunking noise was "normal" after several trips to the shop where they "could not duplicate complaint". Finally the disc material on one side disintegrated, and locked the disk to the pressure plate. Then they agreed I may have a problem. While the car was there they put an 8" scratch across the panted section of the splitter.

It's possible that the problems you are experiencing have something to do with the clutch. It might be worth the time to at least thoroughly bleed the slave cylinder and do the vacuum process that Ford recommends.

Otherwise, I myself wouldn't bother R&Ring the transmission for this. I would drive until it gets really bad before going through all the effort to rebuild it. I've done some transmission rebuilds before, and it's a lot of work.

 

[involutions]

Mine can be a bit of diva when cold, but no problems once warmed up. The transmission has continued to get smoother as the smiles have increased.

I remembered one or two threads, so I did a Google search, here:

https://www.google.com/search?q=mus...HRlYCtEQrQIoBHoECCAQBQ&biw=1466&bih=743&dpr=2

This one is interesting though. Just refreshing myself with it now:

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/tremec-shifter-into-5th-not-smooth.194376/

Whatever happens, Good Luck.

Thanks for digging that info up for me. I poked around google as well, but you really found more Han I did. Hopefully it will smooth up.

 

[WItoTX]

Swap fluids, see if it goes away. I never had this issue, and I'm not easy on my car. I also don't live in the cold, and it's rare to see a day below 50 degrees.

 

[Mach1Kid96]

So this is a topic that crosses my mind every time I drive mine. I'll preface my notes by saying I have an MGW shifter & Motul ATF VI fluid in it right now. Otherwise, everything else is stock. Here's some notes on my experience with my TR-3160 (I have about 26000 miles on my car):

• 5th gear does have a "bite" to it when normal street driving. If I go fast with moving the shifter and just aim it at the far corner of 5th, it will "bite" and you can feel it clear as day in the shifter. If I am very deliberate and "guide" the shifter to 5th, it's almost non-existent.
• 99% of the time under heavy load, 5th doesn't bite at all. Usually after putting the hammer down in any gear and getting everything hot (after the CHT is at operating temp), 5th won't bite under normal driving conditions again for a little while, but it will come back.
• 3rd gear can be hard to get into when the transmission is cold. Mine isn't impossible, but it almost feels like the gate is more narrow (i.e. I have to be much more precise and use a little more force for it to get into 3rd). Usually it goes away after a few shifts. Honestly, it only becomes a problem for me when I'm not paying closer attention to shifting when cold and I meet the gate but don't go into gear and start to let the clutch out.
• 3rd gear also has a "bite" to it as well if I just quickly put it there. It's always been that way since day 1. Under hard acceleration, it doesn't happen nearly as often.
• When shifting into 3rd, with the clutch fully on the floor and no throttle, the car does clunk and somewhat kinda bump forward (you can definitely hear it).
• When shifting from 6th to 5th or from 4th to 3rd, I never ever have a "bite". It's only on the 2nd to 3rd or 4th to 5th shift.
• Another peculiar note is if I go on a mild incline or decline in the car, the shifting becomes like glass for maybe 30 seconds. All gears just glide and grab like a dream (I wish it stayed that way).

My last note would make me think that the fluid is low due to it moving around and getting where the transmission needs it. However, I have gone through the process of getting the car up in the air on jack stands and getting it perfectly balanced with the transmission 100% level (I had put a digital angle finder on the drain plug). After that, I filled the transmission with Motul ATF VI which fits the Ford spec fluid and followed the drain and fill procedures. I have checked the fluid twice and each time I take the fill plug out, a thin stream comes out so I know it should be full. So I'm not sure why the angle of the car makes it shift more smooth for a little bit.

For the MGW shifter install, to make sure the trans wasn't misaligned and causing these issues, I've "neutralized" the trans numerous times with the car 100% level on jack stands.

I've tried Redline D4 in the transmission and it didn't really make much of a difference. I also live in the southern US and don't see extremely cold temps also.

Lastly, I did have to change my clutch master cylinder a month ago due to my clutch pedal being spongy after the car would sit for a while. No bleeding or pumping it would fix it and I would have to lift the pedal sometimes after driving off. After changing that out, the car was back to normal, but still shifted with the same characteristics as above.

I've always wondered if I should take it in...

 

[involutions]

So this is a topic that crosses my mind every time I drive mine. I'll preface my notes by saying I have an MGW shifter & Motul ATF VI fluid in it right now. Otherwise, everything else is stock. Here's some notes on my experience with my TR-3160 (I have about 26000 miles on my car):

• 5th gear does have a "bite" to it when normal street driving. If I go fast with moving the shifter and just aim it at the far corner of 5th, it will "bite" and you can feel it clear as day in the shifter. If I am very deliberate and "guide" the shifter to 5th, it's almost non-existent.
• 99% of the time under heavy load, 5th doesn't bite at all. Usually after putting the hammer down in any gear and getting everything hot (after the CHT is at operating temp), 5th won't bite under normal driving conditions again for a little while, but it will come back.
• 3rd gear can be hard to get into when the transmission is cold. Mine isn't impossible, but it almost feels like the gate is more narrow (i.e. I have to be much more precise and use a little more force for it to get into 3rd). Usually it goes away after a few shifts. Honestly, it only becomes a problem for me when I'm not paying closer attention to shifting when cold and I meet the gate but don't go into gear and start to let the clutch out.
• 3rd gear also has a "bite" to it as well if I just quickly put it there. It's always been that way since day 1. Under hard acceleration, it doesn't happen nearly as often.
• When shifting into 3rd, with the clutch fully on the floor and no throttle, the car does clunk and somewhat kinda bump forward (you can definitely hear it).
• When shifting from 6th to 5th or from 4th to 3rd, I never ever have a "bite". It's only on the 2nd to 3rd or 4th to 5th shift.
• Another peculiar note is if I go on a mild incline or decline in the car, the shifting becomes like glass for maybe 30 seconds. All gears just glide and grab like a dream (I wish it stayed that way).

My last note would make me think that the fluid is low due to it moving around and getting where the transmission needs it. However, I have gone through the process of getting the car up in the air on jack stands and getting it perfectly balanced with the transmission 100% level (I had put a digital angle finder on the drain plug). After that, I filled the transmission with Motul ATF VI which fits the Ford spec fluid and followed the drain and fill procedures. I have checked the fluid twice and each time I take the fill plug out, a thin stream comes out so I know it should be full. So I'm not sure why the angle of the car makes it shift more smooth for a little bit.

For the MGW shifter install, to make sure the trans wasn't misaligned and causing these issues, I've "neutralized" the trans numerous times with the car 100% level on jack stands.

I've tried Redline D4 in the transmission and it didn't really make much of a difference. I also live in the southern US and don't see extremely cold temps also.

Lastly, I did have to change my clutch master cylinder a month ago due to my clutch pedal being spongy after the car would sit for a while. No bleeding or pumping it would fix it and I would have to lift the pedal sometimes after driving off. After changing that out, the car was back to normal, but still shifted with the same characteristics as above.

I've always wondered if I should take it in...

Thanks for the detailed write-up. I guess mine is about average.

 

[Ron]

Without removing the trans, the issue appears to have been created by someone who treats the 'H' shift pattern as an 'N' shift pattern. Very common w/'speed' or 'power' shifted transmissions. And it doesn't make any difference if it's a '65 Mustang 3-spd or a current Mach 1 w/a Tremec. You can stall the takeout by not abusing the trans, but, at some point. it's gonna need a rebuild.

NOTE: All the metal that is 'ground' off those synchro rings is contaminating the fluid which, in turn, will ultimately affect other moving parts w/in the trans.

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