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Throttle House puts the 2020 GT500, Camaro ZL1 and Challenger Hellcat Redeye on the track

Tomster

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Noone argues opinion, they argue numbers, so as long as he sandbags and lets the numbers show a lesser car is "faster" hes biased hired propaganda to me.

I said it months ago, The driver in him loves the 500. The accountant in him loves the camaro
He said it himself, he's cheap.
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9secondko

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Mismatched tires is a better than stock mod? We can’t even tell if it is Cup 2s or PSS/PS4S for sure. Either way even if it is Cup 2s, they are sounding more like that is a downgrade if anything from the stock 3Rs. Also, if you want to go by the pic, the tires on the 500 don’t look that bad. We’ve all seen much much worse at track days.
Not. Stock. More than likely an upgrade. Don’t know anyone who downgrades. Lol. Enough said.

Mismatched means nothing. If you upgrade the front tires but leave the rears alone or vice versa, it's still and upgrade. Or if you upgrade both front and back with different levels of upgrade - you guessed it - still an upgrade.

and the 500 tires were bad.

Just because you may have seen some people wearing them down even further in your visits to the track, that has nothing to do when you are comparing each cars performance vs the other.
Come on man. You know better.
 
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Classic Lover

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Manual zl1 1le went 7:16 at the ring, it’s just a very very good track car. Yes the CFTP is going to be faster on many tracks but let’s be honest, you aren’t going to crush the 1le with a front engine 4000 lbs sports car, a little faster yes, crushed no. The cars are pretty close in performance, there is only so much you can do with this kind of setup. The Chevy has a rock solid track suspension and no compromise setup. All around the GT500 is much better. However let’s be honest the cars are close. I could see the GT500 pulling of a 7:10-15 or so at the ring. As a pure track car the 1le is amazing 7:16 at the ring with 650 hp and a manual trans is insane. Look at it this way. Would the GT500 run that time with a manual? Maybe. How about with 650 hp? I think not, that’s why it’s such a great track car. In short both are great cars. GT500 can run with or beat the 1le on a road course and beat it badly on the strip.

Remember this is just bragging rights for 95% or owners.
 

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JohnnyUtah

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Not. Stock. More than likely an upgrade. Don’t know anyone who downgrades. Lol. Enough said.

Mismatched means nothing. If you upgrade the front tires but leave the rears alone or vice versa, it's still and upgrade. Or if you upgrade both front and back with different levels of upgrade - you guessed it - still an upgrade.

and the 500 tires were bad.

Just because you may have seen some people wearing them down even further in your visits to the track, that has nothing to do when you are comparing each cars performance vs the other.
Come on man. You know better.
Well, wait... everyone here said the Supercar 3R on the ZLE were stickier than the PSC2 and that's why the braking distance metrics were better in the other test.

Now, the PSC2 on the front only are an "upgrade"? Hilarious. Whatever fits the narrative I guess. It sounds to me like it was more ot a handicap... just like the cooked tires on the 500. Mismatched tires would never be a good thing.
 

9secondko

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Well, wait... everyone here said the Supercar 3R on the ZLE were stickier than the PSC2 and that's why the braking distance metrics were better in the other test.

Now, the PSC2 on the front only are an "upgrade"? Hilarious. Whatever fits the narrative I guess. It sounds to me like it was more ot a handicap... just like the cooked tires on the 500. Mismatched tires would never be a good thing.
If the you tubers wanted to get true results, a tire swap wouldn’t be an issue. They splurged to get better tires on a Camaro SS 1le to help it perform better against the pp2.

They went through the trouble of acting like motor trend and hiring camaro randy to drive. tires were a simple matter for them to address.

As far as which are stickier, I’ve heard the other way around. But the Camaro does have the wider tires. So the swap is a mod. Doesn’t matter if it’s front only. Grip is grip.

taking a factory stock and factory supplied vehicle and putting it against others that are not factory supplied and the modification status has not been vetted, is automatically a problem.

Especially with the higher end cars which most love to at The very least add a tune and tire, if not additional bolt ons.

And even then randy had to save face and admit the 500 was the faster car, albeit handicapped.
 

jvandy50

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you can call it modded since it isn't factory, but neither michelin tire is an upgrade to the factory GY SC3R. whatever is on the front of that silver car is a downgrade, plain and simple, in terms of track performance.
 

JohnnyUtah

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If the you tubers wanted to get true results, a tire swap wouldn’t be an issue. They splurged to get better tires on a Camaro SS 1le to help it perform better against the pp2.

They went through the trouble of acting like motor trend and hiring camaro randy to drive. tires were a simple matter for them to address.

As far as which are stickier, I’ve heard the other way around. But the Camaro does have the wider tires. So the swap is a mod. Doesn’t matter if it’s front only. Grip is grip.

taking a factory stock and factory supplied vehicle and putting it against others that are not factory supplied and the modification status has not been vetted, is automatically a problem.

Especially with the higher end cars which most love to at The very least add a tune and tire, if not additional bolt ons.

And even then randy had to save face and admit the 500 was the faster car, albeit handicapped.
All I hear is wahhh in this.

It was a shit test that was flawed from the start. Fact is that both cars are quick. I think what is really bothering everyone here is that the Mustang isnt "decimating" the Camaro as most people had hoped. They are close in performance, and that's just the way it is.

Until we get a real test there is nothing else to argue other than conspiracy theories and conjecture. You can say whatever you want but there are no numbers to back any of it up.
 

shogun32

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You can say whatever you want but there are no numbers to back any of it up.
damn it man, we're bench racing here! We've got our life's choices being validated (or not) and can't have our pecker girth and length questioned.
 

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Epiphany

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Until we get a real test there is nothing else to argue...
The sad part is they had every opportunity to provide fair and objective results but failed, almost as if on purpose. And the excuses they ran with only serve to create more animosity.
 

obspsd

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CFTP GT500 is faster then a ZL1 1LE

GT500 will destroy a ZL1 on the street or drag strip.

ZL1 1LE will be pretty close on a lot of tracks.

ZL1 is a better value if you use the car for road course work a lot and not much daily driving.

Most of these videos are pretty useless and not even very enjoyable to watch.
 

bluebeastsrt

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All I hear is wahhh in this.

It was a shit test that was flawed from the start. Fact is that both cars are quick. I think what is really bothering everyone here is that the Mustang isnt "decimating" the Camaro as most people had hoped. They are close in performance, and that's just the way it is.

Until we get a real test there is nothing else to argue other than conspiracy theories and conjecture. You can say whatever you want but there are no numbers to back any of it up.
Yep, bogus test. What annoys me. Is how f#&king hard is it to get two new cars with new tires and do a test????? Not a single major automotive publication has stepped up. Why??? This is one of the reasons I canceled every subscription years ago! I’m not a road course guy. So I don’t really care if it decimates or eeks out a road course win. I would be very surprised if the GT500 loses. Given the time the Ford engineers had to get it right. But I doubt it’ll cause any sleepless nights. If the ZLe won on some tighter tracks.
 

Epiphany

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...how f#&king hard is it to get two new cars with new tires and do a test? Not a single major automotive publication has stepped up.
You're right. It'll be nice to see somebody step up to the plate and do this right regardless of the outcome.
 

Checkmate

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Gosh, people are still harping on about the TH video.

GM just announced the C8 did 7:29 (DCT) at the Nurburgring. For reference, the base ZL1 (Auto) did the exact time a few years ago at 7:29 as well.

Meanwhile, just over 2 years go a 'Manual' ZL1 1LE officially did 7:16 at the Ring. Unofficially, it did 7:13 at the Ring.

Up until recently, there wasn't a single Ferrari that could beat the ZL1 1LE's time.

Let's never forget what an insane track weapon the ZL1 1LE is. This has nothing to do with the Camaro logic. This has everything to do with Bob Lutz pushing GM to drop $2Bn into the Alpha platform just under a decade ago.

For people that need to be reminded what a 'Manual' ZL1 1LE once accomplished, here's a video for you to have popcorn with -

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