The Fate on the ICE

[HoosierDaddy]

That is the real crime here. We have plenty.

But only because:

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[K4fxd]

But only because:

Funny, but it is mostly plants that are turned into oil

 

[sk47]

Funny, but it is mostly plants that are turned into oil

Hello; Also the small sea life which died and made layers on the oceans bottoms, likely shallow, and then were covered with sediments that made an impermeable layer.

 

[Biggus Dickus]

Funny, but it is mostly plants that are turned into oil

And Trump would probably convert to more oil than that dinosaur.

Hmmm - maybe we should call Tony Stark and solve 2 problems at once.

 

[sk47]

Growth of electric vehicles endangering rain forests (msn.com)

Hello; interesting video. I am sure other takes can be had from this, but I got they will cut down some rainforest to save the environment with EV’s.

 

[llinthicum1]

Hello; Thing is governments are already putting a lot of weight on the scales in various ways. You mentioned a couple.
Some states have already stated new ICE sales will be banned at around 2030 or 2035. That alone means car makers have to do something years before the deadline.
Volvo, for example, has gotten on board big time. Last I heard they plan to not have any ICE vehicles in the near future.
Volvo has already spun off it's ICE manufacturing to a subsidiary. They will be buying what ICE they will be using before they go all EV from that company. Likely the same building and people who were making the ICE before, but will not be a true part of Volvo. That also likely means there will not be any new Volvo models with an ICE. That they will use up the existing chassis and components in the meantime.
My guess is other makers will be stopping new ICE models. There may be a few to come out that were already in the process of being made since it can take many years to complete the process. Another guess is when the tooling for existing ICE models reaches the end of it's life, those models will be dropped. Dropped even if they are selling well.

Battery technology will evolve greatly in 10-15 years. It's just that BEVs in their current form are not ready yet due to the problems I noted.

Hello; Thing is governments are already putting a lot of weight on the scales in various ways. You mentioned a couple.
Some states have already stated new ICE sales will be banned at around 2030 or 2035. That alone means car makers have to do something years before the deadline.
Volvo, for example, has gotten on board big time. Last I heard they plan to not have any ICE vehicles in the near future.
Volvo has already spun off it's ICE manufacturing to a subsidiary. They will be buying what ICE they will be using before they go all EV from that company. Likely the same building and people who were making the ICE before, but will not be a true part of Volvo. That also likely means there will not be any new Volvo models with an ICE. That they will use up the existing chassis and components in the meantime.
My guess is other makers will be stopping new ICE models. There may be a few to come out that were already in the process of being made since it can take many years to complete the process. Another guess is when the tooling for existing ICE models reaches the end of it's life, those models will be dropped. Dropped even if they are selling well.

No doubt in 10-15 years, battery technology will resolve the issues I mentioned. We'll have to wait and see. Also, cost to manufacture BEVs will be lower. Will have to be for consumers to be able to afford. It's just that BEVs in their current form, are not ready to replace ICE. For example, the Chevy Bolt - GM rolls out software update limiting Chevy Bolt EV charge to 80%, but removes parking restrictions - Electrek

 

[K4fxd]

No doubt in 10-15 years, battery fuel cell technology will resolve the issues

Battery's are like CFL light bulbs, a pipe dream

 

[shogun32]

battery tech evolution is glacial. in 10-15 years we're all supposed to be dead from coastal flooding and Co2 poisoning - well we were supposed to be dead 5 years ago based on all those earnest and "scientific consensus" assertions from days gone by.

It's nothing more than a money grab.

 

[sk47]

Battery technology will evolve greatly in 10-15 years. It's just that BEVs in their current form are not ready yet due to the problems I noted.

No doubt in 10-15 years, battery technology will resolve the issues I mentioned. We'll have to wait and see. Also, cost to manufacture BEVs will be lower. Will have to be for consumers to be able to afford. It's just that BEVs in their current form, are not ready to replace ICE. For example, the Chevy Bolt - GM rolls out software update limiting Chevy Bolt EV charge to 80%, but removes parking restrictions - Electrek

Hello; In terms of basic transportation with the only reason being to get from A to B, I do not oppose an EV. They will need to be a better deal than an ICE for one thing. That may happen if the powers that be force fuel prices sky high or add a tax premium of some sort. I could live with an EV as a second vehicle. Might be comfortable with it, but cannot picture ever liking one.

My vaguely form of a plan is to wait until some sort of battery and other tech wins out. If any are old enough to be around when VHS and beta tape recorders went head to head, you know what I mean. Lots of folks wound up stuck with a video recorder having little and eventually no support.
I told about my neighbor who has an early Ford hybrid SUV with regenerative braking on the blink. My guess is the tech is out of date and there are no more parts around.

 

[K4fxd]

EV's are like cell phones. After a few years you toss them and get the next greatest thing.

 

[Gregs24]

I will drive my "fun" cars as long as either I'm alive, or it just becomes untenable due to gas pricing or availability. I guessing that the transition to EV's is going to be a slow one. There are too many ICE vehicles currently in use, and there are too many unresolved issues on the EV side to make them a replacement for other than for short commutes or very well planned one.

I'm not sure even in the US 250 - 350 miles is a short commute ?

 

[Gregs24]

Well the govt imposed tough regs on heavy trucks so everyone repowered the old trucks to the tune of 250,000 units a year.

Same thing will happen with ICE.

Only the top 10 % earners can afford an EV subsidized by the 90% of low to mid earners in the form of vehicle credits and govt funding to build out 19 century power infrastructure where it takes 20 years in court to get a transmission line or power plant permit.

In Norway, and a couple other countries, it now costs more to recharge EV than to fill up with premium because they stopped subsidizing the electricity. It was a huge bait and switch.

Odd comment.

Current Norwegian petrol price is $7.63 per gallon or 19c per mile

Electricity is 0.136c / kWh - or 0.23c per mile

There will clearly be differences in charging costs as there are different prices for fuel but the gap is still huge. There are also many other costs to take into account such as depreciation and running costs other than fuel.

As a reference the prices in the UK are fairly similar. petrol is slightly cheaper and electricity is slightly more expensive but running and EV is still a huge saving at present.

EV’s cheaper to run than ICE-cars in most EU countries (mgmotor.eu)

At the end of the day though why should it be CHEAPER long term to run an EV. As long as it isn't MORE EXPENSIVE then the impact is neutral which surely is the goal ?

 

[K4fxd]

As a reference the prices in the UK are fairly similar. petrol is slightly cheaper and electricity is slightly more expensive but running and EV is still a huge saving at present.

Fan Boi till the end. Jump off the cliff with the rest of the sheep.

 

[sk47]

Odd comment.

Current Norwegian petrol price is $7.63 per gallon or 19c per mile

Electricity is 0.136c / kWh - or 0.23c per mile

There will clearly be differences in charging costs as there are different prices for fuel but the gap is still huge. There are also many other costs to take into account such as depreciation and running costs other than fuel.

As a reference the prices in the UK are fairly similar. petrol is slightly cheaper and electricity is slightly more expensive but running and EV is still a huge saving at present.

EV’s cheaper to run than ICE-cars in most EU countries (mgmotor.eu)

At the end of the day though why should it be CHEAPER long term to run an EV. As long as it isn't MORE EXPENSIVE then the impact is neutral which surely is the goal ?

Hello; Did a quick read of the link. I did not see the greater cost of buying the EV included in the operating cost figures. If i missed that you have an opening to correct. In the USA an EV considerably more expensive to buy, even with the government incentives, than a comparable ICE is currently.
I stopped looking for a diesel car when direct injection of gasoline moved the efficiency closer to that of diesel. It was that diesel was 15% or better than gas before. Now the difference is around 10%. The diesel cost more to buy, is heavier and the fuel has always been more costly per gallon.

Thing about electricity will be using current grids is there is not enough capacity to replace the energy of gasoline/diesel for transportation with electricity. That being the case at least two things will have to happen. One is a big improvement of the grid across entire countries. This will be expensive. The cost will be borne by all of us using electricity in our homes. We all will be paying extra to build up the grid capacity.

The second is not as sure in my thinking, but seems very likely. That being a general shortage of electricity due to demand for a decade or few. It will take many years for the grid to be upgraded. With the current inflation levels that will add to the expense also. For someone like myself with a heat pump, it could come down to unplugging much except my charging EV and having heat in winter. I could be sitting in the dark in order to have some lower level of heat and a charge so I can drive to work or to the grocery store the next day.

I have read a number of the EV articles. One thing they have had in common has been a "some day" such and such will be taken care of, just you wait.
The grid is not ready for prime time EV use yet. These mandated pushes to do away with the ICE vehicles by 2030 or so will not fix the grid. Nor will it get renewable electricity to all any time soon.

I happen to live in an area with scarce EV charging stations. That may get better, but not for a while. The changeover to EV could be natural but will not happen quickly enough for those who are champions of the change. My take is the process got a decent start in the early 2000's with hybrids and later plug in hybrids. Gasoline, diesel and natural gas was high cost. Then came fracking and other tech which gave us cheaper crude oil and natural gas. The move to EV's stalled due to their much higher cost.
Now mandates are being used by those with the power to artificially push the change to EV's using the environment as an excuse. Refer back to my links about the Volvo study to see how EV's are not that much cleaner overall.

 

[Strokerswild]

Here's why I'll never own a BEV where I live:

Hybrid, maybe. Full on BEV, no way in hell. Especially up north.

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