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Hack

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I had a VW Sirocco when I was a young man. I had just put new tires on the car. I was driving a NC mountain road. As I entered the turn I got a little to wide and dropped the right rear wheel of the edge of the road. As I gently corrected to bring the car back up onto the road the rear tire gave way, turned me sideways, and the rim dug in. This sent me flipping down an embankment. The speed limit on this road at the time was 55, I was not reckless or out of control. I have played this back in my head a thousand times. Other than not letting the wheel drop off in the first place, I cannot see what I could have done differently. Sometimes things just happen. It was surreal during the wreck. It felt like it was in slow motion. I was blessed that I was not killed or hurt bad. I got less for the car than I had paid for the new tires.
I think when you let the wheel come off the road you made a pretty big error. Maybe you wouldn't call it reckless, but I bet you avoid similar situations now. I think most people leave extra room between their wheels and the edge of the road, just in case.

I spun my new to me '89 Mustang GT in the first couple weeks I owned it. This was in the early 90s. There was a little light rain and I was driving too fast. I even hit a curb when I did it. I was an idiot and I was driving too fast for the situation. I was really fortunate that the car wasn't damaged.

I spun my '70 Mustang once on a freeway on ramp in the rain. I was super lucky that the curb was a gradual slope, because the car went over the curb and completely off the road. That one - I don't even know what I did wrong, but obviously it was another case of me being dumb and driving too fast for the conditions/situation. I guess this was in the 90s as well. Anyway it was definitely many years ago.

Just because I look at a photo and say that I believe the driver was reckless doesn't mean I'm holding myself up as a great example of wisdom. And I realize I could be wrong.

But no way was he going 20 or 30 mph. That car had a lot of speed to roll over and get so far off the road. Maybe the driver was using great judgement and there's no way anyone in the world could have avoided what happened, but that seems unlikely to me.

And IMO speculating about what happened is probably more fun than hearing what really did happen.

Non taken, this was a curvy mountain road. No way to go wide open. Like I said the speed limit was 55 and there is no way to go 55. My point is that arm chair quarterbacks don't know the situation and should reserve judgement. To think you know the speed or condition a person was driving is ludicrous.
I disagree. I think when you see flat ground and a car that looks like it rolled multiple times, assuming speed makes complete sense. It takes a lot of energy to flatten a car's roof and twist the body like that.

Once my mom slid off a road in icy conditions and rolled her VW bug. A local came by and tipped it back on its wheels. He popped the roof back up with his hand and she was on her way. That was a low-speed rollover. She was going maybe 5 mph and rolled down a ditch. The car was fine and she was fine. No air bags and only lap belts.
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Hack

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Ah, the C&C syndrome. There are so many things that could have caused this but we immediately jump to driver error. Just glad he is ok.
Definitely not related to C&C. C&C are typically MINOR accidents. Scary because people are around, but just light fender benders. This was not minor at all.

Looks like a meteor hit it.
You're not kidding.

Glad your friend is ok. For the rest of the vultures and busybodies chit happens.
As my old dad would say, if you don’t got something constructive to say, keep your dum azz quiet.
I don't think this post you made was very constructive. First sentence was ok, the rest.... your dad would have told you to zip it. Or maybe he would have said something more vulgar, I don't know your dad.
 

RocketGuy3

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You can't create a thread like this without expecting people to get curious about what caused the wreck. Generally speaking, if someone's willing to share photos like this, they're also willing to share those details, too.

Nothing against OP, he doesn't seem to know what happened anyway, and he's obviously within his rights to not tell us even if he did. I'm just defending the people who are asking for the deets, heh.

In any case, glad everyone's OK. Modern safety standards FTW...
 

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Good point. It's possible the brakes and steering suddenly stopped functioning properly on his new GT350.
Mechanical failure is definitely a possibility, as is getting hit by another car (maybe even T-boned? although prob not if it's on the side of the road it looks like it's on) or having to swerve to avoid a sudden and otherwise unavoidable obstacle at fairly high speeds... And even if he goofed, exactly how badly he goofed and how much worse the surrounding environment made it is another question.

I mean logically and statistically speaking, the odds are pretty good that you're right -- he probably fucked up in some way or another. But I don't think you're in a position to be quite as confident as you seem to be about what happened.
 

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If that was a debris trail, would it be wrong to speculate that speed was a factor? Nannies off or on?
Thought roads in the UK were kph, not mph?
Ford "nannies" are shit. Seriously. The traction control strategies Ford employs are like an attorney said "hey, we gotta put some sorta safety feature on these things and it has to be submitted by tomorrow morning."

The Ford traction control is arguably more unsafe than with it off. Firstly it isn't preventative at all or nearly enough. It waits until the car is way out of shape before it kicks in. Secondly, it's crude and completely disruptive to intuitive driving instincts. The last thing someone needs when the ass is out of sorts is to COMPLETELY and ABRUPTLY cut full power.

There's a reason that most of the very high HP cars are going to MOTEC and it's not to do with making more sauce. It's because MOTEC has MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH better traction control strategies and the result is.......the car will PROACTIVELY only allow the power that the chassis can effectively put down at the given speed. It first seeks to cut timing, then it adjusts throttle angle and chokes power further, then if that's not enough it cuts spark and cylinders (like the Ford garbage) as a last resort.

The reason there's so many Mustang videos of crashes is partly because it's a popular car, but also because the car comes FROM THE FACTORY with significantly more power than the chassis can effectively manage and it's a great platform for making even MORE power beyond traction, all combined with the fact that the traction control is abhorrent.

The most impressive thing about the Tesla Plaid isn't that it does 150+ mph in the 1/4/ The most impressive thing about it is that it runs sub 10 second quarter mile IN THE RAIN. Ford is way behind and it's not on sensory capability, it's COMPLETELY on outdated and bunk control strategies.
 

Inthehighdesert

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Here we go again. Your comparing a 150k Tesla to a Mustang. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the chassis on a newer mustang. Not ecoboost, Gt, 350, whatever. That fact of the matter is very very few know how to handle 250hp correctly let alone 450+. I won’t even get in to the never ending need for more hp, and still can’t handle the stock configuration. I started with foxbody’s out of high school. No nannie’s. If you fxcked up, it was on you, not the car. I used to take a 250Ninja to the track and piss off all the guys on 750’s. I had a Gsxr750 as well. Very few ever understood how to actually use power correctly and carry corner speed. Couldn’t understand how with all that power they couldn’t close the gap on a straight. There’s sooo much more to driving a car then just simply planting the pedal. This is by no means a dig at the op’s buddy that had this misfortune of having an accident. But if any of us end up off the road in a public thorough faire scenario, we’re going to fast for the situation. That’s not on any car, that would be on us.

Ford "nannies" are shit. Seriously. The traction control strategies Ford employs are like an attorney said "hey, we gotta put some sorta safety feature on these things and it has to be submitted by tomorrow morning."

The Ford traction control is arguably more unsafe than with it off. Firstly it isn't preventative at all or nearly enough. It waits until the car is way out of shape before it kicks in. Secondly, it's crude and completely disruptive to intuitive driving instincts. The last thing someone needs when the ass is out of sorts is to COMPLETELY and ABRUPTLY cut full power.

There's a reason that most of the very high HP cars are going to MOTEC and it's not to do with making more sauce. It's because MOTEC has MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH better traction control strategies and the result is.......the car will PROACTIVELY only allow the power that the chassis can effectively put down at the given speed. It first seeks to cut timing, then it adjusts throttle angle and chokes power further, then if that's not enough it cuts spark and cylinders (like the Ford garbage) as a last resort.

The reason there's so many Mustang videos of crashes is partly because it's a popular car, but also because the car comes FROM THE FACTORY with significantly more power than the chassis can effectively manage and it's a great platform for making even MORE power beyond traction, all combined with the fact that the traction control is abhorrent.

The most impressive thing about the Tesla Plaid isn't that it does 150+ mph in the 1/4/ The most impressive thing about it is that it runs sub 10 second quarter mile IN THE RAIN. Ford is way behind and it's not on sensory capability, it's COMPLETELY on outdated and bunk control strategies.
 

Angrey

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Here we go again. Your comparing a 150k Tesla to a Mustang. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the chassis on a newer mustang. Not ecoboost, Gt, 350, whatever. That fact of the matter is very very few know how to handle 250hp correctly let alone 450+. I won’t even get in to the never ending need for more hp, and still can’t handle the stock configuration. I started with foxbody’s out of high school. No nannie’s. If you fxcked up, it was on you, not the car. I used to take a 250Ninja to the track and piss off all the guys on 750’s. I had a Gsxr750 as well. Very few ever understood how to actually use power correctly and carry corner speed. Couldn’t understand how with all that power they couldn’t close the gap on a straight. There’s sooo much more to driving a car then just simply planting the pedal. This is by no means a dig at the op’s buddy that had this misfortune of having an accident. But if any of us end up off the road in a public thorough faire scenario, we’re going to fast for the situation. That’s not on any car, that would be on us.
There's no doubt that driver skill and experience get a vote. The point being, that back when Mustangs didn't have quite the drastic power to traction ratio that they do now, there's only so much trouble you can get into with a car that makes 300 ft-lbs of torque.

Fast forward to today where right off the showroom floor, the cars will roll the tires in just about every gear that isn't an overdrive.

Yes, everyone should be an experienced and responsible driver. The reality is that isn't the case.

And you totally skipped over the part where I pointed out, it has NOTHING to do with hardware or sensor capability. The GT350 has the proper mechanical parts to be able to field a functional traction control strategy. Ford just doesn't offer it. The MOTEC system piggy backs right off the factory computer system and harnesses. It can be removed and the car fully returned to stock conditions. It's simply a matter of WHAT the strategy is and does. The amount of money/time for Ford to put into a proper TC protocol is peanuts when you spread it across a fleet of cars. They could literally dyno and program one single car, update the tune/program and now the car is INFINITELY more safe and capable, given the amount of power and lack of traction is has. IF you or I can do it for $15k, I imagine Ford could afford to do it and pass along an extra dollar of cost to every new vehicle. Then you have a system that helps every driver who isn't Dale Schumacher Force like you.
 

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Actually, the analogy of can’t get in much trouble with 300lb/ft of a torque is far from correct. Big difference between a live axle and an independent. Little bit of a bumpy surface completely changes the attitude of the car, especially in a corner. I didn’t skip over the part about traction control and such. My point was to learn to drive the car without all that stuff on. And it still goes back to cost. Not sure how a 15k aftermarket system equates to fractions of pennies on the dollar in a production vehicle by a manufacturer. Let’s be honest, pretty much no one is using a motec system in a stock configuration, it’s part of a tens of thousands of dollars in updrades. If any of us want to spend that type of money for that type of hardware there are several manufacturers providing the vehicles that have it, it’s just way north of the 100k mark. You mentioned the Tesla black’s prowess in the rain. Back in the day the Cyclone and Typhoon were the same, better in the wet then dry as far as acceleration numbers went.

And I’m no dale Schumacher wtf that is, but I do know how to drive. Better then some, not as well as others.

There's no doubt that driver skill and experience get a vote. The point being, that back when Mustangs didn't have quite the drastic power to traction ratio that they do now, there's only so much trouble you can get into with a car that makes 300 ft-lbs of torque.

Fast forward to today where right off the showroom floor, the cars will roll the tires in just about every gear that isn't an overdrive.

Yes, everyone should be an experienced and responsible driver. The reality is that isn't the case.

And you totally skipped over the part where I pointed out, it has NOTHING to do with hardware or sensor capability. The GT350 has the proper mechanical parts to be able to field a functional traction control strategy. Ford just doesn't offer it. The MOTEC system piggy backs right off the factory computer system and harnesses. It can be removed and the car fully returned to stock conditions. It's simply a matter of WHAT the strategy is and does. The amount of money/time for Ford to put into a proper TC protocol is peanuts when you spread it across a fleet of cars. They could literally dyno and program one single car, update the tune/program and now the car is INFINITELY more safe and capable, given the amount of power and lack of traction is has. IF you or I can do it for $15k, I imagine Ford could afford to do it and pass along an extra dollar of cost to every new vehicle. Then you have a system that helps every driver who isn't Dale Schumacher Force like you.
 

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v8hgt

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Bit early in the year to go felling your own Christmas tree Josh… got some bungee cords you can lash it to the roof with if you need them.
3f0e0903-46d1-4b32-a912-1379e763abcb-jpeg.jpg
 
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Bit early in the year to go felling your own Christmas tree Josh… got some bungee cords you can lash it to the roof with if you need them.
3f0e0903-46d1-4b32-a912-1379e763abcb-jpeg.jpg
That’s what I told him 😂 but hey maybe because he was up there he thought it was a good idea 😂
 

v8hgt

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I’m like that when I see a Christmas tree the right shape and height, but I favour use of the chain saw or axe, not the vehicle technique. Bet that will have dropped all its needles before he gets his insurance payout. ;)
In other news… ford owner finds new way to avoid dealing with the terrible service from ford dealers.
Scottish roadside recovery operators to invest in longer winch cables ahead of summer NC500 season…
 
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Eclipsar

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I’m like that when I see a Christmas tree the right shape and height. Bet that will have dropped all its needles before he gets his insurance payout. ;)
In other news… ford owner finds new way to avoid dealing with the terrible service from ford dealers.
😂 that’s for sure 😂 but at least it saves him finding a buyer for it 😂
 
 




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