Squashing Misinformation on Billet Gears (Oil Pump, Crankshaft Sprocket) OPG

[ProChargerTECH]

Very curious here about required power to spin various PD and centri blowers. New thread to compile?

Centri's don't really take much at all.

However there is no WAY you can actually wrap someones head around power it takes to turn a blower, due to the amount of factors involved. Pulley tension, acceleration rates, cfm, pressure, etc.

Turbos also take power to turbo, however that comes from the "cork" they place in the exhaust. However their dynamics come from tubing size, exhaust housing, turbo trim, cfm flow, pressure, etc etc

I will say this, it takes much less to turn a procharger then people think.
Hence why your leaf blower, uses the same style of compressor to move air.
Efficient means of moving air.

And also why our industrial division does very well.
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[D3adch1ld]

We just install a Procharger Stg.2 kit with an ATI damper. You just need to specify when you order the Procharger kit that your using an ATI damper since the 8-rib pulley is differs if your using the stock damper.

I wanted this, but no ine was able to tell me accurately what to do and ended up using the standard stg 2 pulley and factory. I rev my car to 8k with the d1sc strapped. The ATI damper should help the harmonics tremendously.

 

[turbosc297]

There are many other factors involved besides only turning the unit of course, BUT the parasitic losses beyond the unit itself on most belt-driven SCs should be similar with few variances (belt width, tension, routing, etc).
My curiosity lies with only the units themselves. If there was a way to measure required power at various RPMs and boost pressures on a test bench it would be neat IMO.

Next summer I'll be boosted, after a year of research I'm STILL undecided between procharger and whipple. If the parasitic loss of one was substantially less than the other that would be another factor to consider especially if there was less stress on the front of the crank

Sorry for the off topic. BACK TO OPGs

 

[MyLilPony]

There are many other factors involved besides only turning the unit of course, BUT the parasitic losses beyond the unit itself on most belt-driven SCs should be similar with few variances (belt width, tension, routing, etc).
My curiosity lies with only the units themselves. If there was a way to measure required power at various RPMs and boost pressures on a test bench it would be neat IMO.

Next summer I'll be boosted, after a year of research I'm STILL undecided between procharger and whipple. If the parasitic loss of one was substantially less than the other that would be another factor to consider especially if there was less stress on the front of the crank

Sorry for the off topic. BACK TO OPGs

I debated the same, went PC and Am glad I did!

 

[zaquhree]

My OEM timing gear had teeth that were chewed up after 3k boosted miles

 

[turbosc297]

Another thought, are there any external oil pump options out there? Just do away with this whole issue

 

[Screamer]

I did not insinuate you would break a billet gear.

I did insuate that putting a billet gear on an engine that has, potentially, a softer crankshaft than the material of the OPG could cause an issue. Mike Tymensky, one of the better mod motor builders years back would always tell people to ensure they has a good damper on these engines when they upgrade the OPG. He even provided pics of examples. The crankshafts were scarred badly.

Al Papitto also did the same thing. Recommended the better dampers when upgrading OPG. He also showed images of damaged crankshafts from insufficient dampening.

This goes back many years my friend. These Ford OHC engines, specifically 4V headed, have been prone to this since the beginning.

It was believed back then, and Steeda may likely chime in since they had / have one of the more popular dampers for the older mod motors, that the smaller "underdrive" crank dampers were responsible for OPG failures and spun bearings. The internet sites were plagued with these occurrences, and I believe Steeda actually redesigned their dampers due to this.

So, if lessening the effectiveness of the dampers were proven to cause issues on 6-7K RPM max engines, then I think it would only be common sense that acquiring better dampening is a good thing.

FWIW, there have been plenty of Coyote OPG issues without poweradders.

As for your comment about the turbos and harmonics, increased cylinder pressures will absolutely put more "bad" or unwanted increase of stressful harmonics thriuhg the entire rotating assembly. Hence the reason turbo cars break OPG all the time.

Everything you have posted is 100 percent accurate. If you like i will go first hand into a bit of history and lessons learned.

Al Papitto

 

[Moddiction]

Have there been known failures from centri blowers making under 600whp yet?

 

[BrimstoneBill]

Where's the best place to get the ATI balancer? And for those of us who already have the Procharger stage 2 with the 8 rib pulley for the stock balancer, where do we get the pulley that mates with the ATI?

 

[Rintegration]

Where's the best place to get the ATI balancer? And for those of us who already have the Procharger stage 2 with the 8 rib pulley for the stock balancer, where do we get the pulley that mates with the ATI?

We can get you the balancer but you will need to get with Procharger and purchase a 8 rib pulley that is designed for the ATI damper.

 

[Rintegration]

Another thought, are there any external oil pump options out there? Just do away with this whole issue

External pump will just complicate things. Damper, OPG & you'll be good to go.

 

[BMR Tech]

Everything you have posted is 100 percent accurate. If you like i will go first hand into a bit of history and lessons learned.

Al Papitto

Holy smokes! It's the man himself.

Welcome to another generation of Oil Pump Gears and harmonics battling for glorious victory!

But this time, we throw the timing gear/sprocket into the mix.

 

[v8440]

Uncontrolled harmonics damage just about everything. Crankshafts can break from that in extreme cases.

 

[Pongo23]

There is so much out there about oil pump gears and I reached out to someone in R&D at ford performance to get some additional information on this issue. The gentleman I spoke with has indicated that using incompatible dampers has a big part to play in shattering the oil pump gears. I also inquired about the effect on the oil pump gears for my naturally aspirated build as i've pre ordered power pack 3; which raises the red line to 7500rpm and I was assured that I'd be safe with my stock oil pump gears and there is no difference between the oil pump on the 2015 mustang gt and the boss race cars which also have a 7500rpm red line.
The coyote is definitely a capable platform, and can handle some conservative boosting but for all the experts out there who think they can just slap a blower with an aggressive tune with gears on a high compression engine and think it's all good; are you for real?
I'm all about reliable and usable power and adding a blower would in my opinion entail so many other upgrades that it just wouldn't be worth it for me. I think adding a blower should include many other additions, from the engine internals, fuel system, suspension, drive train, reducing some weight up front to somehow to keep the balance of the car, wider tires, cooling, cooling, cooling. I hate to say it but alot of the forced induction builds on here are a train wreck waiting to happen.

 

[doodguy]

Well that was inspiring. Guess i should just go back to stock

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