Six Yrs Later - C8 Z06 finally tries to copy Voodoo

[Inthehighdesert]

I don‘t get the brand bs. I like pretty much all the cool cars the various manufacturers put out. I just tend to gravitate towards Ford. GM makes some great stuff now. GM has always also been more prone to venture out on a limb then Ford has. I’m going back to the 80’s with really limited production numbers for the GN’s, Typhoons, Cyclones, Gta’s, etc. Mopar has done similar as well. Ford has been relatively conservative compared to the other domestics in that regard. That being said, the 350 and 500 are on different levels and I’m thankful for that. The big winner here is all of us, because what GM is going to supposedly do with the C8 and that engine package means the big three are not done with the combustion engine and the performance side.

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[OnThree]

it's just really funny how so many GT owners respond in a GT350 forum, are you intimately involved with the understanding of the GT350? And from the responses, it doesn't sound like you guys are and instead just want to somehow say that either the Voodoo breaks or is not that great.

Input from GT owners:

"And Ford copied it from Ferrari so who cares. If the rumors are true then it's going to beat the pants off of the Voodoo anyway."


"Hopefully they are copying Ferrari so it doesn't blow up constantly like the voodoo"


I could break down a response that answers OP question and I could also dismantle these above responses, but why? it's just really really funny to always see GT people in this forum for a car they don't have but somehow want to put down.

I don't have to have aids to know I don't want it. I've driven 3 different gt350's, not impressed, especially considering how unreliable and high maintenance they are for marginal performance improvement over a GT.

happy now?

 

[Inthehighdesert]

Lol. I have Gt vert as well. Car has lots of mods. Its a great car for what it is. It is no where near the level of a 350. Even a track prepped GT isn’t. The reference there is from the GT’s used at the Ford Performance School. Sorry, but if you’ve never had both on a track there’s no way to give an informed opinion. You simply can not put a 350 to what it is capable of on the street. What a 350 can do on a track is nothing short of astounding. There’s a reason why you see very few negatives by anyone that’s put one through it’s paces.

I don't have to have aids to know I don't want it. I've driven 3 different gt350's, not impressed, especially considering how unreliable and high maintenance they are for marginal performance improvement over a GT.

happy now?

 

[Shift]

This thread actually reminded me I should try to get on the list for the Z06 now if I want it in 2-3 years. I know the regular C8 is like a unicorn right now, so I can't even imagine the levels of insanity trying to get a Z06

 

[526 HRSE]

Corvette has jumped the shark.

 

[m3incorp]

I am on a couple of lists. I hope car prices have settled back down in the next couple of years.

This thread actually reminded me I should try to get on the list for the Z06 now if I want it in 2-3 years. I know the regular C8 is like a unicorn right now, so I can't even imagine the levels of insanity trying to get a Z06

 

[jvandy50]

Ford was bold and ballsy enough to put a bespoke FPC engine into a car most people could afford and proved it's not just for exotics. Chevy was bold and ballsy enough to do the same with a mid-engine car. Not only that, but to add an FPC to it is absolutely amazing.

It's been 5 years now, and a certain subset of GT owners can't help but knock on the Voodoo. In their minds, it's nothing special, unnecessary, and a gimmick. Plain and simple, you're just haters. End of story.

It does seem to take away from the uniqueness aspect when they are adding counterweights, changing firing order, single intake…i cant find the article now, but i felt it explained some voodoo FPC compromises pretty well.

This Z06 sounds like it revs much faster, but we have no idea if it even works yet, so we will just have to see…they may all fall apart lol

 

[Shift]

It does seem to take away from the uniqueness aspect when they are adding counterweights, changing firing order, single intake…i cant find the article now, but i felt it explained some voodoo FPC compromises pretty well.

This Z06 sounds like it revs much faster, but we have no idea if it even works yet, so we will just have to see…they may all fall apart lol

Yea, hearing Ford having to damp the entire drivetrain to deal with the added vibrations of FPC, I'm curious to see what GM has done with their application of the FPC.

 

[Shift]

I am on a couple of lists. I hope car prices have settled back down in the next couple of years.

Somewhat off-topic, but do you even know what your expected timeframe to get one is? How far up are you on these lists?

 

[Rev Happy]

It does seem to take away from the uniqueness aspect when they are adding counterweights, changing firing order, single intake…i cant find the article now, but i felt it explained some voodoo FPC compromises pretty well.

With the overall weight of the S550 platform, I think they had to go to a larger displacement compared to the traditional FPC motors. They did 5 years of this motor and we're in year 6 since it was introduced, so it seems like the counterweight solution has been able to contain the vibrations. I believed they changed the firing order so they could run a single plenum and throttle body setup. I just don't know how a dual setup would have even fit.

Even with some of those "compromises", it's still the most unique motor they've put in a Mustang. It still sounds great, it still revs fast, and it still revs over 8K while making 500HP+ on 91 octane and passing emissions. You got to give credit to the engineers and making this work in a 65K car.

This Z06 sounds like it revs much faster, but we have no idea if it even works yet, so we will just have to see…they may all fall apart lol

True that. If Ford had such a challenge to make this work with a 5.2L motor, I'm not sure how GM can go bigger. What was even the last DOHC motor they made? The Northstar motor?

 

[Hi-PO Stang]

As I recall , no one had produced a FPC engine as large as 5.2 liters. The Ford engineers took up the challenge of making a large displacement FPC V8 engine to showcase their ability to solve the vibration problems and make a really great engine. They accomplished their goal.

 

[ice445]

With the overall weight of the S550 platform, I think they had to go to a larger displacement compared to the traditional FPC motors. They did 5 years of this motor and we're in year 6 since it was introduced, so it seems like the counterweight solution has been able to contain the vibrations. I believed they changed the firing order so they could run a single plenum and throttle body setup. I just don't know how a dual setup would have even fit.

Even with some of those "compromises", it's still the most unique motor they've put in a Mustang. It still sounds great, it still revs fast, and it still revs over 8K while making 500HP+ on 91 octane and passing emissions. You got to give credit to the engineers and making this work in a 65K car.



True that. If Ford had such a challenge to make this work with a 5.2L motor, I'm not sure how GM can go bigger. What was even the last DOHC motor they made? The Northstar motor?

The Blackwing engine was their last DOHC motor, so pretty recent. Ironically they killed it because they decided they didn't want to use it for anything. What a waste.

 

[Mjc1241]

They current Mercedes AMG GT Black Series has a flat plane crank engine as well.
https://www.thedrive.com/news/34836...0-hp-flat-plane-crank-v8-does-all-the-talking

 

[martinjlm]

We've seen the plans for years. Only took GM/Chevy 6+ years to try to copy the FPC Voodoo.
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a...tm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=socialflowTWCD

I retired from GM Product Portfolio Planning in 2017. Specifically working on Powertrain Competitor Intel and Strategy. My team provided intel on competitors’ powertrains to all the vehicle teams including C8. I can tell you with first hand knowledge and experience that Shelby was not on C8’s radar. The engine GM benchmarked was the Ferrari FPC. There were two Ferrari 458s purchased by the program. One for driving, one for teardown. The engine and transmission from the teardown went directly to the powertrain engineers for study. There were other engines studied, but that was the main one. So, all of this happened BEFORE I retired, which means before 2017. And before the Voodoo was publicly introduced. Of course, they knew Voodoo was coming, because that was my job to tell them but the Camaro team was much more interested in that than the Corvette team. The powertrain team was also interested, but like my team, they supported both Camaro and Corvette. The decision to go FPC was made long before GT350 launched.

 

[martinjlm]

The Blackwing engine was their last DOHC motor, so pretty recent. Ironically they killed it because they decided they didn't want to use it for anything. What a waste.

The actual reason for killing it was GM’s decision to go all electric. The decision was made after the Blackwing was too far into development to cancel. It was intended for vehicles built on the Omega platform. With the decision to go all electric, the Omega platform was dropped when the CT6 dropped. There was going to be a CT7 and it was likely that the 2nd gen CT5 would move from Alpha to Omega, as well as a RWD large SUV off the Omega platform. All would have gotten Blackwing. Blackwing as it exists(?) today will not package in Alpha, otherwise it would go in current CT5. It also doesn’t package in the T1XX platform (Escalade) so that’s not happening either.

Side note...Blackwing and the Corvette FPC are developed on the same platform, so all the development dollars aren’t flushed.

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