PP2 OWNER EXPERIENCES - RAVES/QUIRKS

[Norm Peterson]

... As for the 325 tires on the rear,
<snip>
. A mild caveat here ... the slightly taller 325 tires will alter your speedo about 2%.

2% is a good correction factor, but I'm pretty sure it works the other way in this case.

The speedometer of a car perfectly calibrated for 305/30-19's will read lower than actual when fitted with 325/30-19's. IOW, 200 on the speedometer would be 204 on the cop's radar gun. The real bottom line here is that I wouldn't worry about it anyway, even with the error not being in my favor as the driver (1.5 mph @ 75)


I'm also of the opinion that while 11" is listed as an acceptable width wheel for 325/30 tires (any diameter), it's a mildly "pinched" fitment and won't extract the best handling performance from a 325/30 tire.


Norm

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[Porsche Dude]

One for autocrossers and the more serious kit for track junkies.



If you want to lower it look at M5300W Magenride lowering springs. A little firmer ride and maybe 3/4" drop.



Well, we can...maybe for a few hot laps. On a warm summer day we may not make it all day without the diff throwing warnings or going into limp mode.

We run 30 minute sessions at Area 27 or just open track, the same at ORP in Oregon in 100 degree temps and the Full Tilt Boogie Racing diff cooler performs flawlessly. I think it is better than what comes on the Shelby.

 

[Norm Peterson]

The following quote is from Tom Barnes (Mustang's vehicle engineering manager) when asked why the GT350 trans & diff oil coolers were not part of the PP2 package: "We obviously knew that we could do that, but I'd just say that we didn't want to go there. And there are a lot of different reasons why. This [the PP2] is sandwiched between the GT350 & the PP1. If you start to add those coolers, you add complexity, engineering, weight & cost. In the end, we didn't want to go that full track capability. We thought this was a good place." The magazine (R&T / August 2018) goes on to say that "The aim of this passion project was to hone the ultimate street Mustang from a car they had already spent time developing."

In addition to the August 2018 copy of R&T (above quotes), you might look up the following online ... October 2018 R&T () & January 2020 C&D (PP2 v. GT350).

I'll have to track those hardcopy and online articles down, I'm sure I've got the print copy of R&T around here somewhere. The title (What happens when you let engineers tinker) rings a faint bell . . .


I have to admit that the apparent boundaries of "honing the ultimate street Mustang" seem to have forced the car to fall a bit short of what I (and probably a number of others) would have expected.


Norm

 

[Cobra Jet]

It's almost like the "Tremor Package" IS the PP2 package. Looking back at that first link you included, Tremor looks like some sort of marketing name that either didn't stick or was outright dropped in favor of keeping the simple PP2 or Level 2. Plus, with the Shaker Pro Audio System, how much shakin' does a Mustang need?

To answer the second question in your post....all PP2 cars came with magneride. It was included as part of the PP2 option.
All PP2 Mustangs sit about an inch lower than non-PP2 Mustangs IIRC.

Regarding whether a PP2 is "fully loaded", there are some threads on here with order guides from Ford showing what other options are available with the PP2 package.
You had to order either 301A or 401A package along with PP2 option.
I believe either of these options gave you the electronics necessary for selectable drive modes and magneride.

Thanks for the replies fellas!

I did not know that the PP2 came standard with MR.

So based on the Window Sticker snip I included a few posts back, would both of you consider that PP2 to be “fully loaded”? I tried looking for the option packages as suggested but still can’t tell if every option was selected on that window sticker.

 

[TicTocTach]

Thanks for the replies fellas!

I did not know that the PP2 came standard with MR.

So based on the Window Sticker snip I included a few posts back, would both of you consider that PP2 to be “fully loaded”? I tried looking for the option packages as suggested but still can’t tell if every option was selected on that window sticker.

Back when I was shopping, there were a couple very low option PP2's that seriously tempted me. You could get just the 301A and PP2 packages and be out the door. 2018-2019 MSRP for the GT was $35K, 301A was about $2K, and the PP2 was around $6K, so you're looking at $43K-ish MSRP. The cheapest PP2 I saw while shopping was VIN 1FA6P8CF4J5170487 advertised through Ted Russell Ford in Knoxville, TN for $42,636, and was also equipped with Recaro's and active exhaust. It wouldn't be unreasonable to get that car closer to $38K with rebates, and if you ditched the active exhaust and Recaro's it might be a $36K car. Screaming deal for a PP2.

On the other end of the scale, the most expensive PP2 I saw while shopping was $53,170 @ Jerry's Leesburg Ford in VA. That was VIN 1FA6P8CF7J5153828 with 401A, Safe/Smart, 12" LCD, floor mats...

 

[Ron]

"2% is a good correction factor, but I'm pretty sure it works the other way in this case. The speedometer of a car perfectly calibrated for 305/30x19 will read lower than actual when fitted with 325/30x19. IOW, 200 on the speedometer would be 204 on the cop's radar gun. The real bottom line here is that I wouldn't worry about it anyway, even w/the error not being in my favor as the driver (1.5 mph @ 75)."

So a taller tire will cause the speedo to read slower? Isn't that what I said? I gotta tell ya, senility is not near as much fun as they make it out to be.

"I'm also of the opinion that while 11" is listed as an acceptable width wheel for 325/30 tires (any diameter), it's a mildly "pinched" fitment & won't extract the best handling performance from a 325/30 tire."

Contact wear pattern is excellent w/the 325s (I just ran thru my 1st set of Continentals @ 30+k). I just happen to prefer the tighter feel of the 325 v. the increased (albeit small) sidewall flex of the 305 on the backside.

 

[Troutwrangler]

Back when I was shopping, there were a couple very low option PP2's that seriously tempted me. You could get just the 301A and PP2 packages and be out the door. 2018-2019 MSRP for the GT was $35K, 301A was about $2K, and the PP2 was around $6K, so you're looking at $43K-ish MSRP. The cheapest PP2 I saw while shopping was VIN 1FA6P8CF4J5170487 advertised through Ted Russell Ford in Knoxville, TN for $42,636, and was also equipped with Recaro's and active exhaust. It wouldn't be unreasonable to get that car closer to $38K with rebates, and if you ditched the active exhaust and Recaro's it might be a $36K car. Screaming deal for a PP2.

On the other end of the scale, the most expensive PP2 I saw while shopping was $53,170 @ Jerry's Leesburg Ford in VA. That was VIN 1FA6P8CF7J5153828 with 401A, Safe/Smart, 12" LCD, floor mats...

Those were great prices.
I got mine for $43k and change, special ordered.
The PP2 is great bang for the buck...

 

[Troutwrangler]

Thanks for the replies fellas!

I did not know that the PP2 came standard with MR.

So based on the Window Sticker snip I included a few posts back, would both of you consider that PP2 to be “fully loaded”? I tried looking for the option packages as suggested but still can’t tell if every option was selected on that window sticker.

If not fully loaded, that car is heavily optioned at the least.
IIRC the 401A package was for the premium Mustang GT, so you're already getting a lot of extra "options" with the premium package. Then add in the specific options priced out on that sticker and you must be getting close to the top.
If the sticker price is near the mid $50k range, you're in "fully loaded" territory.

 

[Kermitz]

The front fender liners are unique to the PP2. I’m not aware of any differences in the rear.

Do you or anyone else know the part numbers for the front fender liners?
I'm curious as to what exactly is different between the PP1 & PP2?

 

[Bluezeke]

This is my sticker. No safe and sound, no enhanced security and no upgraded floor mats. Might be pushing 54k if you checked every box.

 

[Biggus Dickus]

2% is a good correction factor, but I'm pretty sure it works the other way in this case.

The speedometer of a car perfectly calibrated for 305/30-19's will read lower than actual when fitted with 325/30-19's. IOW, 200 on the speedometer would be 204 on the cop's radar gun. The real bottom line here is that I wouldn't worry about it anyway, even with the error not being in my favor as the driver (1.5 mph @ 75)


I'm also of the opinion that while 11" is listed as an acceptable width wheel for 325/30 tires (any diameter), it's a mildly "pinched" fitment and won't extract the best handling performance from a 325/30 tire.

Norm

Agreed on 325s. I run 315/30 19s, which are good for an 11" rear, but selection is very limited.

On my car, the speedo actually overestimates speed (when compared to how fast Waze says I'm going). Which doesn't surprise me because I don't think a PP2 is "perfectly calibrated" for 305/30s - the 305/30s actually result in a shorter gear effect ( maybe ~3.90), compared to a 275/40-19 like on a PP1. This makes a PP2 fun, and the effect is enhanced by light tires (PSC2s - about the lightest tires you can find in this size), and aftermarket forged wheels (a worthwhile investment as stock PP2 rims are heavy).

 

[Biggus Dickus]

This is my sticker. No safe and sound, no enhanced security and no upgraded floor mats. Might be pushing 54k if you checked every box.

Mine stickered at 46545 - PP2, 301A, Cloth Recaros - no mas. "Free" paint.

IMO - Recaros are worth every penny in this car.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Contact wear pattern is excellent w/the 325s (I just ran thru my 1st set of Continentals @ 30+k). I just happen to prefer the tighter feel of the 325 v. the increased (albeit small) sidewall flex of the 305 on the backside.

Unless MIchelin has done something different in the carcass of the 325, a 305 would have less sidewall flex than a 325. That's part of why mildly stretched tire and wheel combinations work better than pinched combinations.

I'm not surprised about the wear pattern being good.


Easy to spend Other Peoples' Money dep't: I bet the 325's would work even better on 12's . . .


Norm

 

[Fly2High]

Good info!
I've never seen a side by side view of the PP1 and PP2....
I think there's a YT video of some guy who put PP2 wheels and tires on a "regular" Mustang GT. Makes the stock suspension Mustang GT look like it has a 4" lift kit on it.

You do realize that the back tires on a PP1 are 275/40R19 while the PP2 has 305/30R19?

The 275 are 27.7" in diameter while the 305 are 26.2". There is a reason the backs looks different. It is because they are!!

Even the front PP1 tire (255/40R19) is larger than the 305/30R19. The 255 is 27" in diameter.

Of course that smaller tire does improve affective final drive ratio. your 3.73 rear really acts like a 3.94! Every little bit counts. This is why I wonder why anyone would want to increase tire diameter just for looks. Sure, it might be aesthetically pleasing but it will slow the car down. I guess speed and handling is not paramount to everyone but it is often a GT where they do it. To each their own. As long as they keep buying Mustangs, I am happy.

I have a fully loaded PP2 = 401A, mats, active exhaust, Safe package, B&O sound system, - the works. The only option I did not get were the Recaros. This is my daily driver and I wanted comfort there.

So far, the only things I have done to the car were:
1. trunk liner (free from Ford)
2. winter wheels and tires(VMR V710 : 19x9, Blizzak LM-32 : 275/35R19)
3. Raceseng leather shift knob - Stratose (custom - brushed instead of all black. Matches the interior perfectly)

 

[Troutwrangler]

I knew the PSC2 tires were shorter, but never checked out the actual measurements.
Quite a difference in tire height....
Good points brought up by everyone mentioning tire size, gearing, speedometer, etc.

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