PP2 Cooling Upgrades? Per criticism…

[luc]

Well it seems neither does LMR, his is copied right off their sight. Notice they say it can improve handle and reduce under steer. So go suck on that for a while.

WHAT IS A STAGGERED WHEEL AND TIRE SETUP?
Mustangs have always been known to be an affordable vehicle to get some of the most impressive performance numbers that money can buy. Many enthusiasts often upgrade their Mustang with staggered wheels and tires to improve both the performance and looks of their car. Unfortunately, staggered wheels and tires can be a pretty intimidating change for some, but it doesn't have to be.

A staggered wheel and tire setup is when you have different-width wheels on your car, with the two wider wheels at the back of the car. This staggered setup is often used on sports cars like the popular Ford Mustang GT and is meant to enhance the driving experience. Depending on what you use your car for, staggered wheels and tires can improve traction and power transfer or reduce the understeer and rotational mass of your car.

PROS OF STAGGERED WHEELS AND TIRES
The staggered wheel and tire setup have several pros with a popular improvement being handling. Another pro is that staggered setups arguably look more appealing than squared setups. Additionally, staggered wheel and tire setups can provide more traction and power transfer to the ground.

BENEFITS

• Improved handling.
• Looks more aggressive than squared setups.
• More traction and power transfer to the ground.

CONS OF STAGGERED WHEELS AND TIRES
One of the main cons of staggered wheel and tire setups is that they can be more expensive than squared setups. The staggered wheel and tire setup will also eliminate the ability to rotate your tires in a normal fashion. With two different-sized tires on each side, you will not be able to rotate your tires from the front to the back.

DISADVANTAGES

• More difficult to rotate tires.
• Are usually more expensive and heavier.

With all due respect, you are stupid if you believe everything you read on the internet
And yes, they are dead wrong. Finding somebody else wrong do not make you right
It’s why i said that you know crap about physics and car handling, otherwise you would have known that they are wrong
Educate yourself before being a parrot and making stupid comments
Just for fun, explain how smaller tires on the front of a mustang, compared to the rear can reduce understeer instead of promoting it ?
it’s your opportunity to show your knowledge

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[Arknsawchuck]

With all due respect, you are stupid if you believe everything you read on the internet
And yes, they are dead wrong. Finding somebody else wrong do not make you right
It’s why i said that you know crap about physics and car handling, otherwise you would have known that they are wrong
Educate yourself before being a parrot and making stupid comments

Well when I get info from a place that specializes is performance cars I lean towards believing them. Plus I’ve never said that staggered is better than squared. I’ve stated several times that I currently run a square setup. I just mentioned that it can work on some cars depending upon how the car is setup.

so I should believe you, some random self proclaimed expert instead of a reputable shop that does it for a living. Got it.

 

[tosha]

Plus I’ve never said that staggered is better than squared.

Sorry, but I don't think anybody understands what you are trying to say at this point.

I just mentioned that it can work on some cars depending upon how the car is setup.

what does this even mean? what do you mean by "some cars"? we are discussing S550 platform. how do you need to set up S550 mustang to make it work and why would it not work if it's not set up in a certain way?

so I should believe you, some random self proclaimed expert instead of a reputable shop that does it for a living.

try believing a common sense and laws of physics, maybe? front-heavy car, bigger contact patch at where the weight is, etc. look at audi, that tries to cure terminal understeer of their performance cars by installing narrower tires at the back.

 

[Ewheels]

If I change my original response, will it stop all this drama?

@Redmcguire and @plresultsman originally asked how to get PP2 level performance or better.

New response:
The goal is to get as much tire under the car as possible, especially on the front wheels as Mustangs are front heavy. In general, the wider the tires, the faster you can take a turn. Most track mustang folks have found that 305 square is the "golden ticket" as it's the widest you can go on the front without needing to cut things and by running the same size wheel/tire front and rear, you can rotate your tires which extends tire life and saves you money.
Some people have had success with a wider tire in the rear. This typically induces understeer, which most drivers try to avoid, but if that suits your driving style, do what works for you.

 

[Arknsawchuck]

Sorry, but I don't think anybody understands what you are trying to say at this point.

what does this even mean? what do you mean by "some cars"? we are discussing S550 platform. how do you need to set up S550 mustang to make it work and why would it not work if it's not set up in a certain way?

try believing a common sense and laws of physics, maybe? front-heavy car, bigger contact patch at where the weight is, etc. look at audi, that tries to cure terminal understeer of their performance cars by installing narrower tires at the back.

Good grief, look I'm gonna type this nice and slow for folks like you that can't read or seem to grasp what's being said.
First, it was said that staggered is ONLY for drag and show. I then listed several ford cars that are built for the track and come staggered.
Second, I've never said staggered is better. Oh and for the slow witted, "some cars" on a mustang forum is mustangs.
Third, I don't give a crap what you think or what you run on your car. Hell we probably are running the same size tires on our cars.
And finally I'm done trying to reason with folks like you, you're to slow to comprehend what I'm saying or just twisting it around to have a argument.
So go enjoy whatever tire setup you like to run and have fun at the track.

 

[PhillyMike]

Regarding the topic this thread devolved into: isn’t as simple as:

There is nothing inherently ‘wrong’ with a staggered setup but it will reduce front grip and create understeer on a mustang or similar front engine RWD car. This will prevent a skilled driver from running the fastest potential lap time vs a square set up using the widest tires that will fit. On a mustang this is 305’s., and demonstrated in competition.

Running fronts narrower than rear may be a reasonable choice on this particular car if you want an easy way to create understeer bias due to driver preference. It will be inherently slower lap potential but this probably irrelevant for most without experience/skill to be running at the handling limit and trying to minimize lap time.

 

[tosha]

So go enjoy whatever tire setup you like to run and have fun at the track.

thank you for the advise, I will make sure to do so

And finally I'm done trying to reason with folks like you, you're to slow to comprehend what I'm saying or just twisting it around to have a argument.

Take a deep breath and chill, getting so nervous over some posts on internet is bad for your health.

 

[Redmcguire]

If I change my original response, will it stop all this drama?

@Redmcguire and @plresultsman originally asked how to get PP2 level performance or better.

New response:
The goal is to get as much tire under the car as possible, especially on the front wheels as Mustangs are front heavy. In general, the wider the tires, the faster you can take a turn. Most track mustang folks have found that 305 square is the "golden ticket" as it's the widest you can go on the front without needing to cut things and by running the same size wheel/tire front and rear, you can rotate your tires which extends tire life and saves you money.
Some people have had success with a wider tire in the rear. This typically induces understeer, which most drivers try to avoid, but if that suits your driving style, do what works for you.

I appreciate the tip. Didn't mean to start a soap opera. I'd ask a question about back spacing and off set for a "square" set up, but I think heads would explode. I'll research.

 

[Redmcguire]

FP Track handling pack going on today. Likely run 305 square for backroads and road courses as this is "kind of" what PP2 cars run (10.5 front/ 11 rear). Currently have the PP1 staggard set up. I think I can achieve a square (305) set up with 10s on all 4 corners. Just wondering about fitment issues with the FP Track Pack and wondering if you can actually rotate front to back if backspacing and offset are different (are they)? Will get a drag second setup for the 1/4. Sounds basic, but it's my first mustang. Been riding motorcycles 30 years... waited for the kids to grow up to get my pony.

 

[Redmcguire]

Apologies for taking this thread off cooling track. Back to cooling. I'm wrapping my exhaust today and going to run redline in the diff. I will only occasionally track my car, so I think this should be sufficient?

 

[luc]

FP Track handling pack going on today. Likely run 305 square for backroads and road courses as this is "kind of" what PP2 cars run (10.5 front/ 11 rear). Currently have the PP1 staggard set up. I think I can achieve a square (305) set up with 10s on all 4 corners. Just wondering about fitment issues with the FP Track Pack and wondering if you can actually rotate front to back if backspacing and offset are different (are they)? Will get a drag second setup for the 1/4. Sounds basic, but it's my first mustang. Been riding motorcycles 30 years... waited for the kids to grow up to get my pony.

305 are too wide for 10” rim
10” with 35et can be rotated all around
To run 305 you want 11” rim
Either you use the same offset and you can rotate but that requires 1” spacer in front with obviously longer studs, or you can get wheels with different offset but can’t rotate

 

[luc]

Apologies for taking this threat off track. Back to cooling. I'm wrapping my exhaust today and going to run redline in the diff. I will only occasionally track my car, so I think this should be sufficient?

Yes it will be

 

[tosha]

FP Track handling pack going on today. Likely run 305 square for backroads and road courses as this is "kind of" what PP2 cars run (10.5 front/ 11 rear). Currently have the PP1 staggard set up. I think I can achieve a square (305) set up with 10s on all 4 corners. Just wondering about fitment issues with the FP Track Pack and wondering if you can actually rotate front to back if backspacing and offset are different (are they)? Will get a drag second setup for the 1/4. Sounds basic, but it's my first mustang. Been riding motorcycles 30 years... waited for the kids to grow up to get my pony.

You know that your PP1 stock wheels are not 10s, right?

 

[Redmcguire]

You know that your PP1 stock wheels are not 10s, right?

Yes, 9.5 and 9 respectively. So, I am researching which is the better square setup. PP2 has 10.5 and 11 set up and runs 305s.

 

[tosha]

Yes, 9.5 and 9 respectively. So, I am researching which is the better square setup. PP2 has 10.5 and 11 set up and runs 305s.

11 wheels with around 52-53 offset, 25mm spacers up front with extended ARP studs, camber plates up front with around -2.5-2.7 front camber, up to -1.6 camber in the rear - this setup will give you rotatable set of wheels that don't poke, wear well on track and can be used on street just fine. If you want to add some protection for your car paintwork, I strongly recommend to add a set of rokblokz flaps.

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