Opinions Engine oil for ROUSH stage 2 blower 5W50?

[stanger1]

I have a 2017 RS3 and since I don't do any Track Days or extend WFO events, I just run Pennzoil 5w30 Ultra Platinum.
It kind of splits the difference in weights and Walmart.com, it's about $55.00 for 2 -5 quart bottles. Very good price.

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[Azul Assasin]

I use Redline 5w50 full synthetic in my opinion the best oil you can use.

 

[Angrey]

Never talk about motor oil, religion or politics online. In that order.

Having said that, the best resource for lubricants and discussion is bobistheoilguy. That's where you'll find more than just opinions, a bunch of geeks and engineers and hardcore guys who dig up everything from technical information not readily available to the public to actual oil analysis data and real world metrics.

The reality is, MOST people could run just about anything and not observe an appreciable difference.

The problem with discussing motor oil is that it's incredibly complex with so many inputs and outputs.

Most concerns are split between fleet/long term use concerns (like running a fleet of taxi cabs or delivery trucks for hundreds of thousands of miles) or harsh/intense use (like racing teams).

As long as you're in the proper blend/weight, you could honestly run just about anything and unless you're beating the shit out of your car or you're talking about 200k miles of stop and go driving, it ain't gonna honestly move the needle. As long as you're changing your oil and filter often, for most guys, it ain't gonna really matter.

1) Keep in mind that manufacturers (like Ford) have to sanction use of oil that meets a lot of criteria. The "C" certification in many cases isn't the "best" and is limited because of concerns over additives that can damage catalytic converters. So while there are things that are VERY good for your motor, they might be BAD for your cats. Obviously if you're a race team, you don't care much about cats. So there are great oils like Driven and Redline, etc that won't meet certain certs, but that's not because they're inferior from a performance perspective, it's because they're more for race/harsh use and not for EPA/CARB/50 State legal use for passenger cars with catalytic converters and fuel economy concerns.

2) Just because an oil advertises certain properties, doesn't mean it REMAINS that way. Depending on how an oil reaches it's initial capabilities (through starting "stock" or additives) can affect how long it will actually HOLD that initial level of lubrication and protection. There are oils that start out great, but in a VERY short time, they can "shear" and end up being the equivalent of some much lower blend. Motorcraft (5w-50) is notorious for this. It's great sitting in the bottle, but it doesn't take long for it to shear and settle into basically a 40 weight. And yes, for all the Amsoil nutswingers, Amsoil does the same thing.

3) There are bases and stock (kinda like the base ingredient in a soup) that are better. Redline is esther based. Driven is an MPAO stock. Both are better than MOST of the typical big names on the market for resisting shear and breaking down under harsh use. Most of the usual suspects are what's called "PAO" stock.

4) The best metrics that you can use if you're HT/HS which is generally a European standard. The other factors are things like ZDDP (which is great protection for stuff like valve train components but bad for cats). Moly content, etc. So basically HT/HS and then whatever friction modifiers and coatings for cold start up, and starting with a stock that resists cutting and shearing. Then lower end concerns are things like NOACK or the oil's propensity to evaporate off at high temp.

Driven, Redline, Motul do a much better job of resisting viscosity drop, especially if you're running E85 that can cut/contaminate the oil, because they start off from a different stock.

In summary, all this brain damage, for MOST people, unless you're running 30 hours of 5k+ rpm HPDE each season or 100 drag passes a year or you're driving your car for 300k miles in city stop and go traffic, it's highly doubtful anyone will actually see or be able to notice a difference. You're talking about fractions of grams of material loss on bearings and wear surfaces.

If you're not a dedicated track rat or a drag only car or a taxi cab, you can probably get away with one of the well known usual suspects (like Motorcraft, Amsoil, Pennz Platinum, Castrol, Rotella, etc). If you're one of the groups I outlined, then there are oils like Redline and Driven that were engineered SPECIFICALLY for that (without being concerned about cats or fuel economy or cost).

 

[engineermike]

@Angrey some of the “usual suspects” use base oils as good as the $$$ boutique oils but admittedly you have to dig a little harder to ensure this. I would, however, argue that the usual suspects have much larger r&d budgets and could turn out a better oil for a fraction of the capstone vs boutiques.

 

[Angrey]

@Angrey some of the “usual suspects” use base oils as good as the $$$ boutique oils but admittedly you have to dig a little harder to ensure this. I would, however, argue that the usual suspects have much larger r&d budgets and could turn out a better oil for a fraction of the capstone vs boutiques.

The proof is generally in the pudding. When observing HT/HS or any of the cP values at a comparative temp(s) and then doing it after use to compare kinda bears out which ones start with better stuff.

I'm always open to learning new stuff and getting better stuff so if there's one of the usual suspects that has an HT/HS that's superior, let me know.

Admittedly, Driven starts with a lower HT/HS but seems to hold it pretty solidly.

 

[engineermike]

I do agree HTHS is a good metric for high performance oil, which is one reason I like the A3/B4 spec over any of the API specs. And while retention of HTHS might indicate a lower dose of VII and, thus, a higher quality base oil, I haven’t seen HTHS widely reported in UOA’s.

One oil I like but never bought was Castrol 5w30 A3/B4 which is surprisingly at Walmart now for $25/jug. I think it’s a good choice for anyone not wanting to stray away from oem viscosity recommendation but also want the higher performance that a higher HTHS gives you, plus increased protection from a higher ZDDP concentration. It’s probably “just” a Group 3 base oil though.

BTW not sure if you knew this but virgin oil HTHS is strongly correlated to the summer viscosity rating. An old group 2 20w50 has a very high HTHS.

 

[illtal]

I Choose the double ester route.... keeps the engine spotless

Motul 300V

 

[tosha]

I Choose the double ester route.... keeps the engine spotless

Motul 300V

But they don't seem to have 5w-50...

 

[illtal]

But they don't seem to have 5w-50...

hmm you're right. I use the 5w-40

 

[tosha]

hmm you're right. I use the 5w-40

So Motul 300v itself is great, but it's not within recommended specs and unfortunately they don't have what is prescribed for sc mustangs.

Anybody using liquid moly, any pros and cons for this one?

 

[illtal]

So Motul 300v itself is great, but it's not within recommended specs and unfortunately they don't have what is prescribed for sc mustangs.

Anybody using liquid moly, any pros and cons for this one?

I am SC. I used to run the 5w-20 semi synth ford stuff. I just changed my 3 times as fast. Honestly, with 10 Quarts in there without racing the car oil degradation is not a factor unless you are running some extreme temps.
With the 300V, I let it stay in there the whole year now (not a daily - 18 GT with 16k miles)

 

[tosha]

I am SC. I used to run the 5w-20 semi synth ford stuff. I just changed my 3 times as fast. Honestly, with 10 Quarts in there without racing the car oil degradation is not a factor unless you are running some extreme temps.
With the 300V, I let it stay in there the whole year now (not a daily - 18 GT with 16k miles)

Sure, your car, your choises)))
I wouldn't run 5w20 on SC car at all, and wouldn't do 16k miles between oil changes either. Probably, nothing catastrophic would happen if you do it, but the properly spec'd oil is so inexpensive and available everywhere. I'll just stick to 5w50 and will change it at least twice for similar mileage.

Again, it's everyone's personal choice and decisions.

 

[illtal]

Sure, your car, your choises)))
I wouldn't run 5w20 on SC car at all, and wouldn't do 16k miles between oil changes either. Probably, nothing catastrophic would happen if you do it, but the properly spec'd oil is so inexpensive and available everywhere. I'll just stick to 5w50 and will change it at least twice for similar mileage.

Again, it's everyone's personal choice and decisions.

If you're gonna take that stance, you should just run what you want and don't even ask for opinions. I've been on here for years (and lurking a bit before I joined), heard of lots of people running lots of combinations of stuff. Without hard analysis and breaking down multiple engines and testing them all it's just opinions and conjecture anyways.

 

[stanger1]

If in doubt, just send an oil Sample to Blackstone Labs, and they can tell you exactly what your oil choice is doing and then you will know.

 

[tosha]

If you're gonna take that stance, you should just run what you want and don't even ask for opinions. I've been on here for years (and lurking a bit before I joined), heard of lots of people running lots of combinations of stuff. Without hard analysis and breaking down multiple engines and testing them all it's just opinions and conjecture anyways.

Hope you don't mind that my opinion is different from yours, that's what makes a good discussion after all.

As far as engine oil viscocity is concerned, I actually prefer to rely on manufacturer recommendation exactly because I'm hoping that they did hard analysis and broke down multiple engines and tested them extensively during product development. Might as well not be the case, but at least there is hope. Us putting random stuff outside recommended specs is just guessing.

There are other parts where I can use my judgement and tons of community knowledge to improve what ford engineered in these cars, but in my opinion engine oil is one of the areas, where without hard analysis date I would rather trust manufacturer guidelines.

Take it easy, it's Friday after all ;)

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