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My car is crooked...

TeeLew

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Why would one ever measure ride height from the center of the hex on junction with an eccentric washer adjuster?
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btcarmd

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Why would one ever measure ride height from the center of the hex on junction with an eccentric washer adjuster?
Because the center of the hex never moves in relation to the arm it is mounted to. The difference in height between the two mounting bolts effectively tells you the angle of that lower arm which translates into ride height. The eccentric is only allowing you to change alignment angle but has little affect on the height of the arm.
 

btcarmd

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Those numbers, and the explanation, are confusing. Generally speaking, you want to choose a point which is on/near axle centerline for that end of the car and integral to the subframe, but in a protected spot (so it doesn't get damaged if the car hits the ground).
There can be to many variables when measuring that way. Ride height measurements are really meant to check for equal and accurate geometry of the suspension. Why would there be any better way to take that measurement then on the suspension? There might be easier ways like from wheel to inner fender but they can lead to variances like the OP is experiencing. If he truly wants to see if his measurements are suspension geometry related he needs to measure as described. If that measurement shows good results then suspension is good and the numbers he is seeing at the fender won't have any affect on the handling of the car.
 

Jackson1320

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The suspension and weight balance is set up with the assumption that a average weight man in the driver seat. Put someone in the seat and check again
 

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Ride height measurements are really meant to check for equal and accurate geometry of the suspension. Why would there be any better way to take that measurement then on the suspension?
The suspension points are all on the subframe. The reason you measure the subframe instead of the actual points themselves is accessibility & repeatability. Measuring from the eye-balled middle of a bolt head (particularly one on eccentric washers) to some sort of arbitrary datum is not the way to do it.
 

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btcarmd

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The suspension points are all on the subframe. The reason you measure the subframe instead of the actual points themselves is accessibility & repeatability. Measuring from the eye-balled middle of a bolt head (particularly one on eccentric washers) to some sort of arbitrary datum is not the way to do it.
So what are you comparing this number to other than the other side of car? How will you know if you have spring sag or some other issues affecting both sides equally? please dont think I'm trying to argue with you or trying to debate the usefulness of any of these measurements. I'm always open to new ways to diagnose problem cars.
 

Norm Peterson

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The suspension points are all on the subframe. The reason you measure the subframe instead of the actual points themselves is accessibility & repeatability. Measuring from the eye-balled middle of a bolt head (particularly one on eccentric washers) to some sort of arbitrary datum is not the way to do it.
The actual points are the points you want to use - that's how the chassis side height is determined.

I don't know what Ford's measuring tool for this looks like, but it's not like estimating the center of a hex-head to within about a sixteenth of an inch would be all that difficult. Worst case, draw intersecting lines drawn through pairs of opposite corners of the hex.


Norm
 

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I had an old fox body that was 1.5" different from left to right (new from the factory that way). Dealer fixed under warranty by stacking 1.5"s of washers on the low suspension side. I kid you not - kept me away from Ford's until my 2020 HEP, but I'm sure allowable tolerances are much lower now!
 

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I had an old fox body that was 1.5" different from left to right (new from the factory that way). Dealer fixed under warranty by stacking 1.5"s of washers on the low suspension side. I kid you not - kept me away from Ford's until my 2020 HEP, but I'm sure allowable tolerances are much lower now!
GM was just as bad. I preordered a '77 Delta 88 Royale with F41. Factory only put the F41 springs on one front and one rear on a diagonal. Car was almost a tricycle with weight on the two F41 corners and alternating between one of the others. LoL

Dealer claimed GM would only approve putting the F41 parts on the other two corners if the ride height varied by x amount from side to side. Dealer also claimed it didn't. When I called BS they took me to the middle of a back lot where the car was straddling numerous parking spots at an angle with the necessary wheels in dips in the pavement.

Apparently they believed my promise to beat them senseless if they didn't put the springs I ordered on the other two corners because it only took them a few days to get and install them.
 
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TeeLew

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The actual points are the points you want to use - that's how the chassis side height is determined.

I don't know what Ford's measuring tool for this looks like, but it's not like estimating the center of a hex-head to within about a sixteenth of an inch would be all that difficult. Worst case, draw intersecting lines drawn through pairs of opposite corners of the hex.


Norm
You realize that one of their points was on the toe link eccentric bolt head?

I'll measure to a hard point on the chassis. You measure to whatever you please.
 

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dps

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GM was just as bad. I preordered a '77 Delta 88 Royale with F41. Factory only put the F41 springs on one front and one rear on a diagonal. Car was almost a tricycle with weight on the two F41 corners and alternating between one of the others. LoL

Dealer claimed GM would only approve putting the F41 parts on the other two corners if the ride height varied by x amount from side to side. Dealer also claimed it didn't. When I called BS they took me to the middle of a back lot where the car was straddling numerous parking spots at an angle with the necessary wheels in dips in the pavement.

Apparently they believed my promise to beat them senseless if they didn't put the springs I ordered on the other two corners because it only took them a few days to get and install them.
Makes sense. I was literally a high-school kid when they pulled this on me.
 

Norm Peterson

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You realize that one of their points was on the toe link eccentric bolt head?
Yes.

But since toe registers off of the eccentric (for non-adjustable toe links) rather than the bolt I'd expect the bolt to slide in a horizontal slot as opposed to being fixed in a round hole. Note that the "fences" for the eccentric allow for relative vertical movement (sliding) to occur there., which wouldn't affect bolt height.

The bolt simply serves to lock the adjustment in place.

It's really the solution I'd expect from a bumpsteer point of view, where altering the height of either toe link pivot would change the bumpsteer curve.


Norm
 
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emcmtony

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There are WAY too many variable to be alarmed. Tire wear, tire pressure, concrete leveling, weight in vehicle, angle of view reading tape etc, etc. i Would not worry about it at all.
 

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You realize that one of their points was on the toe link eccentric bolt head?

I'll measure to a hard point on the chassis. You measure to whatever you please.
The eccentric has no affect on that measurement. You could turn that eccentric anywhere in its 360deg of rotation and it will not change that height measurement.
 

btcarmd

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There are WAY too many variable to be alarmed. Tire wear, tire pressure, concrete leveling, weight in vehicle, angle of view reading tape etc, etc. i Would not worry about it at all.
The benefit of the method used is it removes most of the variables you have listed. Tire size, pressure, floor will have no affect. The weight in vehicle absolutely will but that is the case in any measurement. The last two depend on the technician and their ability to perform a task accurately. Not necessarily any easy measurement to make without the OEM tool but certainly can be done with a level and appropriate measuring device. Tape measure probably accurate enough in most cases. Ford and many other manufacturers use this method because it removes most variables.
I will ask the question again: If you are using a method other than the one listed by the manufacturer, what specifications are you comparing your measurement to? Just because the measurement is equal left to right does not mean you are in specification. Maybe we are looking at this measurement from two different perspectives. The OP was really just concerned about the body of the car sitting uneven but had no complaint about drivability. As Norm stated, when these angels get way out of whack they can cause steering and handling complaints.
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