Mustang GT vs ... (Post whatever you've raced and how it went)

m3incorp

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I like your honesty. A lot of people don't give the M cars the credit they deserve. I am sure there will be people that will say no way the M4 could walk your car but I think most of those people have never run up against an M driver that will really race the car. Us manuals, have to be careful with those M cars. Now from a roll, it can be a different story.


Finally got to run with an M4…It was interesting in that whomever got the jump would walk the other one…

ie; if I got the jump he couldn’t catch me, and vice versa.

….I’m guessing that he wasn’t stock 444hp, but who knows?!?
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Mikthehun1

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I like your honesty. A lot of people don't give the M cars the credit they deserve. I am sure there will be people that will say no way the M4 could walk your car but I think most of those people have never run up against an M driver that will really race the car. Us manuals, have to be careful with those M cars. Now from a roll, it can be a different story.
Aren't manual drivers one bad shift away from losing to a Prius :giggle:
 

Sivi70980

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Aren't manual drivers one bad shift away from losing to a Prius :giggle:
If nothing breaks, I would hope you could recover in time but it's all circumstantial. I usually shift better in a race. I raced my friend's 2011 M5 with my 2009 Mini Cooper JCW in a parking lot. Launched near perfect at got to a little over 60 in the small space. He couldn't even wind up 1st gear really. Then we raced starting at 60mph, I had zero chance of course. It's usually when I stop at a random stop sign or something that I'll do my annual stall or when I think too much about making the smoothest shift humanity has ever seen and I'll completely chunk it and look in the rear view mirror to make sure parts aren't on the road behind me.
 

wingnutt

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I like your honesty. A lot of people don't give the M cars the credit they deserve. I am sure there will be people that will say no way the M4 could walk your car but I think most of those people have never run up against an M driver that will really race the car. Us manuals, have to be careful with those M cars. Now from a roll, it can be a different story.
oh I have always liked the M cars…the M4 was on my short list before I found my 350R.

I agree they dont get the credit they deserve, as they are underrated right from the factory @420 wheel in stock form. then throw on a good tune and they are a sneeze away from 500 to the tires…just don’t tell @Mikthehun1 cause hes allergic to German cars 😂
 

Sivi70980

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oh I have always liked the M cars…the M4 was on my short list before I found my 350R.

I agree they dont get the credit they deserve, as they are underrated right from the factory @420 wheel in stock form. then throw on a good tune and they are a sneeze away from 500 to the tires…just don’t tell @Mikthehun1 cause hes allergic to German cars 😂
It's not that they aren't great, they just don't last, and it costs a premium to keep them going after 100k miles. That's why they're the ultimate leasing machines.
 

Mikthehun1

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oh I have always liked the M cars…the M4 was on my short list before I found my 350R.

I agree they dont get the credit they deserve, as they are underrated right from the factory @420 wheel in stock form. then throw on a good tune and they are a sneeze away from 500 to the tires…just don’t tell @Mikthehun1 cause hes allergic to German cars 😂
Nah, I'm allergic to the cult-like following, I think it might be the cultist dander :crackup:

"Underrating" is not a thing that happens. Not if they want to have an SAE certified rating. Downtuning, maybe, but you can say the same about any performance car that needs to meet emission and fuel standards. With "a good tune" (Ford performance) the Coyote picks up at peak 19HP/18 ft-lb, not to mention 42 ft-lb at 2000 RPM.
 

beetle6986

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Finally got to run with an M4…It was interesting in that whomever got the jump would walk the other one…

ie; if I got the jump he couldn’t catch me, and vice versa.

….I’m guessing that he wasn’t stock 444hp, but who knows?!?
They pretty much run identical times stock for stock to a GT350R.
 

m3incorp

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I can agree with that. I never actually kept one long enough to hit 100k. The upkeep can get to be rather expensive, I admit.

It's not that they aren't great, they just don't last, and it costs a premium to keep them going after 100k miles. That's why they're the ultimate leasing machines.
 

wingnutt

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"Underrating" is not a thing that happens.
that’s a cute theory you have there, but if you have been following BMW as long as you say then you would know they do it all the time…

https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a35852803/it-sure-seems-like-bmw-underrated-the-m3-and-m4s-473-hp/

https://www.motor1.com/news/494653/2021-bmw-m4-dyno-test/

https://www.motorauthority.com/news...eals-just-how-much-horsepower-it-really-makes

They pretty much run identical times stock for stock to a GT350R.
agreed 👍🏼
 

Mikthehun1

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Hey, you believe what you need to get to sleep at night.

https://www.sae.org/standards/development/about-saej1349-certified-power/

That's info from a real governing standards body, not an automotive blogger. There's only a 1% tolerance in the standard, and they closed a lot of loopholes in the rating process. Get some fact, than come back and see me.
 

wingnutt

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LOL, oh cmon man….your link proves my point, there’s your facts right there. They CAN underrate the engine all day long, what they cannot do, is overrate 😎

“ J1349® was updated last year to eliminate some ambiguities that allowed engine makers to cite power and torque ratings higher than the engine's actual capabilities. Engine makers are free to cite power and torque figures drived from testing conducted outside the scope of the SAE standards, but they may not claim the figures are SAE-certifed. "

I would love to argue with ya all day long, but I help my brother run an AWD dyno in the Bay Area and have personally seen the underratings 🍺
 

Mikthehun1

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LOL, oh cmon man….your link proves my point, there’s your facts right there. They CAN underrate the engine all day long, what they cannot do, is overrate 😎

“ J1349® was updated last year to eliminate some ambiguities that allowed engine makers to cite power and torque ratings higher than the engine's actual capabilities. Engine makers are free to cite power and torque figures drived from testing conducted outside the scope of the SAE standards, but they may not claim the figures are SAE-certifed. "

I would love to argue with ya all day long, but I help my brother run an AWD dyno in the Bay Area and have personally seen the underratings 🍺
Source: my brother has a dyno :crackup:

Gotta love anecdata!
 

wingnutt

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Source: my brother has a dyno :crackup:

Gotta love anecdata!
no sir…source is your own link 😉

im not sure what you want here; the car mags show it, the dyno shows it, I have seen it, and your article supports it.
….somehow I don’t think you can be convinced 😂
 

Idaho2018GTPremium

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oh I have always liked the M cars…the M4 was on my short list before I found my 350R.

I agree they dont get the credit they deserve, as they are underrated right from the factory @420 wheel in stock form. then throw on a good tune and they are a sneeze away from 500 to the tires…just don’t tell @Mikthehun1 cause hes allergic to German cars 😂
I agree they are underrated when compared to the SAE standard based on the trap speeds and dynos I've seen as well. I haven't confirmed this, but I suspect that both Porsche and BMW rate their hp at terrible conditions, i.e., 100F @ 6000' above sea level, so the density altitude is absurdly high. Then, when compared to the SAE standard (which equates to roughly 2000' density altitude IIRC), those engines will obviously make a lot more power.
 
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