Michelin Pilot Sport All Season 4 - ON TRACK (ANSWERED)

[shogun32]

Legal scholar kingTuna to point out the meaning of "should not" in a consumer-facing non-legal document filing, in 3 ... 2 ... 1.

This "we" is waiting with baited breath.

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[Hack]

I've been caught out with summer only tires in a freak MN snow storm a few times, and I have to say I have never had an issue. Sure they aren't "optimal", but you can get by. I have heard the horror stories about damage and cracking, but it hasn't happened to me yet. But obviously I haven't driven every summer tire, so it's possible some of them are a lot worse than the Pilot SS tires that were on my GT350. With those tires, I just had to be careful. I would use them as long as there wasn't going to be widespread ice on my commute. Those specific summer only tires were fine in 20 degree temperatures.

I owned snow tires when I drove the PSS in the snow, but we have a lot of days that are cold in the morning, but with highs in the 50s or 60s. So I hate to swap to snow tires if warm weather is forecast for the afternoon.

Another thing I should say to be fair is that I dislike all seasons, but the Michelin 4S all seasons are quite good for all season tires. I use them on my GR86 and they grip better than the "summer only" Primacy Michelins that came on the car. But I use them for street only and to ensure that the car is as practical as possible as an everyday driver during spring, fall and summer (I have snows for winter). I would buy something else for a track day. And the GR86 weighs every bit of 1,000 lbs less than a Mustang, so super sticky tires aren't needed to get sporty handling on the street.

Tires can get really messed up on a track day, and I would really worry that a set of all seasons would be no good for rain or cold after being used on track. I think that might be more likely than having summer tires crack on a 30 degree morning. But obviously it's just a guess, because I haven't used all seasons on track or driven every single summer tire in cold temperatures.

 

[KingKona]

Ok, you asked, I'll show. Direct off the Michelin website you posted a link to. On their tire and tips section regarding the different seasonal type of tires:

No, I asked about 3 tires in specific. Not a generality that's probably 10 year old information that was written by a retarded lawyer.

Do not use, roll, or drop MICHELIN UHP Sport Summer tires with temperatures below 20°F (-7°C). If the tires have been cooled to 20°F (-7°C) or less, let them warm up in a heated space to at least 40°F (5°C) before being installed or moving a vehicle on which they are installed.

8+ year old information. Technology has changed.

 

[Kona5.0h]

Side bar this is on the triple seven performance site. States 2-4 heat cycles and no flat spots. So you got some life left in them.

 

[DemonGT]

Isn't having a second set of track only wheels/tires what is desired even in always warm area's? Iv never tracked my car but from reading on here it sounds like tracking your car will really eat up your tires/brakes. And isn't a good set of tires considered to be important for tracking a car?

 

[RocketGuy3]

I've been caught out with summer only tires in a freak MN snow storm a few times, and I have to say I have never had an issue. Sure they aren't "optimal", but you can get by.

Granted I live in Texas, so I don't have a lot of experience... but the one or two times I've been caught in even the smallest amount of snow or ice in my Mustang, the car becomes a terror, especially if there is any traffic around me. I get home and stay home as quickly as possible when it happens. I just can't imagine any amount of driver skill making this car manageable in a northern state "snow storm" with summer tires.

 

[K4fxd]

I just can't imagine any amount of driver skill making this car manageable in a northern state "snow storm" with summer tires.

I learned to drive on bias ply tires in northern Wisconsin. I also lived on a dirt road. You either learned car control or you drove really slow.

 

[Paul McWhiskey]

Well, these PS4S were on my car and driven at temps down to about 30 degrees only a few times here in Commiefornia in the past 3 years. The rears have 42k on them, the fronts maybe 10-14k less IDK. I will tell you this, the rears had zero grip. You decide if you should drive in cold temps.

 

[RagmopInKona]

All I am going to say is they are labeled "summer" tires and not all season for a reason.
You might get away with driving on them in the cold but if and when you need to stop fast or turn or get theduck out of the way of a out of control vehicle they will fail you.
You are rolling the dice using them in the winter. For most it is not worth the risk. For that reason alone I would never advice someone else that it is ok .
The oem summer tires on my hhp are hockey pucks at 45* not a fan of using them in the cold. Had to a few times and was glad that it was early morning with almost no traffic as they spun at every shift of the a10 with car in snow mode and very light throttle.

 

[DemonGT]

I learned to drive on bias ply tires in northern Wisconsin. I also lived on a dirt road. You either learned car control or you drove really slow.

Exactly

People in southern states should understand that when we get snow up north we do not stop our daily lives and wait it out.

 

[Hack]

Granted I live in Texas, so I don't have a lot of experience... but the one or two times I've been caught in even the smallest amount of snow or ice in my Mustang, the car becomes a terror, especially if there is any traffic around me. I get home and stay home as quickly as possible when it happens. I just can't imagine any amount of driver skill making this car manageable in a northern state "snow storm" with summer tires.

I grew up driving cars with no computer aids and I always loved trying to drift or wag the tail. And on gravel roads at 60 or 70 mph the car is always moving around on you. I got to enjoy the feeling and not be too nervous about it.

But I still have to say that winter driving is a mixed bag. I like the opportunity to practice car control at slow speeds that ice and snow provide. However, it is always possible to get surprised and BOOM you are out of control. Then there are other people on the road and generally they don't have as good of tires as you or I might have on our vehicles. Mostly they are annoying driving way too slowly compared to what I want to do, but sometimes they are a danger because they have crap tires and can't stop or turn.

But the Mustang - if you have decent tires on it - base GT or if you are in weather mode in a GT350 for example, they are really easy to drive on ice. Not great at accelerating, but just as good on the highway or stopping as any other vehicle out there.

 

[Hack]

Well, these PS4S were on my car and driven at temps down to about 30 degrees only a few times here in Commiefornia in the past 3 years. The rears have 42k on them, the fronts maybe 10-14k less IDK. I will tell you this, the rears had zero grip. You decide if you should drive in cold temps.

It's good to know that the PS4S can't handle cold. I took mine off my 2017 GT this winter even though I wasn't going to drive it just so they wouldn't be sitting with the weight of the car on them. The factory PP1 Pirellis are on there and if they crack I won't be too sad about it. They aren't very good compared to the Michelins.

Edit: that's actually a lot of miles on a dedicated summer tire. I think I usually get 25K or less. Maybe I just always wore mine out before they cracked.

 

[bnightstar]

It's good to know that the PS4S can't handle cold. I took mine off my 2017 GT this winter even though I wasn't going to drive it just so they wouldn't be sitting with the weight of the car on them. The factory PP1 Pirellis are on there and if they crack I won't be too sad about it. They aren't very good compared to the Michelins.

Edit: that's actually a lot of miles on a dedicated summer tire. I think I usually get 25K or less. Maybe I just always wore mine out before they cracked.

This is the point PS4S is not a winter tires and despite you guys think that winter tires are a way of tire companies to get your money is the same like with Track Tires. I'm sure you don't go to autocross on your PS4s why would you go on them in the winter ? Different tires have different compounds and different compounds have different operational temperatures just like a street tire is melted when put on a road course for too long it's getting cracked when driven in cold for very long. I can't believe we wasted 4 pages to explain that. I also drive on summer tires in winter sometimes but i don't recommend it. And now i have a set of winter tires for this occasions. And in Bulgaria we used to have winters with 0 to 5F temps and sub 0 temps but not anymore. We used to get a lot of snow but not anymore. Still I think that winter tires perform better at cold temps.

 

[Hack]

This is the point PS4S is not a winter tires and despite you guys think that winter tires are a way of tire companies to get your money is the same like with Track Tires. I'm sure you don't go to autocross on your PS4s why would you go on them in the winter ? Different tires have different compounds and different compounds have different operational temperatures just like a street tire is melted when put on a road course for too long it's getting cracked when driven in cold for very long. I can't believe we wasted 4 pages to explain that. I also drive on summer tires in winter sometimes but i don't recommend it. And now i have a set of winter tires for this occasions. And in Bulgaria we used to have winters with 0 to 5F temps and sub 0 temps but not anymore. We used to get a lot of snow but not anymore. Still I think that winter tires perform better at cold temps.

I 100% agree with you that - in Minnesota - don't drive around on summer tires in the winter. In fact - in Minnesota - there are many fall and spring days that are too cold for summer tires as well. We had a really long and cold winter this year with over 100 inches of snow (the average is in the 80s). However, all the warnings were something I wasn't even aware of in 2015 and 2016 when I owned my GT350 and first drove the car in colder temperatures with summer tires on it. I knew that grip would suffer, but not that there was a chance for damaging them. I think that piece is newer.

Heck, I think the day I purchased the GT350 it was raining and in the low 40s or upper 30s. And I drove out of the dealership with the summer tires at that temperature.

But if I lived in Georgia I might use summer tires year round. It's completely different than doing it in MN.

 

[RocketGuy3]

I grew up driving cars with no computer aids and I always loved trying to drift or wag the tail. And on gravel roads at 60 or 70 mph the car is always moving around on you. I got to enjoy the feeling and not be too nervous about it.

But I still have to say that winter driving is a mixed bag. I like the opportunity to practice car control at slow speeds that ice and snow provide. However, it is always possible to get surprised and BOOM you are out of control. Then there are other people on the road and generally they don't have as good of tires as you or I might have on our vehicles. Mostly they are annoying driving way too slowly compared to what I want to do, but sometimes they are a danger because they have crap tires and can't stop or turn.

But the Mustang - if you have decent tires on it - base GT or if you are in weather mode in a GT350 for example, they are really easy to drive on ice. Not great at accelerating, but just as good on the highway or stopping as any other vehicle out there.

I learned to drive on bias ply tires in northern Wisconsin. I also lived on a dirt road. You either learned car control or you drove really slow.

It's not just about what's possible or what you have the balls to do, it's about what's reasonable. I'm not tryna compare my e-dick to anyone else's here, but I go to the track regularly, and often turn off TC and SC when I do so, as it's fun to get the occasional code browns over there... but I would not want to do so on public roads in traffic in the snow in a hi-po RWD car with summer tires. In a pinch? Sure, many experienced drivers could probably manage in many snowy conditions (even I managed to get home those times I mentioned).

It's possible I just have stronger self preservation instincts than yall lol, but there's also the fact that it is very possible that you DO actually get physically stuck somewhere, with tires that are ultimately slightly treaded hockey pucks in the cold. And then there's the potential for damaging your [very expensive] tires...

Point is I think it's a bit silly to advise someone who is already budget conscious to get summer tires for year round driving when they are concerned about their winter conditions.

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