sakman84
Well-Known Member
- Thread starter
- #1
If you don't know Willow Springs please look up a track diagram, it will help you understand the different turn I'm talking about. It has a great history and is demanding on car and driver alike. It is a very fast course, "Fastest Road in the West. We ran in the typical CW direction. I will work on retrieving my dash cam vids of one of the runs, sorry fellas no sound, I don't like the idea of the dash cam listening to my cursing, conversations, family interactions, ect. on the daily.
Firstly, I'm not a highly experienced track driver, not a track rat by any measure. I have had only about 5 sessions at Willow in 3 different cars, a 2004 G35, 2014 Mustang GT, and now the Mach 1. I paid for one day of professional instruction back in the G35 days, it was the best money I ever spent on a car. Back in 2012 or 2013 I placed 3rd in the Nissan competition held there by Extreme Speed Track Events, and sponsored by Corner 3 garage. My best time in the M1 was 1:40, and was pretty consistent, use this to judge just how much of a grain of salt you want to take my review with. For a snap shots of speed on some turns here they are:
130 MPH going into tun 1.
low to mid 80s turn 2.
carrying 112+ into turn 8.
I know I'm leaving lots of time on the table, and the car provides so much power there were many points, where I didn't rev it out fully or go on to 100% throttle.
Conditions for the day were very cold, it was 22F when I rolled through the gate at track entrance. First session it was probably high 40s. I was concerned about the temps as I had never driven in that cold of conditions and the tires are rated for 45F and up. It never exceeded middle 50s ambient the entire day.
My car is completely stock with 2000 miles. I set tire pressure to 32psi, the supplement manual calls for 30psi. I did not get the car track aligned as the manual calls for. I ran with stock factory alignment, we can only assume it was in spec from factory, it was not measured. The car tracks true and straight and tire wear appears normal. All sessions were conducted in "Track Mode" with Rev Match on. I took it easy on the first session to warm up my skills and the car, it was super fun right out of the gate. Totally made my 2 hour drive and 5am wake up worth it.
Immediate first impressions are how neutral the car is, it is honest. It never lulled me into a false sense of security where I found myself in trouble. When I did get squirrly or improper it was me doing it on purpose or because I was not handling the car correctly. The next thing is the spring rates are really good, so much improved from the S197, and better than the PP cars I drove, I think its the springs and magneride combined. There was never a point where the ass end felt like it was doing its own thing relative to the rest of the car. This is really good as it inspires confidence and allows you to push, and throttle steer on some corners. It might also be the aero enhancements too, key takeaway this Mustang feels much more like you are in it, rather than riding on top of it. There was no excessive vertical motion or rear axle jumping around and body roll is totally acceptable. This track has 2 large elevation changes, so if there were probems in this regard Big Willow will show it. Even with the PS4s, the car is well under control, this is not mess and slide fest. The brakes never faded and always stopped me with confidence. I never activated ABS, something that would routinely happen on track or in the canyons with the S197s Brembo Car. Again, its another performance point where the Mach 1 offers more performance than I my courage will allow me to take advantage of at Big Willow. It performed well all around, I couldn't pin point a particular deficiency.
Thankfully in track mode the traction control is not intrusive. I notice when you go to track mode the traction control light is illuminated. From the manual " traction control intervention is reduced and tuned specifically for track usage only." I'm not a guy who like going sideways all that much, and because of some errors I found myself slipping heavily and sliding around turn 5, I was able to maintain, not fishtail, and save myself from an embarrassing spin out. My front end was hugging the inner rumble strip and ass slipping out wide behind me. The traction control did not feel like it was doing anything at that moment and I was thinking "good they actually let you get silly if you want".
The power of this engine is really something, it loves a course like this. You get to carry a lot of speed and if you are brave wind it out fully in many places on track. 3rd and 4th gears get quite a workout at Big Willow. So many times I was enjoying the sound and seeing the revs build, the coyote is a masterpiece, it has been great in every generation, and this version really is king. The engine just signing around corners and down the long straights. We have wonderful torque and it likes to rev, what more could you ask for? The cylinder head temp never exceeded 200F! Oil pressures were consistent, and the rear diff temp only reached 210F. It is really nice to be on track and not have to worry about cooling, all the M1 goodies are doing there job. I checked the oil before each session and it did not burn any, since owning the car I have topped it off with about 1/2 to 3/4s QT of oil in about 2000 miles.
At first I was always suspicious that the different gauge appearances modes, were more gimmicky than practical. I was one who pined for traditional analog gauges, but I was WRONG. The horizontal tach in track mode is pretty nifty and legible for a very quick read, Ford got this right. Digital dash is not perfect however, I don't like the fact that tire PSI is under a different menu than the gauges. I wish they were in same menu for me to just scroll down a page that way I could see gauges, then tires by scrolling pages in the same menu instead of going to a completely different menu. Some track mode specific tuning to rearrange these pages and allow for less button clicking is welcome FRP. I also miss the "Fuel used" reading from the S197, this measure was always very accurate, I wish that was present in our trip and MPG menu. On the subject of MPG the car was getting 8 MPG indicated on track.
The car comes with track apps, so you can time your laps. The timer is only as good as how accurately you press the button as you pass the start finish line, so its not scientifically precise but it is nice to give you a relative number. It does display the time delta in red or green text which is nice. The problem though is if you are using the lap timer, you can't view gauges or tire PSIs. The timer dominates the display. I wish this could be improved a bit, like making the time text smaller or even allow it to run in the background, still rsponding to your button presses to time while viewing gauges or PSI. If you are using lap timer you are committed to it essentially.
Now the big question everyone is waiting for, can the Non HP car be a good track day car....? Yes it can, the PS4s are great tires, and the car doesn't overwhelm them in the majority of conditions. They provide ample grip, though more would always be welcome and I guess that is where HP comes in. For me this car is near perfect, it has more capabilities than my courage will allow on track so I can still "grow" into it a bit. I'm not thrashing the tires and driving it on its very limits, it is poised and more capable than I. The key here though is the same calculus involved with the "Should I just get a GT350 instead...?"comes into play with the HP or non HP decision...
Should you get an HP equipped car? Well that depends on how you much track. For me I'm more of a casual track guy 2-4 times a year so the Non HP is just fine, in the meantime I will improve my technique rather than focusing on "upgrading" the car. If you are tracking more than 4-6 times a year, I think then it is time to look at HP, if you are more skilled than I at the track, then perhaps HP will suite you more. Specifically for a guy who is already driving the car near its limits and can effectively use more traction than HP will be welcome, but I'm not there yet.
If you do go tracking, keep an eye on those tire pressures, I was adding 8psi in heat to them during sessions, keep in mind the ambient was only 50F or so! Go with Ford's recommendation and start at 30psi, keep an eye on those pressures they will rise through the day. Other PS4 users said the same, these tires heat up a lot and PSIs rise. Also for track newbies your tires will be super noisy after track day, this noise will dissipate as they wear back even on your drive home, it takes more than a few miles and this is totally normal for all cars.
Non HP M1 is as fun as advertised, a competent steed for a few track days a year.
I have always said I felt like I could be faster in Camaro SS compared to a Mustang GT PP, but I don't feel that way with the M1. The Mach displays better chassis control and suspension poise than previous GT iterations.
As the old saying goes, "its the most fun you can have with your pants on!"
Firstly, I'm not a highly experienced track driver, not a track rat by any measure. I have had only about 5 sessions at Willow in 3 different cars, a 2004 G35, 2014 Mustang GT, and now the Mach 1. I paid for one day of professional instruction back in the G35 days, it was the best money I ever spent on a car. Back in 2012 or 2013 I placed 3rd in the Nissan competition held there by Extreme Speed Track Events, and sponsored by Corner 3 garage. My best time in the M1 was 1:40, and was pretty consistent, use this to judge just how much of a grain of salt you want to take my review with. For a snap shots of speed on some turns here they are:
130 MPH going into tun 1.
low to mid 80s turn 2.
carrying 112+ into turn 8.
I know I'm leaving lots of time on the table, and the car provides so much power there were many points, where I didn't rev it out fully or go on to 100% throttle.
Conditions for the day were very cold, it was 22F when I rolled through the gate at track entrance. First session it was probably high 40s. I was concerned about the temps as I had never driven in that cold of conditions and the tires are rated for 45F and up. It never exceeded middle 50s ambient the entire day.
My car is completely stock with 2000 miles. I set tire pressure to 32psi, the supplement manual calls for 30psi. I did not get the car track aligned as the manual calls for. I ran with stock factory alignment, we can only assume it was in spec from factory, it was not measured. The car tracks true and straight and tire wear appears normal. All sessions were conducted in "Track Mode" with Rev Match on. I took it easy on the first session to warm up my skills and the car, it was super fun right out of the gate. Totally made my 2 hour drive and 5am wake up worth it.
Immediate first impressions are how neutral the car is, it is honest. It never lulled me into a false sense of security where I found myself in trouble. When I did get squirrly or improper it was me doing it on purpose or because I was not handling the car correctly. The next thing is the spring rates are really good, so much improved from the S197, and better than the PP cars I drove, I think its the springs and magneride combined. There was never a point where the ass end felt like it was doing its own thing relative to the rest of the car. This is really good as it inspires confidence and allows you to push, and throttle steer on some corners. It might also be the aero enhancements too, key takeaway this Mustang feels much more like you are in it, rather than riding on top of it. There was no excessive vertical motion or rear axle jumping around and body roll is totally acceptable. This track has 2 large elevation changes, so if there were probems in this regard Big Willow will show it. Even with the PS4s, the car is well under control, this is not mess and slide fest. The brakes never faded and always stopped me with confidence. I never activated ABS, something that would routinely happen on track or in the canyons with the S197s Brembo Car. Again, its another performance point where the Mach 1 offers more performance than I my courage will allow me to take advantage of at Big Willow. It performed well all around, I couldn't pin point a particular deficiency.
Thankfully in track mode the traction control is not intrusive. I notice when you go to track mode the traction control light is illuminated. From the manual " traction control intervention is reduced and tuned specifically for track usage only." I'm not a guy who like going sideways all that much, and because of some errors I found myself slipping heavily and sliding around turn 5, I was able to maintain, not fishtail, and save myself from an embarrassing spin out. My front end was hugging the inner rumble strip and ass slipping out wide behind me. The traction control did not feel like it was doing anything at that moment and I was thinking "good they actually let you get silly if you want".
The power of this engine is really something, it loves a course like this. You get to carry a lot of speed and if you are brave wind it out fully in many places on track. 3rd and 4th gears get quite a workout at Big Willow. So many times I was enjoying the sound and seeing the revs build, the coyote is a masterpiece, it has been great in every generation, and this version really is king. The engine just signing around corners and down the long straights. We have wonderful torque and it likes to rev, what more could you ask for? The cylinder head temp never exceeded 200F! Oil pressures were consistent, and the rear diff temp only reached 210F. It is really nice to be on track and not have to worry about cooling, all the M1 goodies are doing there job. I checked the oil before each session and it did not burn any, since owning the car I have topped it off with about 1/2 to 3/4s QT of oil in about 2000 miles.
At first I was always suspicious that the different gauge appearances modes, were more gimmicky than practical. I was one who pined for traditional analog gauges, but I was WRONG. The horizontal tach in track mode is pretty nifty and legible for a very quick read, Ford got this right. Digital dash is not perfect however, I don't like the fact that tire PSI is under a different menu than the gauges. I wish they were in same menu for me to just scroll down a page that way I could see gauges, then tires by scrolling pages in the same menu instead of going to a completely different menu. Some track mode specific tuning to rearrange these pages and allow for less button clicking is welcome FRP. I also miss the "Fuel used" reading from the S197, this measure was always very accurate, I wish that was present in our trip and MPG menu. On the subject of MPG the car was getting 8 MPG indicated on track.
The car comes with track apps, so you can time your laps. The timer is only as good as how accurately you press the button as you pass the start finish line, so its not scientifically precise but it is nice to give you a relative number. It does display the time delta in red or green text which is nice. The problem though is if you are using the lap timer, you can't view gauges or tire PSIs. The timer dominates the display. I wish this could be improved a bit, like making the time text smaller or even allow it to run in the background, still rsponding to your button presses to time while viewing gauges or PSI. If you are using lap timer you are committed to it essentially.
Now the big question everyone is waiting for, can the Non HP car be a good track day car....? Yes it can, the PS4s are great tires, and the car doesn't overwhelm them in the majority of conditions. They provide ample grip, though more would always be welcome and I guess that is where HP comes in. For me this car is near perfect, it has more capabilities than my courage will allow on track so I can still "grow" into it a bit. I'm not thrashing the tires and driving it on its very limits, it is poised and more capable than I. The key here though is the same calculus involved with the "Should I just get a GT350 instead...?"comes into play with the HP or non HP decision...
Should you get an HP equipped car? Well that depends on how you much track. For me I'm more of a casual track guy 2-4 times a year so the Non HP is just fine, in the meantime I will improve my technique rather than focusing on "upgrading" the car. If you are tracking more than 4-6 times a year, I think then it is time to look at HP, if you are more skilled than I at the track, then perhaps HP will suite you more. Specifically for a guy who is already driving the car near its limits and can effectively use more traction than HP will be welcome, but I'm not there yet.
If you do go tracking, keep an eye on those tire pressures, I was adding 8psi in heat to them during sessions, keep in mind the ambient was only 50F or so! Go with Ford's recommendation and start at 30psi, keep an eye on those pressures they will rise through the day. Other PS4 users said the same, these tires heat up a lot and PSIs rise. Also for track newbies your tires will be super noisy after track day, this noise will dissipate as they wear back even on your drive home, it takes more than a few miles and this is totally normal for all cars.
Non HP M1 is as fun as advertised, a competent steed for a few track days a year.
I have always said I felt like I could be faster in Camaro SS compared to a Mustang GT PP, but I don't feel that way with the M1. The Mach displays better chassis control and suspension poise than previous GT iterations.
As the old saying goes, "its the most fun you can have with your pants on!"
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