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Braski

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The only thing GM can do to sell camaro's. Is a complete redesign. With practicality and usability at the for front of that design. The Camaro interior absolutely sucks. Visibility is no existent. And my wife has more space in some of here purses. Than the Camaro has in the trunk or back seat. I'm legit starting to worry for the Camaros future.
Yup!^^^^
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EcoVert

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The only thing GM can do to sell camaro's. Is a complete redesign. With practicality and usability at the for front of that design. The Camaro interior absolutely sucks. Visibility is no existent. And my wife has more space in some of here purses. Than the Camaro has in the trunk or back seat. I'm legit starting to worry for the Camaros future.
Looking at the 6 months sales numbers

Mustang 42428 Challenger 37367 and camaro 25380. Its bad enough Mustang killing you in sales but a 11 year old design kicking your ass in sales to has got to be giving those guys at chevy real nightmares. I can hear the powers that be at gm signing camaros death warrant. No 7th gen me to sales turkey. :headbang:
There ain't no ATP going to save the camaro and Greedy Motors isn't going to spent anymore money on this sales disaster witness the crappy refresh. Yea camaro is on life support and it won't belong before the GM brass pull the plug. :thumbsup:
 
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activeGT

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As a ex Camaro owner. I beg to differ. A Photo of the 11 SS I owned. The sixth gen which I also drove just had even worse visibility issues than this. But I did like the interior slightly better for the sixth gen Camaro. Than the Tonka toy interior that was in the 5th gen. I’ll never own another Camaro til this basic design is dead and gone. And replaced with something you can actually see out of.

5th and sixth gens are apples and oranges. So a moot issue. I never owned or would have owned a Camaro until I drove a 6 gen. Then I owned 2.
 

bluebeastsrt

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5th and sixth gens are apples and oranges. So a moot issue. I never owned or would have owned a Camaro until I drove a 6 gen. Then I owned 2.
LOL a moot issue you say. As far as visibility???? Your right. The 5th gen was better.
 

millhouse

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HMMM, looks like the Camaro moderators couldn't take the rhetoric anymore and deleted their second quarter sales thread.

Edit: Never-mind, they moved it to a different forum that has less traffic. :crazy:
 

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edco

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Ford historically starts US auto trends and GM is a counter play. The reason. Top management. GM is a crowded board at the top. Ford is one guy with a reserved parking place in Detroit at the top. I think the Camaro 6G design suffers from too many cooks.

I see all kinds of Mustang 6G influences in the Camaro. The C6G designers have one eye on the Camaro and one eye on the Mustang when drawing. The C6G dashboards are ToysRus and no counter play there.The C6G chassis and power is ATS-V/Corvette, GM strong suits. The C6G finished product has a mixed identity. What is it? Luxury car, drag car, track car, corvette, salon, muscle car, sports car, pony car? Answer: it is a mess. Sure Chevy guys will buy it, but it does not own an identity.
Example.
I am not a Porsche guy. Looking at a 2018 Cayman ($90K sticker), I give that car straight A+s in every category of sports car one could name. A Cayman knows what it is. A Mustang knows what it is. A Challenger knows what it is. C6G, too may cooks, too many masters, too many lovers, not enough love. Trying to be everything, the C6G has achieved being just another car. Every time I start my GT, it says, I am a Mustang and I don't give a hockey puck what you are driving. That is identity. That sells cars.
driveway-front.jpg
 
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Glenn G

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Just had a read of the whole Camaro 6 thread, any spelling errors are probably due to brain damage.


Sales don't matter: Check
More profit for less sales: Check

(GM is making at a minimum the same if not more money as Mustang or Challenger! (Really.....How much does it cost to make a Camaro?, must be ~$500. FCA must be making a killing then.)
I like having the Rarer car: Check
It's more expensive so less people buy: Check


Unfortunately I couldn't find any variations of:
It's a Supercar-Ferrari only sells 1000 per year, I guess it must SUCK? (they actually kind of do suck honestly, the owner of the company next door has one and I asked him why he doesn't drive it more often now that we have nice weather in Germany and he said it's broken more often than not. His warranty is up this fall and he told me he's dumping it as soon it gets fixed.)


Remember the old arguments about the availability of the ZL1, the convertible, the 1LE? Well those have been replaced with lack of UN-optioned cheaper cars.


I learned a few things too,
The Camaro didn't die do to poor sales in 2002, the plant in Ontario simply couldn't be tooled build them to meet regulations like they could all the other cars they made there.:doh:


Also Consumer Reports and JD power, were good when they praised the new Camaro in 2016 but are fake news now that they universally rate it last. (I guess GM stoped writing checks to magazines?)


Finally the bad economy and looming "trade war" is hurting sales.


There are a few individuals there who didn't drink the cool aid and pointed out that the Economy hasn't hurt Mustang or especially Challenger sales and that soft factors like ergonomics and interior materials quality and layout hurt sales far worse than the performance benefits gained from sacrificing them help, but they tend to get attacked by the zealots.


Memorable qoutes so you don't have to hurt your brain looking over there



Originally Posted by Chazzz
Sadly, if this trend continues I for one doubt we will see a next gen Camaro in the future. Only hope at this point is if the 2019 refresh is the saving grace for a large boost in the numbers shown here.


Response and best quote of the day



Originally Posted by germanicus
viewpost.gif

We can hope that it breaks through to that untapped Cheshire Cat Fandom market.






Originally Posted by Vtor_ZL1
People aren't buying toys when certian gov'mint forces are playing loose goose with economy.


Response




Originally Posted by kidamer
mustang and challenger seem to be doing fine



Originally Posted by rocket403
Some years back it was pointed out to me by more than a couple people on this site that the Camaro was rated better than the Challenger by JD Power, so surprised that it is now considered Fake News guess it is only Fake when it suits then.


Response



Originally Posted by Deputy Dog

Yeh...its fake news from day to day...just like when Consumer Reports gave rave reviews for the Toyota Matrix, then in another issue they gave mediocre reviews for the Pontiac Vibe. They must have forgot the 2 cars were the same cars built on the same assembly line except one had a Pontiac sticker and the other had a Toyota sticker.


My Namesake on the other site thankfully has some sense,



Originally Posted by Glen e

The real true test of whether the Camaro makes that or not will be to see when dealers start turning down the product en masse… At that point Chevrolet is going to have to make a decision. Because right now, although sales are down 36%, they're really not to GM because they "sold" the cars to the dealers. It all depends how choked the dealers are with Camaros, and when they start turning down camaro product across the country, that's when it will hit the proverbial fan....... and the GM Board Will have to decide what to do long-term.



Head Firmly in sand


Originally Posted by JoeCamaro444
They are selling just fine. Barely any discounts given, because they don’t need to. For the reasons I stated in my last post, they don’t need to give discounts, and people will keep buying them. They’ll keep buying them in 2019 too, even with all the complaining about the look of the nose. So, as I mentioned before, they’ll keep making Camaros, people will keep buying Camaros, so they’re not going anywhere.

FYI: They weren’t discontinued after 2002 due to poor sales. They were discontinued because of new safety regulations, and the plant in Ontario wasn’t equipped to make them compliant. It was going to be a cost and logistics nightmare.


When Samurai (Ace Here) asked Medisin where he gets his "magik" retail numbers, that absolutely no one else has ever had access to, from, he was ignored, It would have at least been common courtesy to say "My Ass".
 

w3rkn

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Camaro sales do not matter. Though it is sad, that GM could sell more if they didn't hire designers who were a focus group, or tried to market to 20 year olds..
 

1320'

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HMMM, looks like the Camaro moderators couldn't take the rhetoric anymore and deleted their second quarter sales thread.

Edit: Never-mind, they moved it to a different forum that has less traffic. :crazy:
LMAO..Oh god.

Since 2009 the Camaro sales data has been on the General Discussions forum of Camaro5/Camaro6. It's never been anywhere else, ever. Now that the Camaro is tanking and it genuinely looks horrible..and no amount of "but ATP's" can convince ANYONE that a 36% drop year over year for the same quarter is ANYTHING BUT HORRIBLE...they move it to a dusty, seldom traveled area of the forums.

Now I don't want the Camaro to go away, I believe competition makes the Mustang better...but I will say I take an insane amount of pleasure in Camaro6 standing around going.."but..but...what..what happened.." after their arrogant, puffed up, dick swinging strutting in 2009-2010-2011.
 

thehunterooo

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HMMM, looks like the Camaro moderators couldn't take the rhetoric anymore and deleted their second quarter sales thread.

Edit: Never-mind, they moved it to a different forum that has less traffic. :crazy:
lol
 

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thehunterooo

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"LOL at the guys at Mustang 6G who take this stuff way too seriously. Many failed attempts at bashing the Camaro. They speak of the visibility but it is not bad if you're confident in your driving ability. Camaro's feedback through the wheels also helps out in this case. They must be speaking of the seating position which is not so high up like the Mustang. If that creates an illusion of discomfort/anxiety then it is a mental thing for some people.

Also suggesting the Camaro is the least preferable daily driver also makes no sense. All three muscle/pony cars are daily drivable in warm weather. Does not matter if one is more stiff than the other, it is still daily drivable. And I don't see much more practicality in the Challenger or Mustang. All three cars have small rear seats and all three are performance/sport cars. If you're choosing either as a family car that doesn't make sense.

And lastly, them suggesting Camaro is a better track car but there is no difference on the street. Uh, yes there is, the driving characteristics are different even when just going for a spin. You're gonna notice the shortcomings of the outdated Challenger chassis and the Mustang's more mild stock setup versus the Camaro's sport oriented feel. "

Y I K E S

Well at least the whole "you cant DD a Mustang because it makes no low end power" has been debunked. And you need a 1LE to go to Walmart.
 

1320'

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Y I K E S

Well at least the whole "you cant DD a Mustang because it makes no low end power" has been debunked. And you need a 1LE to go to Walmart.
You never know when your fragile ego will be crippled while in the store and you need to drive around for an hour going "You are FAST, you are FASTER than FAST, you are SPEED"
 

Allegro

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[/QUOTE]FYI: They weren’t discontinued after 2002 due to poor sales. They were discontinued because of new safety regulations, and the plant in Ontario wasn’t equipped to make them compliant. It was going to be a cost and logistics nightmare.[/QUOTE]

The 1992-2002 Camaros were built in Sainte Therese, Quebec, not in Ontario. Yes, it was an old plant and GM had no plans to do any upgrades on it. The safety regulations probably were a factor in the demise of the Camaro at that time, but in GM's announcing the end of Camaro production they referenced research that showed a weakening market for that type of car. At the same time Ford was about to release prototype pictures of the next generation 2005 Mustang, which ultimately sold hundreds of thousands to the 'weakened' market before Camaro got back in the game in 2010. Once again, Chevrolet scrambling to catchup to Mustang, just like the mid 60's.

The 2010 Camaro was still built in Canada, this time at Oshawa, Ontario. Camaros were produced there until the end 2015 when production moved to Lansing, Michigan.
 
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Rob00GT

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I am not a Porsche guy. Looking at a 2018 Cayman ($90K sticker), I give that car straight A+s in every category of sports car one could name. A Cayman knows what it is.

Only an "average" person would say that. For us tall guys that car might as well not exist. A Cayman isn't an option for me any more than a Miata is. Last Miata I tried to drive my eyeline was over the top of the windshield.
 

BmacIL

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"LOL at the guys at Mustang 6G who take this stuff way too seriously. Many failed attempts at bashing the Camaro. They speak of the visibility but it is not bad if you're confident in your driving ability. Camaro's feedback through the wheels also helps out in this case. They must be speaking of the seating position which is not so high up like the Mustang. If that creates an illusion of discomfort/anxiety then it is a mental thing for some people.

Also suggesting the Camaro is the least preferable daily driver also makes no sense. All three muscle/pony cars are daily drivable in warm weather. Does not matter if one is more stiff than the other, it is still daily drivable. And I don't see much more practicality in the Challenger or Mustang. All three cars have small rear seats and all three are performance/sport cars. If you're choosing either as a family car that doesn't make sense.

And lastly, them suggesting Camaro is a better track car but there is no difference on the street. Uh, yes there is, the driving characteristics are different even when just going for a spin. You're gonna notice the shortcomings of the outdated Challenger chassis and the Mustang's more mild stock setup versus the Camaro's sport oriented feel. "

Y I K E S

Well at least the whole "you cant DD a Mustang because it makes no low end power" has been debunked. And you need a 1LE to go to Walmart.
That's HILARIOUS :lol::lol:
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