It’s coming... 3 States have now banned future combustion engine car sales

[shogun32]

That job loss is a big deal for those who lose them to be sure, but beyond job loss what else is implied.

a richer railroad baron - now it has to be shipped by unsafe and more expensive rail car (vis-a-vis) pipeline. His name would be Buffett. It's amazing how many gov't policies go his way... And since the volume will be less the knock-on job force would be much less. And that heavy sour crude would be shipped to China instead where they will of course meticulously abide by the toothless Kyoto accords and reduce their pollution to match the USA's unit for unit. HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA. Not!!

stopping fracking

would be national suicide. And a death sentence to communities rebounding from Gov't policy that created the Rust belt with emphasis on the Rust - ie rotting steel, not shiny, new steel. It would also mean resuming the importation of oil (in size) from our non-friends in the ME, and our inability to export LNG to the euro-weenies who just love to cut off their nose to spite their face.

Behind every unit of economic activity is a unit of energy. You choke off the energy (or raise it's price significantly) you get less economic activity. It's a law.

and giving financial incentives for the purchase of electric vehicles.

This crap needs to stop and pronto. If it can't stand on it's own then it needs to die. Distorting the market never ends well. That $5000+ 'rebate' came out of YOUR pocket. Excuse me, why is robbing one citizen to indulge another an acceptable tenant of gov't policy? Who buys EVs? The well off. They can bloody well afford the higher prices instead of robbing the poor, for their own good to "save" the planet.

Furthermore the entire premise of carbon-dioxide being problematic is 100% Grade A FRAUD and LIES.

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[FreePenguin]

FACT if the US cut pollution by HALF China would still polluting more than the US! China is the problem but we can’t fix that so we get punished instead!

exactly. I don't even feel we should be doing any of these improvements unless people want too, purely choice. we shouldn't be spending the $ to improve it by law if others aren't doing it either.

 

[sk47]

that heavy sour crude would be shipped to China instead where they will of course meticulously abide by the toothless Kyoto accords and reduce their pollution to match the USA's unit for unit. HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA. Not!!

Hello; Yes, very good points. Oil is what they call funegable (sp) I think. That means it is able to be used in lots of places. So yes the Canadians will sell it to someone. China makes sense as they have the money and need the energy. I can also see you point about how they may refine the oil. They build lots of coal fired power plants now and it has been my understanding those coal plants are not built with the best scrubber technology. That China in the latest environmental international regulations do not have to comply the same as other countries until after 2030 for obscure reasons.

That $5000+ 'rebate' came out of YOUR pocket. Excuse me, why is robbing one citizen to indulge another an acceptable tenant of gov't policy?

Hello; Yes to this as well. The plan seems to be to work against ICE vehicles from both ends. On one end to make the fuel more costly and on the other make battery vehicles easier to buy. You points hit home. Those who may not be in favor of either tactic will wind up paying for a chunk of it. This appears to be another case of the government trying to pick one side over the other while using money from both sides.

The well off. They can bloody well afford the higher prices instead of robbing the poor, for their own good to "save" the planet.

Hello; A sin tax sort of idea. I do not know the way hybrid or all electric vehicle ownership works out myself, but suspect you may be correct. Sort of like owning a hybrid or electric is virtue signaling.

Hello; It is good to hear from those who think along the same lines as I do, but I am still curious to hear from the other side. I get that we are stuck for at least two years with the prospect of the changes in my question taking place. Some are already being changed. I did not support these proposals and know why. What I am curious about is why those who do support the coming changes are in favor of them. I can make guesses but would welcome feedback.
I have been wondering if some of it was because the proposals were not very widely discussed nor given much press before last November. Could it be a number of people did not have good knowledge about what was going to happen? Could it be that some are very willing to raise the cost of living and increase the financial struggles of huge numbers of people. We were already going to have serious problems from the virus and the massive spending. I wonder, did some folks just not care about the economic repercussions of adding fuel costs to the mix? Again I invite the views of those in favor of the changes I mentioned.

 

[Questortapes74]

Does anyone remember in say 2009 a $4500 in US dollars gift with a couple of quarts of sodium silicate in order to seal the deal? The EV transition may occur in a similar fashion as brought to you by your cherished sponsor the politic and the rhetoric. What is most likely behind the curtain for our sponsors is a significant money trail. The money trail is the “was - will be” truism that continues to propagate for most modern civilizations. Just my 2 cents.

 

[sk47]

Does anyone remember in say 2009 a $4500 in US dollars gift with a couple of quarts of sodium silicate in order to seal the deal? The EV transition may occur in a similar fashion as brought to you by your cherished sponsor the politic and the rhetoric. What is most likely behind the curtain for our sponsors is a significant money trail. The money trail is the “was - will be” truism that continues to propagate for most modern civilizations. Just my 2 cents.

Hello; Yes I do recall. While I do not know of any such program quite yet, that there are some who would, if they had the power, inflict this sort of thing is not in doubt. One of the ironies of that program was the blind eye about the consequences. Sure some vehicles which did not get great MPG's were off the road. There were a lot of other things that happened. One, if I recall correctly, was a lot of already junk cars being towed in. Towed from yards and other places where they had sat for years. You already inferred about pouring sand into fine running engines.
Those running older and/or perhaps less fuel efficient vehicles did burn more fuel. There was a sort of self limiting factor in play. That being they would not be driven any more than necessary by folks on a limited budget. I often wonder if some of those who took the cash and did buy a better MPG vehicle. Did they after the fact just drive more and wind up burning similar amounts of fuel?

 

[shogun32]

what the program did was drastically reduce the available inventory for poor people to buy - which raised the prices and put cars out of reach of those who could have really used one. A giant FU from the gov't to the people least able to afford the outcome.

 

[sk47]

what the program did was drastically reduce the available inventory for poor people to buy - which raised the prices and put cars out of reach of those who could have really used one. A giant FU from the gov't to the people least able to afford the outcome.

Hello; Yes to this. I agree. I also have heard the same thing. Another case of an ideology being more important to those with the power than the outcome for those least able to afford the consequence of their top down decision.

 

[shogun32]

There's a damn good reason the phrase "the road to hell is paved by good intentions" exists. This whole "Co2 is bad, and here's the solution" is exhibit A of this.

 

[Questortapes74]

I often wonder if some of those who took the cash and did buy a better MPG vehicle. Did they after the fact just drive more and wind up burning similar amounts of fuel?

Great points. Thanks for sharing. With time and age, a little wisdom has set in for myself. I have significantly cut back on the amount of miles I put on the road, and I enjoy the moments ever more on the select days that I do get out on the road simply for my pleasure.

 

[sk47]

Death of diesel grows more certain as major production facility turns to EVs (msn.com)

Hello; Interesting read. A part which got my attention was the word "mandate" in a paragraph. Looks like another top down sort of pressure against the ICE.

 

[sk47]

Electric cars are not the only green solution (msn.com)
Hello; Another interesting read.

 

[shogun32]

Electric cars are not the only green solution (msn.com)
Hello; Another interesting read.

yes the eternal wet-dream of the nanny-crat. Just outlaw cars and personal transport. build more 'smart' cities and make sure people are not incentivised, neigh, let's just prohibit them from living outside the Perfect (because 'we' say it is) planned community in the metropolis.

Do I really need to cite the Divergent movies as exhibit A?

 

[nrc]

yes the eternal wet-dream of the nanny-crat. Just outlaw cars and personal transport. build more 'smart' cities and make sure people are not incentivised, neigh, let's just prohibit from living outside the Perfect (because 'we' say it is) planned community in the metropolis.

Do I really need to cite the Divergent movies as exhibit A?

To head off this whole "Divergent" comparison, The Capital will be renaming regions of the U.S. into numbered districts. Sorry, no travel between districts except by federally approved high speed rail.

 

[Questortapes74]

To head off this whole "Divergent" comparison, The Capital will be renaming regions of the U.S. into numbered districts. Sorry, no travel between districts except by federally approved high speed rail.

“My uncle has a country place
That no one knows about
He says it used to be a farm
Before the Motor Law
And on Sundays I elude the eyes
And hop the Turbine Freight
To far outside the Wire
Where my white-haired uncle waits...”

Red Barchetta by Rush

 

[Jmtoast]

So what happens if we run out of fuel? Lol I mean crude oil

Earth has been around for millions of years. We are due for another asteroid or other natural cataclysmic event. That should take care of pretty much all those type questions and our worries over global warming.

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