Is this the beginning of the end for Trump ?

[jtmat]

yes, all 4 went looking for trouble, all 4 found it. I'd charge the two survivors with gun violations both committed, and then call it a day.

Let police do their job? That's why there is a protest! because police do their job.

so, people cannot protect their neighbors property? You can only protect your own? Seems a bit selfish, and I hope that attitude never penetrates the south where we look out for each other.

Also, he did not run away like a kid, he went to the police afterwards. Twice in fact, and called 911 at least once. He was told to go home that night by police, the next day he turned himself in.

If you want to protect your neighbors property, that is great. I grew up on a farm... just because my location says one thing, I'm lived many different places (some people do that during a lifetime). Going into a city with a weapon of war and standing on a corner is not protecting your neighbors property... that is silly (and I own a weapon of war... and it is fun shooting small trees down in the country).

He ran away. You know it... I've been to enough gun classes to know... and you should as well. Common. I currently have a concealed permit... and I've had them from different states over a couple of decades.

I'm 100% for gun rights... I don't think it is "smart" to go into an area of protests with a gun. Nothing good can come out of that. It puts the protesters in danger and the person carrying the gun in danger. Makes the police have a more difficult time as well. Support the police: let the police do their job.

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[watisthis]

Let police do their job? That's why there is a protest! because police do their job.

Yeah, its the job of the police to kill people who pose no threat. I guess Every other 1st world country is policing incorrectly. Especially Iceland police who have only killed 1 person.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers_by_country

https://imgur.com/a/zb1CIOR

so, people cannot protect their neighbors property?

Patrolling the street to protect businesses from looters. When you're out looking for looters in an area that can quickly turn into chaos is idiotic. His and their lives are more valuable than property. Let the authoritIES handle crime, we don't need armed vigilantes patrolling streets who have no business being there, who have no training in diffusing situations, who aren't from around that area, and who are just going to agitate others causing more problems.

he went to the police afterwards.

Who let him walk away, rofl. Real top-notch policing going on there. Let a kid with a gun who was just involved in a shooting walk away but shoot a black man in the back 7 times because he didn't yield and was provided no other opportunities to do so.

 

[Jimmy Dean]

If you want to protect your neighbors property, that is great. I grew up on a farm... just because my location says one thing, I'm lived many different places (some people do that during a lifetime). Going into a city with a weapon of war and standing on a corner is not protecting your neighbors property... that is silly (and I own a weapon of war... and it is fun shooting small trees down in the country).

He ran away. You know it... I've been to enough gun classes to know... and you should as well. Common. I currently have a concealed permit... and I've had them from different states over a couple of decades.

I'm 100% for gun rights... I don't think it is "smart" to go into an area of protests with a gun. Nothing good can come out of that. It puts the protesters in danger and the person carrying the gun in danger. Makes the police have a more difficult time as well. Support the police: let the police do their job.

he ran away from people trying to attack him, and ran towards police. Twice. and called them once. the second time they told him to go home. He turned himself in the next day. I cannot fault him for any of that. Hell, him approaching cops the first time with hands up trying to turn himself in is on video, and the cops just passed him by, being more concerned with the 3 people shot than with the shooter. granted, this is also likely because they had instructions from the idiots in charge to not arrest anyone for anything....buy hey...whatever, right?

As for going into an area of riots armed, I can't blame him. either you don't go, or go unarmed, and unarmed and innocent people get hurt in the riots. or you go armed, and it is rioters or armed resistance that gets hurt. secondly, he has as much or more right to be there then people destroying other peoples livelihoods, burning down businesses and cars.

 

[Jimmy Dean]

Yeah, its the job of the police to kill people who pose no threat. I guess Every other 1st world country is policing incorrectly. Especially Iceland police who have only killed 1 person.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers_by_country

https://imgur.com/a/zb1CIOR



Patrolling the street to protect businesses from looters. When you're out looking for looters in an area that can quickly turn into chaos is idiotic. His and their lives are more valuable than property. Let the authoritIES handle crime, we don't need armed vigilantes patrolling streets who have no business being there, who have no training in diffusing situations, who aren't from around that area, and who are just going to agitate others causing more problems.



Who let him walk away, rofl. Real top-notch policing going on there. Let a kid with a gun who was just involved in a shooting walk away but shoot a black man in the back 7 times because he didn't yield and was provided no other opportunities to do so.

Yeah, cops didn't kill blake. You know, the person with whom these riots are over.

You know, the fact that he lived, and 2 rioters didn't, I don't fault him then. Maybe those two idiots shouldn't have been out rioting? Dunno...just thinking out loud here. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

As for what started this set of specific riots, was a violent felon who got the cops called on him for more domestic abuse and trespassing, while armed. then after being subdued, and tazed, attempted to go for a weapon, and got shot for his trouble, again, play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

 

[Gregs24]

The Kid was from 20 miles away dude.

18 with someone 4 years younger? yeah, still a problem. and a pedo. inside of 2 years, understandable, but an 18yo wit ha 14yo...thats an issue man, if you don't see that, there really is no hope for you.

Clearly he broke the law but there is a difference between a 15 year old and 18 year old having sex and a 36 year old and a 14 year old. I'm not trying to defend him in any way, he did the crime and served his time.

However to say somebody who was convicted of a crime 18 years ago automatically was looking for trouble and get shot is pushing it a bit far don't you think. As for the skateboarder - he had no criminal record ?

yes, all 4 went looking for trouble, all 4 found it.

One went looking for trouble, but the three victims - really ? They went to protest, not get shot.

I am sure you are not really trying to justify the shooters actions based on the 'value' of his victims?

 

[jtmat]

he ran away from people trying to attack him, and ran towards police. Twice. and called them once. the second time they told him to go home. He turned himself in the next day. I cannot fault him for any of that. Hell, him approaching cops the first time with hands up trying to turn himself in is on video, and the cops just passed him by, being more concerned with the 3 people shot than with the shooter. granted, this is also likely because they had instructions from the idiots in charge to not arrest anyone for anything....buy hey...whatever, right?

As for going into an area of riots armed, I can't blame him. either you don't go, or go unarmed, and unarmed and innocent people get hurt in the riots. or you go armed, and it is rioters or armed resistance that gets hurt. secondly, he has as much or more right to be there then people destroying other peoples livelihoods, burning down businesses and cars.

I saw that video... he never walked up and said I shot those people. Honestly, you can't change the narrative. Even the police came back and said they did not realize what was happening. Again, the police are not allowed to do their job. People with guns make an already complex and tense situation worse for the police. Citizens with guns are not helping, even if they have the right to be there.

 

[Gregs24]

As for going into an area of riots armed, I can't blame him. either you don't go, or go unarmed, and unarmed and innocent people get hurt in the riots. or you go armed, and it is rioters or armed resistance that gets hurt. secondly, he has as much or more right to be there then people destroying other peoples livelihoods, burning down businesses and cars.

He has no 'right' to be there. It isn't his property, isn't even his state, and he is carrying a gun he cannot own legally. He is an idiotic deluded vigilante and should get no sympathy.

There is enough trouble with the recognised enforcement authority being held to account, never mind a completely unaccountable madman.

 

[watisthis]

granted, this is also likely because they had instructions from the idiots in charge to not arrest anyone for anything....buy hey...whatever, right?

Yeah, let's hear the excuses.

Yeah, cops didn't kill blake. You know, the person with whom these riots are over.

Yeah, you shoot someone in the back 7 times because that is the only way to diffuse the situation while also not killing them. No one pulls a trigger 7 times and goes, nah that isn't attempted murder because he wasn't trying to not kill him.

Dunno...just thinking out loud here. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Agreed, and they're all going to get jailed for it even the dumbass 17-year-old, they were all looking for trouble.

As for what started this set of specific riots, was a violent felon who got the cops called on him for more domestic abuse and trespassing, while armed. then after being subdued, and tazed, attempted to go for a weapon, and got shot for his trouble, again, play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Yep, and all felons deserve to be killed or attempted to be killed on sight, no need for due process. Should have shot and killed all the white felons (cops) who killed unarmed African Americans by kneeling on their necks, by choking them to death, etc, or the white domestic terrorists who run over protestors, kill churchgoers, etc. /sarcasm

You seriously have some extremely ignorant and unlawful opinions.

 

[Jimmy Dean]

He has no 'right' to be there. It isn't his property, isn't even his state, and he is carrying a gun he cannot own legally. He is an idiotic deluded vigilante and should get no sympathy.

There is enough trouble with the recognised enforcement authority being held to account, never mind a completely unaccountable madman.

he has as much a right to be there as any of the protesters and rioters.

 

[Jimmy Dean]

You seriously have some extremely ignorant and unlawful opinions.

and you don't? like thinking that cops don't have the right to defend from threats?

Can't say that I see anywhere that I have defended Chauvin's actions. I have spoken out against what occured with Breanne Taylor, and have spoken out against no-knocks in general, along with civil forfeiture. I have spoken out numerous times against many police injustices, but the blake one, the mike browns, the alton sterlings, those are not ones that I oppose the police actions.

nor did I say that felons should simply be killed on site, but the point of pointing out that all three of the idiots who got shot were not fine upstanding law abiding individuals, that they are felons whowere participating in riots, so I have a hard time believing that what they where there for was for peaceful innocent protesting. And again, play stupid games, win stupid prizes. in fact, victim #1 was wearing a shirt to that effect, something like 'fuck around and find out'.

You seem to think that there is no middle ground, that if you have to be either fully with or fully against each side of the argument. That is an extremely naive and childish belief system, and I feel sorry for you and anyone in your life since you feel that way. It is a truly stupid way to go about life.

 

[jtmat]

he has as much a right to be there as any of the protesters and rioters.

It sounds cool when you are online talking to your friends about going into town and bringing order. Big man... oh, the stories that will come out of that!

Guess he can tell of his escapades in prison.

Reality is a SOB when things escalate and you can't handle it. There is a reason why police go through so much training (and sometimes still get it wrong)... armed citizens don't have that training.

 

[Jimmy Dean]

It sounds cool when you are online talking to your friends about going into town and bringing order. Big man... oh, the stories that will come out of that!

Guess he can tell of his escapades in prison.

Reality is a SOB when things escalate and you can't handle it. There is a reason why police go through so much training (and sometimes still get it wrong)... armed citizens don't have that training.

same could be said for the two that are dead and third that got shot in the arm, talking a big game before hand (and there is video of the 1st one doing just that). Guess at least one of them can talk about how much of a badass he was carrying his pistol to go riot with, then how he pulled it and got popped in about half a second by a kid.

 

[watisthis]

like thinking that cops don't have the right to defend from threats?

What threat? A knife they briefly saw from a large distance away (I don't know how far but far enough that he was no threat?) Afraid he was going to turn around and shot them without first seeing a weapon? A white kid walking around with a gun slung over his shoulder was more a threat than this man was.

They have an ROE one that is, apparently, extremely more relaxed than I had in the military.

but the point of pointing out that all three of the idiots who got shot were not fine upstanding law abiding individuals, that they are felons whowere participating in riots, so I have a hard time believing that what they where there for was for peaceful innocent protesting. And again, play stupid games, win stupid prizes. in fact, victim #1 was wearing a shirt to that effect, something like 'fuck around and find out'.

Inferring they deserved to be shot as you're not coming out and saying they shouldn't have been. Yes, some did deserve to be arrested, however, that is a far fucking distance from just straight choking people dead or shooting them. It is not the cop's job to be jury and executioner. They are civil servants who uphold the law and protect the public and in some cases need to protect the public from their own.

Just because you don't like what these people have done in their past or what you assume they are doing now does not give you the right to take their right to due process away.

You seem to think that there is no middle ground, that if you have to be either fully with or fully against each side of the argument. That is an extremely naive and childish belief system, and I feel sorry for you and anyone in your life since you feel that way. It is a truly stupid way to go about life.

Says the man who infers everything bad that happens is because of the 'left.' Who thinks racism can not exist any longer because we had a civil rights movement and passed some laws. Who tries to justify the deaths of 'criminals and thugs' and make excuses for other criminals and thugs being able to walk away alive or uninjured.

I really don't know what 'middle ground' you're talking about.

 

[Jimmy Dean]

What threat? A knife they briefly saw from a large distance away (I don't know how far but far enough that he was no threat?) Afraid he was going to turn around and shot them without first seeing a weapon? A white kid walking around with a gun slung over his shoulder was more a threat than this man was.

They have an ROE one that is, apparently, extremely more relaxed than I had in the military.



Inferring they deserved to be shot as you're not coming out and saying they shouldn't have been. Yes, some did deserve to be arrested, however, that is a far fucking distance from just straight choking people dead or shooting them. It is not the cop's job to be jury and executioner. They are civil servants who uphold the law and protect the public and in some cases need to protect the public from their own.

Just because you don't like what these people have done in their past or what you assume they are doing now does not give you the right to take their right to due process away.



Says the man who infers everything bad that happens is because of the 'left.' Who thinks racism can not exist any longer because we had a civil rights movement and passed some laws. Who tries to justify the deaths of 'criminals and thugs' and make excuses for white criminals and thugs being able to walk away alive or uninjured.

I really don't know what 'middle ground' you're talking about.

see, you are making shit up now. remember, I have stated in a previous thread, that I Started, that I will not be voting for Trump, there is too many of his actions I disagree with. Also nowhere have I stated that racism can't or doesn't exist, and no where I have stated it is not a problem to be dealt with. and nowhere have I stated that every person on the left is wrong, or that I do not see or understand where some of their beliefs come from, or that I believe that the right is always right. In fact very much the opposite.

So, yes, you are childish in believing that everything and everyone is black or white, and that there is no grey middle ground for most of us.

You are apparently completely incapable of doing ANYTHING but stick words into other people mouths to support your own misguided belief system. I can certainly see why so many people have set you to ignore. You are too blind and ignorant to even attempt to have a rational discussion with.

So, good day, and I hope one day you will open your eyes to reality.

and please stop regurgitating the same made up childish lines.

And as for ROE....yup, cops can drone strike a city/building where there are insurgents. and they can fire into a crowd where there are armed enemies firing at them. the ROEs are different for both groups, and for different reasons, because their goals are different, and the means and methods to achieve those goals are different. I keep forgetting about all of the bombs, and airplanes, and cruise missiles that the police have and use daily to combat these rioters and criminals. That is one of the reasons that I am against the hiring of combat vets for policing roles. as stated elsewhere. And yes, I am a vet, so piss off with your holier than though attitude thinking you are better than me because you served and I didn't so I don't know what I am talking about. I did serve. gave up my full ride scholarship, and many other perks of a privileged upbringing because I felt that I owed my country for all that she has provided me with, not because I felt that it was the only way for me to get out of a bad situation or something. I joined simply because it was the right thing to do, even though it meant many economic sacrifices for me to do so.

 

[watisthis]

see, you are making shit up now. remember, I have stated in a previous thread, that I Started, that I will not be voting for Trump, there is too many of his actions I disagree with. Also nowhere have I stated that racism can't or doesn't exist, and no where I have stated it is not a problem to be dealt with. and nowhere have I stated that every person on the left is wrong, or that I do not see or understand where some of their beliefs come from, or that I believe that the right is always right. In fact very much the opposite.

So, yes, you are childish in believing that everything and everyone is black or white, and that there is no grey middle ground for most of us.

You are apparently completely incapable of doing ANYTHING but stick words into other people mouths to support your own misguided belief system. I can certainly see why so many people have set you to ignore. You are too blind and ignorant to even attempt to have a rational discussion with.

So, good day, and I hope one day you will open your eyes to reality.

and please stop regurgitating the same made up childish lines.

Lol, ok. Since you're the 'middle ground' I'll wait for you to start correcting posts by conservatives when they post memes, misinformation, or blatant lies. Maybe if your post history was a mix of holding both sides accountable for wrongs I wouldn't take your nonaction as acceptance/confirmation as to what they're posting. Because to me, it seems like you're more in favor of getting one over on 'leftists' than being anywhere close to the middle.

You think that because people did bad and shitty things in the past, that what people want to do is for bad and shitty reasons.

But but they're 'criminals and thugs'

ROEs are different for both groups

Yeah, I wonder what would happen if someone in the armed forces shot someone in the back 7 times without justification. Given this cop could still be charged but something like this happens far less often when you know you are going to be held accountable for your actions.

Later in the wars when ROE was tight (because get this the population got mad that we were just killing people for no reason fucking crazy right???) you had to wait till they made an aggressive move towards a weapon, were straight-up attacking you or did not follow directions while you shouted at them for a long fucking time and then still needed to wait for them to become aggressive otherwise you weren't allowed to do anything even if they were armed to their teeth and were obviously there for no good reason.

But hey the 'thug/criminal' had his back to you so I guess that is justification enough for a cop to make a life-changing judgment call.

cops can drone strike a city/building where there are insurgents.

I keep forgetting about all of the bombs, and airplanes, and cruise missiles that the police have and use daily to combat these rioters and criminals.

Lay off the hyperbole, lol. Also, cops bombed Philidephia but we both already know you seem to tiptoe around history that doesn't work for you.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2119463/

And the over arming of police is a problem.

I am a vet, so piss off with your holier than though attitude thinking you are better than me because you served and I didn't so I don't know what I am talking about. I did serve. gave up my full ride scholarship, and many other perks of a privileged upbringing because I felt that I owed my country for all that she has provided me with, not because I felt that it was the only way for me to get out of a bad situation or something. I joined simply because it was the right thing to do, even though it meant many economic sacrifices for me to do so.

I never said or inferred that you did not serve. In fact, I never even questioned your service to this country.

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