If everything is fast and agile, will sports car exist? Will performance get limited?

[FinitePrimus]

That's quite a dystopian future you're painting there. Can I borrow your crystal ball? I have a few stocks I want to research

It's just called looking at the news and connecting the dots. Just like when the iPod was released and many (including myself) predicted the end of music stores and CD sales. We see similar with Blu-Ray discs vs. streaming. The future is moving away from ownership and into on-demand.

Only 20% of Americans will own a car in 15 years, new study finds
https://www.businessinsider.com/no-one-will-own-a-car-in-the-future-2017-5

Why 95 Percent of Your Driving Won't Be in Your Own Car by 2030
A new report says 95 percent of us will be riding in driverless, shared electric cars by 2030.
https://www.nbcnews.com/business/autos/why-95-percent-your-driving-won-t-be-your-own-n755571

Canada mandates new car and passenger truck sales to be 100 per cent zero-emission by 2035
https://electricautonomy.ca/2021/06/29/federal-zev-mandate-2035/

Rivian, Tesla & GM prep for predicted shortage of EV battery production materials
https://www.repairerdrivennews.com/...-shortage-of-ev-battery-production-materials/

Electric vehicles see 30 km/h higher speed limits in Austria
https://driving.ca/auto-news/news/electric-vehicles-see-30-km-h-higher-speed-limits-in-austria

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[PC_GUARD]

Most gas stations make very little in the sale of gasoline. They make the real money from the store. If you had to linger longer, you would more likely buy something from the store.

Im not sure thats going to offset the cost of adding in chargers, or having cars stacked up like a 70's gas shortage lottery.


The US, compared to EU, is entirely TOO vast for EV to be practical outside of city use. Besides that, theyre nothing more than an appliance, and people who buy them, primarily see cars as an appliance. Not all but most

 

[LSchicago]

It's just called looking at the news and connecting the dots. Just like when the iPod was released and many (including myself) predicted the end of music stores and CD sales. We see similar with Blu-Ray discs vs. streaming. The future is moving away from ownership and into on-demand.

Only 20% of Americans will own a car in 15 years, new study finds
https://www.businessinsider.com/no-one-will-own-a-car-in-the-future-2017-5

Why 95 Percent of Your Driving Won't Be in Your Own Car by 2030
A new report says 95 percent of us will be riding in driverless, shared electric cars by 2030.
https://www.nbcnews.com/business/autos/why-95-percent-your-driving-won-t-be-your-own-n755571

Canada mandates new car and passenger truck sales to be 100 per cent zero-emission by 2035
https://electricautonomy.ca/2021/06/29/federal-zev-mandate-2035/

Rivian, Tesla & GM prep for predicted shortage of EV battery production materials
https://www.repairerdrivennews.com/...-shortage-of-ev-battery-production-materials/

Electric vehicles see 30 km/h higher speed limits in Austria
https://driving.ca/auto-news/news/electric-vehicles-see-30-km-h-higher-speed-limits-in-austria

That must be a generation Z study. No way 95% of us give up driving in less than 8 years.

 

[shogun32]

Only 20% of Americans will own a car in 15 years, new study finds

Why 95 Percent of Your Driving Won't Be in Your Own Car by 2030
A new report says 95 percent of us will be riding in driverless, shared electric cars by 2030.

talk about unhinged gas-lighting by the perpetually stupid. maybe people who live in downtown metro of certain cities will adopt the car-free lifestyle. It's not uncommon today in DC, NYC, and Chicago. But we're talking in-close to city-center or where trains in particular are well established.

In order to get even 30% into driverless and pure rental the only way to do that is to disenfranchise all but the rich from car ownership thru criminal level of taxes and fees. But something tells me people will be hanging from trees by rope before any such stupidity comes up for a vote.

All this EV/driverless crap is predicated on ignoring physics, reality, and human nature. It will blow sky high just like Communism does EVERY time it's been tried.

 

[FinitePrimus]

Well, I think it will be some time before all EVs are 1-second cars. Right now, it's only very expensive Telsa's, Taycan's that have that enormous performance, and only their top of the range variants. That said, I agree with you that if people are driving like maniacs then there's a risk of government intervention.

As for me, this coming Mach 1 is my last ICE hurrah. I'll modify it, have fun with it. But when the 2.0 version of the Taycan and AMG EV's come out, I'm probably going EV.

In 2008 Space X sent their first prototype rocket into space. 2010 they were able to launch and recover for re-use. This year they are flying space tourists to the space station.

The barriers of performance are much less with EV than with ICE. Tesla has already proven they can make a <2s 0-60mph car. Like anything technology, Moore's law will come into play and within the next 10 years, even the cheapest grocery getter will have the option to select a performance mode on the car to get the same performance (at expense of battery life).

The question really is, for Tesla is 1 second the physics barrier (roadster predictions) or will we see 0.5s 0-60mph cars as the rest catch up. (Top Fuel drag cars are around 0.8 seconds)

 

[FinitePrimus]

In order to get even 30% into driverless and pure rental the only way to do that is to disenfranchise all but the rich from car ownership thru criminal level of taxes and fees.

This is what has already started in many countries as part of the green agenda.

Between taxes, licensing, insurance, fuel, emissions regulations, etc. we are seeing the governments force people away from vehicle ownership. EV's make a perfect model for on-demand rentals - in fact many argue due to limited supply of batteries it may be the only model for EVs to become mainstream in the future.

 

[PC_GUARD]

In 2008 Space X sent their first prototype rocket into space. 2010 they were able to launch and recover for re-use. This year they are flying space tourists to the space station.

The barriers of performance are much less with EV than with ICE. Tesla has already proven they can make a <2s 0-60mph car. Like anything technology, Moore's law will come into play and within the next 10 years, even the cheapest grocery getter will have the option to select a performance mode on the car to get the same performance (at expense of battery life).

The question really is, for Tesla is 1 second the physics barrier (roadster predictions) or will we see 0.5s 0-60mph cars as the rest catch up. (Top Fuel drag cars are around 0.8 seconds)

While yes those events FOR space X are impressive. Do you suppose after 70+ years of rocket tech, suddenly they created new sauce? Do you suppose, that some companies while may have a completely public façade and by all accounts appear to be public entities, are steered a certain way by outside of the company?

How many of the modern companies started in dorm rooms, garages, etc do you suppose are actually an organic creation?


My point in mentioning this is, things get steered, and get steered in a way that usually has a legend attached to it, and they slip in these "innovative" ideas (which are old and brought out like new) to push a direction/agenda?

 

[faser]

Nuclear power is the only way to generate the massive amounts of additional electrons that would be needed to recharge all this electric stuff. Windmills and solar panels are little more than tree hugger, green weenie pipe dreams that are not even remotely close to the answer if the "all electric world" continues to be shoved down our throats in the short term.
Califiornia has all the answers to this currently proposterous "all electric world" equation.
Can you imagine the fate of metro area public are charging stalks. They would be reduced to stumps with a few wires sticking out of them in a matter of hours.
Picture all the apartment dwellers with extension cords running out of 4th floor windows, down the sides of buildings, across side walks, and plugged into their shinny new EV.
Much of this rapid change over to EVs is a "Green New Deal" pipedream that will be free and on the back of the taxpayers with the rest of all of this nonsense.

 

[shogun32]

The question really is, for Tesla is 1 second the physics barrier (roadster predictions) or will we see 0.5s 0-60mph cars as the rest catch up. (Top Fuel drag cars are around 0.8 seconds)

The human body can only sustain a certain amount of force. And sure, you can theoretically take your $35,000 EV Civic and give it a 'rocket' button for a 1 second burst of speed. But if you do, you still have to run the copper wires big enough to sustain the current, the battery pack has to be able to discharge that much energy safely and without leading to fire, and the motor windings also have to survive it. All of that costs $$$$. So as a "that's neat" I can see them overbuilding the drivetrain on special modesl to have that capability, sure. But 99.9999999% of EV won't be equipped to exceed 4sec/0-60 if not more like 7 seconds.

I mean really, 0-60/100 is the DUMBEST thing to design toward once you cross like 8 seconds. You NEVER need anything faster...

 

[theruleslawyer]

I don’t know that performance cars are going away. There will be EV version as least.

• Cheap skateboard style EV platforms are only really suitable for CUV/SUV body styles.
• Handling and styling will still be a priority for some people.

What will change is that stop-light racing will be pointless. Against even a moderate AWD EV you’ll have to do a full launch. That’s going to look aweful silly vs the CUV next to you.

I don’t really expect every EV to be a powerhouse, going faster still costs money even if it is less. However you will see a ton of AWD EV’s in the 4-6s 0-60 range. The average person won’t pay the couple grand upgrade to get really fast, and won’t want the slight range hit with it. Plus I bet it gets marked way up like the MME GT. However there will be more stupid fast cars on the street than before.

I’m not sure we will need regulation. I have to wonder if insurance pricing and purchase price will limit it enough like we have today.

The only real sure thing is that a lot of performance ICE owners are going to get bruised egos, especially RWD cars. There is no way you’ll keep up at a light without looking like a complete Chad all the time.

Track days and canyon carving will still remain the domain of ICE for a long time, but lets face it. Most people don’t do those things.

 

[shogun32]

Track days and canyon carving will still remain the domain of ICE for a long time, but lets face it. Most people don’t do those things.

do people really even do the stop-light drag thing either? If you're over the age of 25?

 

[LSchicago]

do people really even do the stop-light drag thing either? If you're over the age of 25?

Plenty do. Even little old men.

 

[theruleslawyer]

do people really even do the stop-light drag thing either? If you're over the age of 25?

Like full on launch control-on? Not in my experience, but I know a lot of people are competitive at lights. I think a fair amount of people won't like their supercharged v8 getting pwnd by a EV toyota sienna awd

 

[LSchicago]

Like full on launch control-on? Not in my experience, but I know a lot of people are competitive at lights. I think a fair amount of people won't like their supercharged v8 getting pwnd by a EV toyota sienna awd

I don't see that happening to my car anytime soon. I prefer digs vs. rolls.

 

[trackd]

Track days and canyon carving will still remain the domain of ICE for a long time, but lets face it. Most people don’t do those things.

Yep, so true, very small minority track, so much hype and youtubes on silly dangerous street drags, and crashes. Even mags do comparos on 0-60 and qtr, those will be the domain of EVs, no way around the instant torque and awd. I wish to see more Stangs and Camaros, pony cars, at the track, some are very organized with separate run groups based on experience. Try it.

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