I DON'T have the tick but I have the 2K Rattle

[pro 5.0]

I did not hear this as the manifold was messed as well. Once the manifold was swapped I heard this the same minute I drove away from the dealer....

Blows me away how a dealer could make a major repair like that and expect you to pick up the car in that condition. Did they not drive it after the repair ?

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[Mazman]

Blows me away how a dealer could make a major repair like that and expect you to pick up the car in that condition. Did they not drive it after the repair ?

Haha yeah tell me about it.

Not sure how they checked. However I have the 10r80 and the shift strategy do make the tranny to go from 1 to 3rd before 1800rpm usually. Hence the car barely sits in that rpm range if in full auto.

In manual mode when keeping the rpm range steady at around 2k rpm it is noticeable as per the videos.

 

[Jetnoise]

When I received the car from the dealer it had 87 octane then I ran that tank out and put in 91 octane no change in rattle. You are correct that all those variables together will set the stage for detonation, however IMO I believe that with today's technology and the use of 4 knock sensors that the timing would be retarded in such an event and prevent detonation. The charge motion plates essentially control air velocity into the cylinders I doubt that would play a factor, but who's I've seen stranger things.

So what exactly is happening when the 4 knock sensors are triggered? What does the signal translate to in timing reduction mechanically to pull out timing? Is the rattle actually a normal result?
If not ...I still have yet to see a definitive conclusion or proof that rattle means issue with cam, rod, or main clearances or piston slap/cylinder wall scoring.

 

[pro 5.0]

So what exactly is happening when the 4 knock sensors are triggered? What does the signal translate to in timing reduction mechanically to pull out timing? Is the rattle actually a normal result?
If not ...I still have yet to see a definitive conclusion or proof that rattle means issue with cam, rod, or main clearances or piston slap/cylinder wall scoring.

I'm not sure on how the knock strategy or tables are set up but I assume they are load dependent and throttle angle would be a factor as well. Don't quote me but I believe the move to 4 knock sensors from the previous 2 in the Gen 2 was done to better control possible knock due to the higher 12 - 1 compression ratio in the Gen 3.

I know in my car the rattle is 100 % piston slap related as it doesn't do it cold but does once the block warms up and expands, however this may not be the same for other engines. Every situation is different if 1 motor has tight main bearing clearance and someone gets on it cold a bearing could touch off and send metal up to the heads and wipe out the upper valve train components. IMO it's simple if you have a bearing clearance problem that will wipe out the bottom and top end of the motor which would require a long block, you can have piston slap and not score the cylinder walls ( which is where I am currently at ) in my present mileage however that may change with more miles. If you have what I would call major rattle as in the videos provided above you could probably get away with just a short block as long as no metal has circulated through the top end. Bearing problems are typically not rattle sounds they are deep double knock sounds on rod bearings and deep thudding sounds on the mains, also an unusual drop in oil pressure at idle should also be an indicator of such an issue.

I don't think any solution from Ford at the current time will solve these issues as there appears to be a wide variance in the tolerances of these motors, be it bearing clearance or PTW clearance. I know that it sucks and not everyone can afford to spend 10k on a new motor on a new vehicle but I think that is the only true answer to this problem. If you build the motor independent from Ford you will have much better quality control over what you are doing, all clearances can be checked and set to where you want them and not a range of what Ford considers acceptable tolerances and it will be assembled by 1 person who will most likely take pride in what they do. There should be more attention to detail in that situation as no small shop wants a comeback for bad machine work and or assembly issues.

 

[Jetnoise]

I know in my car the rattle is 100 % piston slap related as it doesn't do it cold but does once the block warms up and expands

How did you come to that conclusion?
Some folks here have said ratttles cold gone when warm & vice versa....

The emissions systems, timing systems, fuel management systems are complex. What is happening or being activated in this a 1-2.5k rpm range.
Do you get slap at 4.5k to readline? Does piston slap not manifest itself at all rams?

 

[pro 5.0]

How did you come to that conclusion?
Some folks here have said ratttles cold gone when warm & vice versa....

The emissions systems, timing systems, fuel management systems are complex. What is happening or being activated in this a 1-2.5k rpm range.
Do you get slap at 4.5k to readline? Does piston slap not manifest itself at all rams?

When I was waiting for my car to be built I was obsessed with all that was going on with engine rattles and ticks from the Gen 3 engine, as with anything you need to experience it first hand as there are too many variables in play and every situation is different. Before my car even arrived I said that it will be a rattling pos and it appears I was correct, many people said it was only a small percentage of cars that were affected and I called BS on that and I stated that this problem is bigger than some people are willing to admit. I told myself I will just wait until my car arrives and see for myself if these issues exist or not, not being smug but I have been a red seal tech for 25 years and have owned my own shop for 15 years. I have built many motors in my time including 6 sec pro street race motors trust me I know what piston slap is and I'm not here to tell anyone how to fix there issue, I am simply sharing my experiences and have posted up pic's of my findings in a brand new motor with 300 miles on it.

As for your questions regarding the knock sensors and emission systems I would recommend that you ask the experts at Lund Racing or Palm Beach Dyno, as they are the tuners and are fully aware of how everything in the ECU works.

This is not directed towards you so don't take offense but it always seems that on these forums you get shit on for providing information, no one is on trial here opinions are like assholes everyone has one. Take everything with a grain of salt if you don't agree with what someone has stated then simply move on don't start picking things apart. Everyone thinks they are an expert because they read a book or something on a forum, you never know who is on the other side of the keyboard and what kind of knowledge they possess. You never know you might learn something from someone else's experience and save yourself a lot of money and headache in the process.

Back on topic.

 

[Nomadic]

I can hear mine both cold and warm :(

Funny was at the the dealer 3w ago the tech really tried hard not to hear the sounds. But then he admitted hearing it. Got scheduled for a time on last Monday, the manager tagged along I the car and tried hard not to hear it but admitted that he could "hear something". But they won't take the car in again until Fords own technician (only one in Sweden) has a look at it. However that is not going to happen because the same manager reported back that there is nothing wrong with the car.... What the f...... I Received this info on Thursday. Have submitted the videos below, let's see how it goes

Filmed this on my way home on Thursday....
This apart from the bbq tick

I must be deaf. I heard virtually nothing out of the ordinary in either vid.

 

[Nanashii]

In the mornings it is almost embarrassing driving past pedestrians...

This. When leaving in the morning, everyone in the neighborhood would hear the rattle bouncing off of the houses and look over wondering wtf is wrong with the car.

Here is what the second motor sounded like with about 1k miles on it.

 

[Mazman]

Once you know what to listen for it is quite audiable. However agreed that the clips are not the best source but the sounds come through though.

I must be deaf. I heard virtually nothing out of the ordinary in either vid.

 

[Kirgiz]

I must be deaf. I heard virtually nothing out of the ordinary in either vid.

me too. Mic is very sensitive and it seems like loud but even turn signal sounds loud...

 

[EVL-S550]

Just took mine out for a bit and it's there wether cold or warm. It's only if I'm tipping in the throttle and can make it stop if I adjust acceleration. I feel like it's normal almost. Have zero power loss.

 

[bootlegger]

I have access to 93
I've always wondered if the rattle was potentially fuel related. As in compression ratio, variable timing, low rpm 2k rattle, underload ......in my experience the perfect storm for ping.
Any one with the 2k rattle ever try locking out the CMCV plates?

Back in th Old smog era Ford used valves on the exhaust side that rattled.

I datalogged many times about 500 miles after I started hearing the rattle regularly. No sign of knock at all. I even had the guys at PBD review my logs, and they said it looked good other than running slightly rich. They sent a correction tune, and nothing changed as far as noise goes. I was able to eliminate the rattle for the most part by turning off the A/C. However, in the last 2 weeks, things have gotten worse. Now I hear the rattle with the A/C off and the engine slightly cool. I also have another different rattle when I press the clutch in, driving with medium load, going from 1st to 2nd gear. It still runs well, so I will continue to monitor it. I am afraid I will have to go back to stock tune and visit the dealer in the near future.
On a side note, my "free" first oil change at the dealership resulted in me getting shorted 2 quarts of oil. I am not one to have someone else touch my car for that sort of thing, but couldn't pass up a freebie. I luckily caught it after driving 10 miles back to work. Seems interesting that my rattle would get worse shortly after the first oil change.

 

[Bpro]

My car is currently in the shop for the second time trying to get them to acknowledge this issue, EXACT sound as some of the videos posted here.

Funny part? While it was in there the second time, they decided my MT82 was a piece of **** and needed to be overhauled. It's been in the shop 3 weeks, no ETA on parts still.


They refuse to borescope the engine without me paying up front, because "they don't see the need to."

 

[ponyv6]

Is there anyone who doesn't have this?
I lemoned my 18 because of the tick. it also had the rattle. In that time, I drove 2 new F150s with 5.0 as loaner. they both had it. Now, I have my 2019 (09/2018 build) it also has the rattle when cold.
Going through buyback and leaving the car at the dealer for almost 3months was too much pain. I dont wanna go through that with 2019 too.

 

[bootlegger]

Is there anyone who doesn't have this?
I lemoned my 18 because of the tick. it also had the rattle. In that time, I drove 2 new F150s with 5.0 as loaner. they both had it. Now, I have my 2019 (09/2018 build) it also has the rattle when cold.
Going through buyback and leaving the car at the dealer for almost 3months was too much pain. I dont wanna go through that with 2019 too.

Some claim to not have it. I am not sure I believe any car doesn't have some level rattle, even if it is barely audible. Maybe there are some lucky ones out there, but I am not part of that group (nor are the local owners I have met).

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