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Hyperco 18Z1440 as a rear spring

SteveW

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Hey guys, thought I'd share something I'm MacGyvering into my setup.

I'm running my car in CAMC this year and if you look at wheel rates and/or hz of typical national level ST setups none of the common aftermarket springs available for this car are anywhere close the rates people run on other cars at the pointy end of the classes. I don't have a shock package right now that is setup to run a true coilover rear where you could run 2.25" race springs and get to the rates I think we'd need to be at, so did some google-foo on springs that might work in the OEM location of the rear control arms and found this Hyperco spring.

It's a 1440 lb-in, 5.5"OD x 9.5" long spring ground on one end, open coil on the other. I figure that rate gets me in the 2.08ish hz range with about double the wheel rate of a GT PP. I'm pairing it with a 350 lb-in 60mm spring on my front struts although, I had been running a 450 lb-in spring. A 350 lb front spring gets me around 1.97ish hz and about double the GT PP front wheel rate too. So, balanced with the rear according to book theory.

The rear springs on my Roush kit are somewhere in the 950 lb-in range and the car rode like crap paired with the 450 lb front springs. This combo also doesn't appear to be working good as an autox setup so far this year.

Anyway enough jabbering on about that stuff. So far, I've just installed them and they fit in there like they were made for the car. No slack at full droop with the shocks hooked up and rode fine on a short around the block test before calling it an evening. I'll drive the car to work tomorrow and get a few miles on that way.

If you have an adjustable perch for the OEM rear location you could probably make these springs work. Hyperco also has a whole pile of rates in this size spring although, 1440 is the stiffest. 1440 is the stiffest spring I found that seemed like it would fit on the car in the OEM location.

Thought I'd share what I was up to :ford:



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Norm Peterson

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It's a 1440 lb-in, 5.5"OD x 9.5" long spring ground on one end, open coil on the other. I figure that rate gets me in the 2.08ish hz range with about double the wheel rate of a GT PP. I'm pairing it with a 350 lb-in 60mm spring on my front struts although, I had been running a 450 lb-in spring. A 350 lb front spring gets me around 1.97ish hz and about double the GT PP front wheel rate too. So, balanced with the rear according to book theory.

The rear springs on my Roush kit are somewhere in the 950 lb-in range and the car rode like crap paired with the 450 lb front springs. This combo also doesn't appear to be working good as an autox setup so far this year.
Guessing there was more front-to-back head toss with the 450/950 combination.


Norm
 
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SteveW

SteveW

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Guessing there was more front-to-back head toss with the 450/950 combination.


Norm
What shocks are you running?
Norm, pretty much. There was a slight fr-r bobbing that would come and go on smooth, level roads and the car just didn't feel good reacting to bumps. Doesn't feel like the car is 'all it can be' with that combo.

jhols, I'm on Roush V3s so, KW V3 doubles. I wouldn't recommend these at this point with all the other options available now.
 

BmacIL

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450/950 gives a front to rear ride frequency ratio of 0.75...that will ride like crap. You want to be near 1 to 1.10. 450/1440 gets you much closer at 0.93. Try a 350 or 400 lb/in front with the 1440 rear. With 350/1440 you'd be at 1.98 and 2.08 Hz, front and rear, and a 1.05 ratio. I can say from my experience that 1.05 rides quite well from a flat ride perspective. It settles very fast and does not buck and give you head toss. Yours will obviously be a lot firmer, as mine is at 1.64 and 1.72 Hz.
 

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SteveW

SteveW

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you're going the wrong direction on front spring.
forget the math, trust the clock.
but you already know that :)
Somehow I knew you'd say that :thumbsup:

Here's where I'm at: my car is not faster this year than last despite the upgrades. I know part of the reason (wheels/tires vs not adjusting rev limit and gears + compound).

What I don't know is what the 450 rate was doing to my cheesy struts. Springs are cheap when you go the Hyperco route so, I figure lemme try the math thing, see where it gets me, as in hopefully better than last year, then step it up. I still have the 450s.

On shocks and struts...I know I need to get rid of what I have but it seems to me that that area is still evolving for our cars. I can't upgrade those at this time so I'll just keep monitoring the situation. Seems like it's between Ridetech and Cortex/MMI-JRi right now but not sure the ideal rear package is totally figured out yet.
 

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Somehow I knew you'd say that :thumbsup:

Here's where I'm at: my car is not faster this year than last despite the upgrades. I know part of the reason (wheels/tires vs not adjusting rev limit and gears + compound).

What I don't know is what the 450 rate was doing to my cheesy struts. Springs are cheap when you go the Hyperco route so, I figure lemme try the math thing, see where it gets me, as in hopefully better than last year, then step it up. I still have the 450s.

On shocks and struts...I know I need to get rid of what I have but it seems to me that that area is still evolving for our cars. I can't upgrade those at this time so I'll just keep monitoring the situation. Seems like it's between Ridetech and Cortex/MMI-JRi right now but not sure the ideal rear package is totally figured out yet.
How are you calculating the wheel frequencies? I thought you had to have the sprung and unsprung mass in there?
 

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Somehow I knew you'd say that :thumbsup:
you know i had to :p

no harm in trying different setups, just trying to save you the time.
fwiw, i am going to try a softer setup this weekend, since i was only using half my travel up front at crows. relatively, of course. it'll still be stiffer than anything you'd probably want to try if you aren't confident your front valving can handle it.

if you still haven't upgraded, i'll probably be selling my JRZ remote doubles sometime in the next year or two, when i go SLA. they don't suck, they're "evolved" :D
 
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SteveW

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SteveW

SteveW

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you know i had to :p

no harm in trying different setups, just trying to save you the time.
fwiw, i am going to try a softer setup this weekend, since i was only using half my travel up front at crows. relatively, of course. it'll still be stiffer than anything you'd probably want to try if you aren't confident your front valving can handle it.

if you still haven't upgraded, i'll probably be selling my JRZ remote doubles sometime in the next year or two, when i go SLA. they don't suck, they're "evolved" :D
Took the curvy, practice route home between Bend and Redmond earlier. Dang, the a$$-end is hooked and for the first time I was thinking it'd be nice to have more power. Although, I've felt good about my car before....lol.

You still doing the course this weekend in Dalles?
 

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Hi everyone,

We will be testing 400lbs/in front and 1400lbs/in rear Tomorrow.

Keep you guys posted.
 

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I was going to say I thought Steeda was testing rates at that level.

My Steeda dual rates are 350 front and 1200 rear linear at curb and I really can't find anything to complain about (using their adjustable shocks) at my level. Will hang around here until I earn myself some more driver skillzzzzzz. :)
 
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SteveW

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Hi everyone,

We will be testing 400lbs/in front and 1400lbs/in rear Tomorrow.

Keep you guys posted.
It's a little firm for the masses but feels awesome to this competition minded owner. Can't wait to autocross the new setup this weekend.

I'm also running your sway bars, rear upper shock mounts, LCA bushings, trans and diff bushing inserts, and probably a few other Steeda goodies.
 

Competition Orange

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I'm shocked the ground control kits aren't more popular with the non street classed crowd. Perches and can source spring rates as high as available.
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