HP GT500 vs. Z51 C8 at VIR: MotorTrend/Randy Pobst

[Skwibbs]

Something else I'll add: I'm new to heavy sports cars with the ZLE (tracked a lotus elise and then a C6 Z06 before the camaro) and I'm learning the tires do not last long. I've done two days of time trials driving hard with the ZLE track alignment and the front tires are corded!

If there's going to be a fair comparison, both cars really do need new sets of tires.

Besides the magazine and YouTube road course comparisons, I'm primarily looking forward to running with other GT500s in these events and getting to see first hand the differences between the cars as well as talking to the owners in person.

Yep, the more weight the less the tires will last. One of many reasons I want to get rid of the rear seats and switch to Signature wheels for the 500.

I haven't owned light light cars compared to you, my last car being a 17 2SS, and before that a Challenger which feels like a millenia ago now. Lightest car I've owned was a 16 370Z Nismo but that was such a different car even to the SS, so analog. And hell, that was only temporary for me anyway. I had the 500 on order already and some dick in a box truck pushed me into oncoming traffic in the SS then fled the scene, so I only had the Nissan as an interim car for S&Gs. I know I probably could've gotten like a conquest bonus towards the 500 if I used the insurance check for another Camaro, but variety is the spice of life right?

How's the A10 in the ZLE? Only ever driven its Mustang PP1 GT equivalent and to be honest even though the A8 in the SS wasn't the most responsive, I found it more enjoyable to drive in manual compared to the 10, so many gears to go through. In auto however it felt much smoother and faster than the SS A8 as far as the trans goes. The double click downshift from 5 to 3 in my SS was so bloody satisfying, I'll give it that.

To be fair, none of this imo compares to the 500's DCT, it's one of the reasons I bought the car and have not been disappointed to say the least.

Edit: I've heard nothing but good things about the programming of the A10 in the ZLE, and if Ford for whatever reason didn't come out with the new 500 I would've scooped up a ZLE in an instant. The C8 is potentionally going to be awesome in higher trims but the price combined with uncertain reliability, plus my impatience would've steered me away. And I've heard the Alpha chassis is better.

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[ZRacerLE]

Yep, the more weight the less the tires will last. One of many reasons I want to get rid of the rear seats and switch to Signature wheels for the 500.

I haven't owned light light cars compared to you, my last car being a 17 2SS, and before that a Challenger which feels like a millenia ago now. Lightest car I've owned was a 16 370Z Nismo but that was such a different car even to the SS, so analog. And hell, that was only temporary for me anyway. I had the 500 on order already and some dick in a box truck pushed me into oncoming traffic in the SS then fled the scene, so I only had the Nissan as an interim car for S&Gs. I know I probably could've gotten like a conquest bonus towards the 500 if I used the insurance check for another Camaro, but variety is the spice of life right?

How's the A10 in the ZLE? Only ever driven its Mustang PP1 GT equivalent and to be honest even though the A8 in the SS wasn't the most responsive, I found it more enjoyable to drive in manual compared to the 10, so many gears to go through. In auto however it felt much smoother and faster than the SS A8 as far as the trans goes. The double click downshift from 5 to 3 in my SS was so bloody satisfying, I'll give it that.

To be fair, none of this imo compares to the 500's DCT, it's one of the reasons I bought the car and have not been disappointed to say the least.

Very cool you got to experience the 6th gen alpha platform and now the 500. I bet that DCT feels unreal.

I was a "heel toe hero" in the M6 C6Z and was very proud of being able to hustle a manual around a road course pretty quickly, but I'll tell you now, I'm not looking back with this A10 in the ZLE. The ZLE gets a different transmission tune than the ZL1 A10 when its in track mode, optimized for racing. I can't imagine being able to shift any better than the computer, even with paddle shifting. My guess is auto mode in the gt500 dct is similar or even better.

There's a chance I'll never own a manual again with the DCTs popping up in everything and then everything eventually going electric. For me, I want something I can keep stock (tired of modding and then hoping I didn't eff something up - factory engineers know best imo), but be very competitive in time trial type events. I think that's why I don't mind giving up the engagement of a manual.

I'm past the whole straight line speed thing, but the ZLE A10 feels as fast in a straight line as my H/C/I C6Z with the same wheel hp even though the C6Z was 700lbs lighter. It's the ability of the A10 to keep the engine at peak torque through the pull. It's like it effectively adds 50 to 100hp. Same thing with the gt500, I'm sure... feels like it has about 850hp?

 

[Skwibbs]

Very cool you got to experience the 6th gen alpha platform and now the 500. I bet that DCT feels unreal.

I was a "heel toe hero" in the M6 C6Z and was very proud of being able to hustle a manual around a road course pretty quickly, but I'll tell you now, I'm not looking back with this A10 in the ZLE. The ZLE gets a different transmission tune than the ZL1 A10 when its in track mode, optimized for racing. I can't imagine being able to shift any better than the computer, even with paddle shifting. My guess is auto mode in the gt500 dct is similar or even better.

There's a chance I'll never own a manual again with the DCTs popping up in everything and then everything eventually going electric. For me, I want something I can keep stock (tired of modding and then hoping I didn't eff something up - factory engineers know best imo), but be very competitive in time trial type events. I think that's why I don't mind giving up the engagement of a manual.

I'm past the whole straight line speed thing, but the ZLE A10 feels as fast in a straight line as my H/C/I C6Z with the same wheel hp even though the C6Z was 700lbs lighter. It's the ability of the A10 to keep the engine at peak torque through the pull. It's like it effectively adds 50 to 100hp. Same thing with the gt500, I'm sure... feels like it has about 850hp?

Yeah man, I adored my 6th gen 2SS, put the power down like nobody's business, and would recommend it to anyone that can get used to the visibility which I never found too bad personally. Blind spot tech is such a good tech advancement as far as visibility goes. Don't like the look of the new SS though... I got my '17 for around 38k marked down from 46.5k, quite the bang for buck, just like the ZL1s.

Totally agree on the warranty voiding modifications thing, with you 100%. Besides, these cars are near perfect as it is for what they want to achieve (both cars). I do still hope to get behind the wheel of a ZLE to feel those spool valve dampers for myself.

And yeah, I'd say Ford slightly underrated the 500, butt dyno feels like 800 crank, but we'd have to look at real dyno results for that and I'm feeling lazy atm. The trans though like you said makes it insane, as good if not better than PDK, although I haven't driven track focused 911s before and they probably have different programming just like your ZLE in track mode. Haven't driven in track mode much yet in the Shelby, only have 200 miles so far. The DCT is only a little jerky when coming up to stop signs and such, but I heard that goes away later once the trans "learns you".

Have any pics of your car handy out of curiosity?

 

[shogun32]

And I've heard the Alpha chassis is better.

it definitely is, and GM's tuning of the MR dampers is also vastly better than Ford's GT/EB/GT350 efforts. Can't say about GT500. Maybe Ford hired some spies this time around.

 

[Skwibbs]

it definitely is, and GM's tuning of the MR dampers is also vastly better than Ford's GT/EB/GT350 efforts. Can't say about GT500. Maybe Ford hired some spied this time around.

Better than the C8's new chassis, to be specific. Heard multiple people say the Alpha is a bit better than the C8's, although it is just the first year and they plan on using this platform for over a decade to come.

But yeah, GM has the chassis advantage over Ford for sure, but I'm not sure I'd agree on the MagneRide front, at least not as far as the 500 goes.

All aspects of the suspension are phenomenal, better than a SS 1LE I'd say and that's a tall order. Oh, and far far superior to a Hellcat's suspension, whatever the hell they're doing, although I don't think that's mostly even a question unless comfort is all you care about. Funny enough and speaking of; also have heard the C8 in it's current trim level is surprisingly comfortable.

Looking forward to more track comparisons though, with any competition. That Jason Cammisa Issimi Icon video on the GT500 was exceptionally good with the GT3RS participating and having that side by side lap.

 

[ZRacerLE]

Yeah man, I adored my 6th gen 2SS, put the power down like nobody's business, and would recommend it to anyone that can get used to the visibility which I never found too bad personally. Blind spot tech is such a good tech advancement as far as visibility goes. Don't like the look of the new SS though... I got my '17 for around 38k marked down from 46.5k, quite the bang for buck, just like the ZL1s.

Totally agree on the warranty voiding modifications thing, with you 100%. Besides, these cars are near perfect as it is for what they want to achieve (both cars). I do still hope to get behind the wheel of a ZLE to feel those spool valve dampers for myself.

And yeah, I'd say Ford slightly underrated the 500, butt dyno feels like 800 crank, but we'd have to look at real dyno results for that and I'm feeling lazy atm. The trans though like you said makes it insane, as good if not better than PDK, although I haven't driven track focused 911s before and they probably have different programming just like your ZLE in track mode. Haven't driven in track mode much yet in the Shelby, only have 200 miles so far. The DCT is only a little jerky when coming up to stop signs and such, but I heard that goes away later once the trans "learns you".

Have any pics of your car handy out of curiosity?

Going in to battle...

... and here are my battle scares after 2 days (damn these heavy cars!)

 

[Skwibbs]

Going in to battle...

... and here are my battle scares after 2 days (damn these heavy cars!)

Badass. That thing looks like like a monster scalpel. Love those matte wheels, one of the reasons I'm considering that finish for my Signature set but matte just fits the ZLE so much better with the matte hood and front end bits.

Those poor tires haha

 

[ZRacerLE]

Badass. That thing looks like like a monster scalpel. Love those matte wheels, one of the reasons I'm considering that finish for my Signature set but matte just fits the ZLE so much better with the matte hood and front end bits.

Those poor tires haha

Thanks man. I've still got my hands full with it. After only few events, I'm no where near the limit on track yet like I was with the C6Z, but I'm already way faster.

I'm preaching to the choir, but the 500 is one of the baddest cars I've ever seen with ridiculous performance to back it up. Pretty sure it will be one of my all time favorite cars. A stock, 10 second Mustang that laps with a GT3RS? Tell me I'm dreaming, lol!!

 

[Cobra Therapy]

I tend to agree unless the track is super tight and technical, and even then I'd probably bet on the CFTP. Wonder if they'll release that video for comparison reasons.

And yeah, just waiting for someone to do a fair ZLE auto vs CFTP track test. Not on melted tires cough cough Throttle House, as much as I love those guys.

I agree the messed up tires on the GT500 was the only reason it lost. Randy said the GT500 was 10 miles per hour faster. That's huge.

 

[ZRacerLE]

I agree the messed up tires on the GT500 was the only reason it lost. Randy said the GT500 was 10 miles per hour faster. That's huge.

That IS huge. Like I said, I'd like to see the speeds on the nurburgring straights. Could be 20mph to 30mph.

 

[Cobra Therapy]

That IS huge. Like I said, I'd like to see the speeds on the nurburgring straights. Could be 20mph to 30mph.

i agree!

 

[cosmic charlie]

For those who might not have seen it. Here is a direct comparison at Laguna Seca between GT500 Base and C8 Z51.

 

[17Magnetic5.0]

I like the gt500 but the C8 excites me more. The way it carries the speed into the corners was incredible. I’d love to see what a supercharged example would do.

 

[Cobra Therapy]

For those who might not have seen it. Here is a direct comparison at Laguna Seca between GT500 Base and C8 Z51.

the click bait master is no pro driver.

 

[Stymee]

Wait til the C8 Z06 comes out let alone the ZR1, the bar will be set with these 2 C8’s under 125k and probably better many above it

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