How badly is Ford struggling?

Discussion in 'General Automotive Topics (non 6th Gen Mustang)' started by 1MEAN18, May 22, 2019.

  1. Tseg

    Tseg Well-Known Member

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    Back in the day the 'loyalty model' showed a 20-something bought a Ford entry level then graduated to Ford mid-tier and so on. Today Brand Loyalty has diminished a lot. I have owned Ford's in my life... the last one 14 years ago with a number of other brand vehicles in between before I bought my Mustang. An entry level car is cheap quality, lacks style and makes little to no money for the manufacturer. I don't see entry level cars driving brand loyalty anymore. If those cheap cars only existed to cover overhead costs and to try to drive brand loyalty, if you cut them it makes sense overhead has to be cut as well. Heck, going back to the Eighties my first car was a Subaru, my second was am Eagle (Talon Turbo). They were great cars but also the last of those brands I ever bought.
     
  2. Timeless

    Timeless Well-Known Member

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    Curious as to the soul of a car explanation?

    I own two Mazdas currently and only the 29 year old Miata would I say comes anywhere close to 'having a soul'.

    Looking at their current lineup you see the same thing every other Japanese company has other than the MX-5. So does having a roadster make them care about the soul of a car?

    If they truly cared about what the enthusiasts want they'd have a Mazda Speed MX-5/3/6 and bring back the RX7. But those are not profitable so they are just as 'soulless' a company as any other.
     
  3. NYDP77

    NYDP77 Well-Known Member

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    I blame this on people wanting to have the same SUV type vehicle. Think with all the cars gone how many jobs were involved with that.
     
  4. jacknifetoaswan

    jacknifetoaswan Well-Known Member

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    That literally makes no sense. Have you even read what you typed? Ford cannot, CANNOT, meet CAFE standards with their existing vehicle lineup, if it were to be all V8s. If you can't understand that, I don't know what to tell you.

    I mean, to be fair, people want utilitarian vehicles that provide some semblance of status, yet don't look "uncool", like station wagons do. Personally, I'd take a station wagon over an SUV any day, as it provides more room, better ride, and is less compromised than an SUV. Unfortunately, the are like two station wagons that I could actually buy, and they're both extremely expensive. So, for people that don't want a truck, or can't afford the truck or the fuel for the truck, what do they buy? Most cars don't have sufficient space for their brood and all their shit, so they go to an SUV/CUV. Ford is just following the trend at this time.

    JR
     
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  5. Hi-PO Stang

    Hi-PO Stang Well-Known Member

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    Right now, I think Ford has more choices for performance enthusiast than they have had for many years. In 2007 I was thrilled to buy a 300 HP Mustang with a manual trans. Now Ford has an Ecoboost Four cylinder Mustang with 330 Horsepower and manual trans. Ford also has a manual trans Mustang GT and Bullitt Mustang and GT350 with a manual trans. It has been a long since we have had it so good. We are fortunate to have such good Ford performance cars considering the box the government puts the manufacturers into with safety regulations and fuel mileage restrictions. I am enjoying my choices from Ford right now. I don't but four door sedans when I can buy an SUV that is more practical and can have all wheel drive. If I want a car, I buy Mustangs.
     
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  6. Biggus Dickus

    Biggus Dickus Well-Known Member

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    They should at least bring the Focus back to the US.

    Produce a good electric car.

    Hope the Bronco is cool

    Wait for the next-gen Edge and Ranger - the current versions are past their sell-by date.

    Get rid of their short-sighted CEO
     
  7. Ebm

    Ebm Well-Known Member

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    My whole spiel was saying that some people(of all ages) can't afford anything more than what you call an "entry-level" car. A lot of people can't afford a $40k or $50k truck or suv. If people can't afford the prices, they take their business elsewhere(to another car manufacturer) or they buy used instead. Ford would be suffering if that was the case.
     
  8. Big Boss

    Big Boss Well-Known Member

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    I agree. That is why I happen to be driving a 2018 Mazda6 now.

    I would say that they have a soul because they seem to still care about the driving experience. I know my 6 is no sports car, but compared to all of the other midsize sedans I test drove it was way more engaging and fun. I guess the best way to describe the way my 6 drives is athletic. I really wanted the Fusion Sport, loved the straightline speed but the handling and overall driving dynamics felt numb to me compared to the 6. (also didn't help I couldn't find a Sport equipped how I wanted and I was in a crunch to get a vehicle quickly)

    The CX-5 I test drove even without the 2.5T was way more engaging than my mother-in-law's ecoboost escape
     
  9. sdiver68

    sdiver68 Well-Known Member

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    I have a degree in Economics and an MBA. I agree with the first part but would love to have your explanation of how stock price is not determined by the markets expectation of discounted future cash flows as determined by evaluation of how the company is doing.

    Or are we really saying the same thing, ha!
     
  10. EcoVert

    EcoVert Well-Known Member

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    I agree need a car guy not a furniture ceo
     
  11. EcoVert

    EcoVert Well-Known Member

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    I have to disagree the stock market drives everything Ford and the other automakers do they have to provide profits for the shareholders.
     
  12. SVTSNAKE355

    SVTSNAKE355 Well-Known Member

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    I never said all V8s you need to learn how to read:lipssealed:
     
  13. SVTSNAKE355

    SVTSNAKE355 Well-Known Member

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    I agree, too much money being wasted on electric
     
  14. Guard5.0

    Guard5.0 Well-Known Member

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    Is it a coincidence that the worlds largest and richest auto manufacturer also makes what in my subjective opinion is the most boring car line available. I’m amazed at the plethora of performance alternatives available to the general public when those cars basically serve the “5% forum fringe” including the highest performance Mustangs ever created. Car companies are simply businesses and they must chase that 95% buyer market to stay afloat. Ford is simply following suit with the industry. It’s also important to remember that companies such as GM and Ford, once globally dominant in the market are rapidly settling in as secondary players to companies line Toyota, Hyundai, VW, etc.
     
  15. EcoVert

    EcoVert Well-Known Member

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    Possibly, unless or until the automakers including Ford can get he base price down to around 22k electrics will never have the intended impact on the supposed climate change.
     
  16. Tseg

    Tseg Well-Known Member

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    As an old truck driver told me back in the 1980's, "It doesn't take a lot of money to buy a Corvette, just a big set of balls to sign on the dotted line." I never forgot those words, and I still have not owned a Corvette. Everything is relative.
     
  17. nastang87xx

    nastang87xx Well-Known Member

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    Because the margins aren't there. Ford is a company that is out to make money, not appease a very niche crowd like ourselves. We're lucky we still get the Mustang. If Jim Hackett had his way, the Mustang would be gone too.

    The MAJORITY of new car buyers (note, MAJORITY is not enthusiasts. We are realistically far from a dime a dozen) do not want big V8's anymore and Ecoboost is just a sham. I mean, I like some of the Ecoboost motors. The 2.0 is great fun and the 2.7 in the F150 is a shockingly good performer. The automotive market is becoming clearer yet also more cloudy at the same time.

    The Chevy SS is a very clear indicator of how well a big American V8 sedan with an manual transmission will sell: HORRIBLY. The Dodge Charger seems to do alright. Frankly I'm not sure why but it does sell. I would assume that's because the Hemi is pretty solid, granted not without some issues here and there, couldn't comment on the Pentastar V6 though, and the ZF8 transmission complements the car very effectively in all trims. The Taurus was just garbage. Awful ergos, awful passenger space, not very attractive design, questionable reliability, and uninspiring engines. The Taurus tried to blend too many missions together and failed at all of them.
     
  18. nastang87xx

    nastang87xx Well-Known Member

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    All of this. Ford is a company, not a charity case.
     
  19. Big Boss

    Big Boss Well-Known Member

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    To be fair, the Chevy SS was never meant to sell in large volumes. IIRC the only reason they even brought it over here was to fill out volume at the plant in Australia before it closed or something along those lines.
     
  20. nastang87xx

    nastang87xx Well-Known Member

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    That seems like a LOT of operating and import/export cost to accomplish that. Yes the SS was never going to sell big but damn...
     
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