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WItoTX

WItoTX

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Thanks for the comments all. @JAJ , I definitely saw that with the rear camber. I have AAD's toe links sitting at the neighbors house since we were out all weekend. Going to start tinkering with it this week. to get myself back to the 0mm-2mm toe in I am shooting for.

@Tomster , I agree, the shop was lazy. A lot of autocross guys recommended them, so it kind of surprised me when they said that. In all fairness, I didn't help myself when I didn't come with specific numbers I wanted. I honestly hadn't thought much about it, and this last event really pointed out how much grip the rear was missing. I was going to replace camber arms anyways, so it is what it is. Once I have a lift, a lot of this work gets easier. But that is still a year or two down the road. And for sure on the strut nut clearance. It's hard to tell from the photo, but there is a gap, I made sure by running a piece of paper through LOL.

@BadHabit2Break , I saw your car. In fact I meant to stop by, but got side tracked helping some others. I will be sure to swing by next time, but won't be back out until the May event at the earliest. Going to do BMW club at the end of April.

@AAD Performance I didn't realize you were a sponsor on this site. I really need to get better at looking at sponsors before I start buying. Thanks again for the fantastic components!

Thanks again to everyone following. More this week once I get some more stuff put on and find a skidpad/parking lot!

 

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Thanks for the comments all. @JAJ , I definitely saw that with the rear camber. I have AAD's toe links sitting at the neighbors house since we were out all weekend. Going to start tinkering with it this week. to get myself back to the 0mm-2mm toe in I am shooting for.

@Tomster , I agree, the shop was lazy. A lot of autocross guys recommended them, so it kind of surprised me when they said that. In all fairness, I didn't help myself when I didn't come with specific numbers I wanted. I honestly hadn't thought much about it, and this last event really pointed out how much grip the rear was missing. I was going to replace camber arms anyways, so it is what it is. Once I have a lift, a lot of this work gets easier. But that is still a year or two down the road. And for sure on the strut nut clearance. It's hard to tell from the photo, but there is a gap, I made sure by running a piece of paper through LOL.

@BadHabit2Break , I saw your car. In fact I meant to stop by, but got side tracked helping some others. I will be sure to swing by next time, but won't be back out until the May event at the earliest. Going to do BMW club at the end of April.

@AAD Performance I didn't realize you were a sponsor on this site. I really need to get better at looking at sponsors before I start buying. Thanks again for the fantastic components!

Thanks again to everyone following. More this week once I get some more stuff put on and find a skidpad/parking lot!
On the strut nut clearance, Vorshlag's website (https://vorshlag.smugmug.com/Instructions/Camber-Plate-Install-Mustang/i-2KhH7SN/A) says this:

"Before the top nuts are tight, make an initial camber setting. If you are looking for the maximum negative camber you need to leave at least 1/8" from the strut shaft to the edge of the hole in the strut tower.

The stem moves in a small figure 8 when you turn the wheel from lock to lock. If you don't leave this gap the stem will smash the edge of your strut tower.

NOTE: For dedicated race cars, if your class rules allow it you can open up this strut tower top hole to gain more camber and caster adjustment room. Many classes do not. Call us if you are thinking of doing this "strut tower hole" mod - it cannot easily be un-done!"


I added the bolding.

BTW, I like the way the AAD adjusters work - the absence of jam nuts is a real bonus.
 
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I wanted to give a brief update since my last post. I was one of the lucky ones to catch when OP had spindles with the GT4 studs in stock. I picked up a set, as well as some spacers. With the added camber, I am going to try and get the front track a little wider. I picked up a set of 10mm for the factory rims, and 28mm for when I go square. I am in the midst of researching rims, and have leaned heavily towards the Apex Forged Sprint VS05RS or EC-7RS wheels, so I would love to hear anyone’s real world feedback. A 10 lb unspring weight reduction per rim would be massive.

Since last post, I received a pile of new AAD stuff, which will all get put on this week. First, I got a catch can, which I need to get put on and then get hose on order.

1647900295915.png
1647900304237.png


Built very well, and looks like something I would like. My Hellcat had an orange catch can, so blood red works wells for me. I also received hubs and GT4 studs from OP. As I said earlier, I am planning on going square, so I have been paying attention to OP since I will need the hubs at some point, and I like the idea of an extra set of hubs anyways. Ignore the diapers, it was a big day for deliveries at my household!
1647900320498.png


I also received AAD toe links. With my camber arms, as others pointed out, the toe got all out of wack. I plan to get these installed once the vertical links show up. Hopefully tomorrow or Wednesday.
1647900331257.png
1647900336746.png


Everything sent has been well built. I am a little nervous about the AAD toe links getting me to exactly 0mm - 2mm toe in just because it is predefined positions or keys for the toe adjustment, but we will see once I get them on. They are a solid unit just like their camber arms. Built like Reggie White.

I will provide an update once I get everything on. Going to be a busy week and work, and I hope to get in the garage as soon as I get the vertical links.

To those who have sent PM’s, I really appreciate the feedback and comments. This whole “writing about what you have done” has been far more difficult than I ever expected, much less remembering to take photos of bits you want to write about later. So as always, any feedback you have feel free to each out!
 
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On the strut nut clearance, Vorshlag's website (https://vorshlag.smugmug.com/Instructions/Camber-Plate-Install-Mustang/i-2KhH7SN/A) says this:

"Before the top nuts are tight, make an initial camber setting. If you are looking for the maximum negative camber you need to leave at least 1/8" from the strut shaft to the edge of the hole in the strut tower.

The stem moves in a small figure 8 when you turn the wheel from lock to lock. If you don't leave this gap the stem will smash the edge of your strut tower.

NOTE: For dedicated race cars, if your class rules allow it you can open up this strut tower top hole to gain more camber and caster adjustment room. Many classes do not. Call us if you are thinking of doing this "strut tower hole" mod - it cannot easily be un-done!"


I added the bolding.

BTW, I like the way the AAD adjusters work - the absence of jam nuts is a real bonus.
And this is why I am glad I started posted. I hadn't seen that from Vorshlag, but will now be making some adjustments. Thank you for posting!

The class thing is the only reason I haven't increased the size of the top of the strut tower.
 

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...Everything sent has been well built. I am a little nervous about the AAD toe links getting me to exactly 0mm - 2mm toe in just because it is predefined positions or keys for the toe adjustment, but we will see once I get them on. They are a solid unit just like their camber arms. Built like Reggie White...
The toe adjustment is very sensitive and, with the index plates, you might have a problem hitting the exact toe you want. However, because camber and toe interact and if you're willing to give up a little precision on camber, you can probably fine tune both settings to yield a camber setting you can live with that puts the toe where you want it.
 
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The toe adjustment is very sensitive and, with the index plates, you might have a problem hitting the exact toe you want. However, because camber and toe interact and if If you're willing to give up a little precision on camber, you can probably fine tune both settings to yield a camber setting you can live with that puts the toe where you want it.
So the question I have is, as I increase camber (I went from -.9 to -1.8), how is toe affected? Looking at the geometry of the rear suspension, I expected the toe out. But it is exactly the opposite, as I went from 2mm toe in to 7 mm toe in. I would love to know the math of "if Increase camber this much" and the resulting change in toe.

It seems like there should be a ratio, and I have all my camber/toe numbers from each change, so hopefully I can come up with something. I am debating going back to the original camber key, and then adjusting toe with the factory toe link to see what I actually end up with between the two.

Anyways, I am just thinking out loud now. I appreciate the input, gives plenty to think about.
 

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So the question I have is, as I increase camber (I went from -.9 to -1.8), how is toe affected? Looking at the geometry of the rear suspension, I expected the toe out. But it is exactly the opposite, as I went from 2mm toe in to 7 mm toe in. I would love to know the math of "if Increase camber this much" and the resulting change in toe.

It seems like there should be a ratio, and I have all my camber/toe numbers from each change, so hopefully I can come up with something. I am debating going back to the original camber key, and then adjusting toe with the factory toe link to see what I actually end up with between the two.

Anyways, I am just thinking out loud now. I appreciate the input, gives plenty to think about.
You'll be able to hit the toe number you desire with our arms, we have a -8mm to +9mm tab selection in half mm increments. Our test car sits at -1.2 degrees camber and used a -3mm tab in the toe link, which is what came pre installed in yours, (-1,-2,-4 are also included) additional adjustment tabs are available on our site and are sold at cost. Half mm increment tabs are not listed on the site for various reasons but if you need them, let me know.

One of the great things about our products and really the structure of our small company is we have the ability to alter our base product for specific needs. We worked with bankyf to alter the camber lockout to be offset because he couldnt get enough positive camber, now we can get very positive, very negative, and anywhere in-between. The same can be done with the toe lockouts, if need be for your application (which is highly unlikely)


Based on the geometry of the suspension, there is a camber/toe ratio, whether its linear or not im not sure. We'll get your alignment where it needs to be, I am certain of that.
 

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Also on the catch can hose! Make sure you get Pcv hose that is reinforced and can handle 25 inhg or so, That hose is expensive but it will keep the hose from collapsing on itself under engine braking!
 

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So the question I have is, as I increase camber (I went from -.9 to -1.8), how is toe affected? Looking at the geometry of the rear suspension, I expected the toe out. But it is exactly the opposite, as I went from 2mm toe in to 7 mm toe in. I would love to know the math of "if Increase camber this much" and the resulting change in toe.

It seems like there should be a ratio, and I have all my camber/toe numbers from each change, so hopefully I can come up with something. I am debating going back to the original camber key, and then adjusting toe with the factory toe link to see what I actually end up with between the two.

Anyways, I am just thinking out loud now. I appreciate the input, gives plenty to think about.
It took me a while to figure out how to think about the rear suspension geometry but I finally have a mental model that make sense. It works like this:

Imagine you're looking down on the right rear suspension. You see the camber link in line with the hub and the toe link ahead of it. What you can't see is the virtual pivot point for the hub that's out in space behind the hub as you look down.

When you extend the toe link outward to reduce toe-in, the camber link has to extend a bit to keep the camber constant. The motion ratio, as far as I can tell is about 2:1 toe to camber. If you extend the toe link 2 mm, the camber link needs 1 mm.

Now, imagine you're looking back from in front of the right rear suspension. At the top you have the camber link and down low you have the toe link. The pivot point is IN BETWEEN them, above the toe link and below the camber link.

When you shorten the camber link to increase negative camber, the toe link needs to pivot outward and so the toe link has to get longer to keep the toe unchanged. Now I'm not sure what the relative motion ratio of the two is, but I do know from experience that a tiny change in toe link length translates to a fairly big change in toe. To change camber 0.1 degree takes 0.5 mm on the link, and it looks to me like 0.1 degree in toe is 0.25 mm on the toe link.

So from an adjustment point of view, first get the camber where you want it, then move both toe and camber to get the toe fixed without changing the camber. If you can't get toe exactly where you want it because 0.5 mm changes are too much, you can "fake" a 0.25 mm toe movement by taking advantage of the 2:1 motion ratio and changing camber by 0.1 degree (0.5 mm) instead.
 

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Also on the catch can hose! Make sure you get Pcv hose that is reinforced and can handle 25 inhg or so, That hose is expensive but it will keep the hose from collapsing on itself under engine braking!
So, back when I had a 2014 GT500, I installed a catch can on it, and the rubber hoses promptly went flat at idle. So I bought a couple of long, soft springs like this one:

https://www.thespringstore.com/pc062-500-83500-hd-12000-c-n-in.html

I slide the two 1/2" OD springs inside the 1/2" ID hoses and, voila, no more going flat under vacuum.
 

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Hey @WItoTX - Very cool to see the build progression here! Keep up the great work and keep us updated! I've been running my 2018 GT350 in CAM-C here in the southeast and loving every minute of it. Most recently the ProSolo1 last month at Florida International Rally & Motorsport Park.

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Would anyone happen to know the brand/manufacturer of the door speaker surrounds or are these one-offs?
 
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Would anyone happen to know the brand/manufacturer of the door speaker surrounds or are these one-offs?
The previous owner made them himself, and wrapped them in carbon fiber.
 

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Are you interested in keeping them?
 
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Are you interested in keeping them?
Yes, I plan to keep them. The speakers may go, but the rest will stay because the previous owner cut the door panels to make the speakers fit, so I would need a completely new door panel to fit factory speakers.
 

 
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