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GM Engineer about the 350 fpc.

Inthehighdesert

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Can someone post up the letter the GM engineer posted about the 350 and the fpc.
Thanks
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Ole Texan

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Get out the popcorn, GT350 in the shade. Someone got but 😢
 

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Inthehighdesert

Inthehighdesert

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A while back someone posted an open letter from one of the engineers developing the fpc for,the corvette. He basically stated they kind of made a little fun of the ford engineers and the issue’s they had had, basically vibration related. He then went on to say on the first engine session the motor lost all oil pressure because the oil filter flew off due to vibration. Then stated they were all like this was going to be a long process.
This wasn't about starting a popcorn thread.:ontheloo: Was looking for it to send to a buddy.
 

Rev Happy

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It was this article below and they were just talking about the oil filter backing off on the earlier models. I don't really see it as throwing shade.

It sounds like GM had the time and money to build this new motor without any compromises. I would love for Ford to respond to this and build an even better motor. I think they have the engineers to do it, but they'll probably never get a blank check to do it from scratch like GM apparently did.


"Unfortunately, the downside to the flat-plane crank is that “it shakes like a paint shaker. Horizontal shaking forces are horrendous and so difficult to deal with. As an example, Ford did a flat-plane 5.2-Liter V8 for a number of years, and they had a story on the web where the oil filter was actually spun off the engine from the shaking forces. And we thought, wow, that’s pretty hilarious, we would never make that mistake…until we made that mistake.”

Jordan tells the crowd that at this early point in the program, they were working with their first development engines that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars each. He recalls the number 2 engine was on the dyno when all of a sudden the engine lost oil pressure and failed. Looking into the test cell, they see the engine’s oil filter was on the ground. Thinking that someone forgot to tighten it, they added some safety wire and set up a camera to watch the filter on another engine. Sure enough, as the engine got up to speed, the filter started to spin off the motor.

“It was then we realized it wasn’t going to be easy. And so for five years of working on all the vibrations and all the different issues,” Jordan says before talking about even the smallest things like threaded fuel injector connectors that were being shaken apart and causing engine codes and other coil issues as a result. “It was a bear dealing with vibrations.”
 
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Inthehighdesert

Inthehighdesert

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Thanks! I didn’t really take it as throwing shade much, little more tongue and cheek

It was this article below and they were just talking about the oil filter backing off on the earlier models. I don't really see it as throwing shade.

It sounds like GM had the time and money to build this new motor without any compromises. I would love for Ford to respond to this and build an even better motor. I think they have the engineers to do it, but they'll probably never get a blank check to do it from scratch like GM apparently did.


"Unfortunately, the downside to the flat-plane crank is that “it shakes like a paint shaker. Horizontal shaking forces are horrendous and so difficult to deal with. As an example, Ford did a flat-plane 5.2-Liter V8 for a number of years, and they had a story on the web where the oil filter was actually spun off the engine from the shaking forces. And we thought, wow, that’s pretty hilarious, we would never make that mistake…until we made that mistake.”

Jordan tells the crowd that at this early point in the program, they were working with their first development engines that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars each. He recalls the number 2 engine was on the dyno when all of a sudden the engine lost oil pressure and failed. Looking into the test cell, they see the engine’s oil filter was on the ground. Thinking that someone forgot to tighten it, they added some safety wire and set up a camera to watch the filter on another engine. Sure enough, as the engine got up to speed, the filter started to spin off the motor.

“It was then we realized it wasn’t going to be easy. And so for five years of working on all the vibrations and all the different issues,” Jordan says before talking about even the smallest things like threaded fuel injector connectors that were being shaken apart and causing engine codes and other coil issues as a result. “It was a bear dealing with vibrations.”
 

AvalancheSVT

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A while back someone posted an open letter from one of the engineers developing the fpc for,the corvette. He basically stated they kind of made a little fun of the ford engineers and the issue’s they had had, basically vibration related. He then went on to say on the first engine session the motor lost all oil pressure because the oil filter flew off due to vibration. Then stated they were all like this was going to be a long process.
This wasn't about starting a popcorn thread.:ontheloo: Was looking for it to send to a buddy.
i do remember someone saying ferrari was on record with reason they limited displacement on V8 FPC cars having something to do with this. makes sense, the more you punch it out the bigger those slugs have to be.
 

Angrey

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First, the voodoo isn't a true FPC, it's a basterdized version with none of the advantages and all the detriment, but it sounds cool.

Secondly, it doesn't shake like a paint shaker. It shakes like a dog trying to shit a peach seed.
 

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i do remember someone saying ferrari was on record with reason they limited displacement on V8 FPC cars having something to do with this. makes sense, the more you punch it out the bigger those slugs have to be.
The different firing order doesn't help at all too considering literally every other V8 FPC car manufacturer engine in existence has the same firing order
 

ice445

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First, the voodoo isn't a true FPC, it's a basterdized version with none of the advantages and all the detriment, but it sounds cool.

Secondly, it doesn't shake like a paint shaker. It shakes like a dog trying to shit a peach seed.
I wouldn't say its basterdized, moreso it was made with substantial constraints. There was no blank check, they had to make it work with the existing modular motor tooling.

It's still pretty sweet though, I like that it sounds like nothing else out there.
 

Hack

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First, the voodoo isn't a true FPC, it's a basterdized version with none of the advantages and all the detriment, but it sounds cool.

Secondly, it doesn't shake like a paint shaker. It shakes like a dog trying to shit a peach seed.
Them's fighting words! I would say the Voodoo is by far the best engine Ford has made since the 70s.
 

Angrey

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I wouldn't say its basterdized, moreso it was made with substantial constraints. There was no blank check, they had to make it work with the existing modular motor tooling.

It's still pretty sweet though, I like that it sounds like nothing else out there.
it's basterdized. Ford marketing pukes ought to be hung for what they did.

They took what should have been a great platform and hobbled it.

It should be primary balanced. But instead, Ford decided to use a dumbass firing order which means you now have to add the heavy counterweights (thus negating one of if not THE biggest reason/advantage of the FPC).

So what you end up with is a motor that has the worst of both worlds, it has the counterweights of a cross plane crank, but the secondary imbalances of a flat plane crank (and all the NVH issues that go along with it).

The ONLY advantage (and it's marginal) is you get the even tuning of one bank per side firing so you end up with less "lazy" cylinders, but Ford even screwed that up a bit by the unique y arrangements of the stock headers. They're purposefully creating an exhaust traffic jam to improve the sound.

Now, admittedly, I LOVE the sound of the voodoo, the combination of muscle growl with the refinement of exotic wail,

But beyond the sound, the motor is almost as if they said "let's take the biggest drawback of each motor and combine them into one!"
 

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No I believe he’s referring to a quote from one of the GM engineers talking about how they figured the heavy vibration of the Voodoo was either a design issue or because of the UDUD crank order, and that they wouldn’t have to contend with the same issue. Then on the engine dyno they kept having a loose oil filter and couldn’t figure out why until they did a slow motion video and saw the engine shaking the filter loose even with the UDDU firing order.

Think this is it, from Jordan Led
https://www.corvetteblogger.com/202...using-havoc-on-early-lt6-development-engines/
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