Gapless rings

[horsepower addiction]

If a gapless ring expands due to heat what is going to happen to the top of the piston where it has a weak point?

gapless rings don’t mean gapless. it’s two rings in one grove locked together with the gaps on opposite sides

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[horsepower addiction]

In a boosted application with lots of time at WOT they might be a benefit as opposed to a very wide gap normal ring.

There is a reason they are not heavily advertised anymore.

This in my opinion is the reason that makes the most sense. unless someone knows of another reason, this one Seems like it would be easy for anyone to agree on. There would definitely be an improvement maybe not a noticeable amount of power but maybe in blow by or vacuum on a N/A car? something.

 

[horsepower addiction]

There is a reason they are not heavily advertised anymore.

yeah, They are three times the price

 

[sk47]

I don’t really understand how this applies

Hello; In terms of the initial question traditional rings with an end gap likely does not apply. Some would depend on the design of the gapless ring. The illustration still shows squared ends of the rings that might butt together if the heat from hard running caused a lot of expansion. It would seem that a wider end gap will still be needed.

Traditional rings have a wider end gap in boosted engines because more heat is expected. That wider gap is a safety measure to hopefully keep the ring ends from touching when hot and being distorted. If they touch and continue to expand the top of the piston can break off as shown in the earlier pictures.

gapless rings don’t mean gapless. it’s two rings in one grove locked together with the gaps on opposite sides

Been a long time since I first knew of gapless rings. Never tried them in an application so have no practical advice.

 

[HKusp]

With a .026 gap you are losing 1-2% more than stock .009. If you add 48% more power as opposed to 50% more power by opening the gap to allow for expansion, you lose less than 10 hp. When we are talking 700-1000whp. It is a situation where the juice, isn't worth the squeeze. Just my $.02. Take it for what it's worth.

 

[horsepower addiction]

Hello; In terms of the initial question traditional rings with an end gap likely does not apply. Some would depend on the design of the gapless ring. The illustration still shows squared ends of the rings that might butt together if the heat from hard running caused a lot of expansion. It would seem that a wider end gap will still be needed.

Traditional rings have a wider end gap in boosted engines because more heat is expected. That wider gap is a safety measure to hopefully keep the ring ends from touching when hot and being distorted. If they touch and continue to expand the top of the piston can break off as shown in the earlier pictures.





Been a long time since I first knew of gapless rings. Never tried them in an application so have no practical advice.

If anyone is installing rings on a boosted engine they open the gap. so i don’t see how a ringland is going to get damaged. with a gapless ring you have even less chance because you can open the gap even more without the gap allowing extra cylinder pressure by

 

[horsepower addiction]

With a .026 gap you are losing 1-2% more than stock .009. If you add 48% more power as opposed to 50% more power by opening the gap to allow for expansion, you lose less than 10 hp. When we are talking 700-1000whp. It is a situation where the juice, isn't worth the squeeze. Just my $.02. Take it for what it's worth.

I agree it’s not a matter of power gain. I think it can be a way to open the gap up to a more than safe gap without the consequences.
like someone building an engine and they plan to go forced induction later, but are N/A right now? they can put enough gap in for the boosted application now without any worries

 

[horsepower addiction]

How much do you think gas porting will help? Are we looking at 10%, 5%? any way to know?

 

[horsepower addiction]

Everyone is gas porting horizontal. with cleaner burning fuels and the ability to keep the combustion chambers clean. Do you think vertical gas points would benefit more.

 

[sk47]

If anyone is installing rings on a boosted engine they open the gap. so i don’t see how a ringland is going to get damaged. with a gapless ring you have even less chance because you can open the gap even more without the gap allowing extra cylinder pressure by

Hello; The intent is clear and understood. Prevent blowby and so keep compression. I imagine, as with most everything, there are tradeoffs. Sometimes it is only money. You are correct in that with a big enough end gap the rings will not expand enough to touch. I do not know if there are constraints with end gaps using gapless rings.

Our engine builder tried them in top only, top and second and both. Everything lost high RPM power except top ring only.

This is information from someone who has tried the rings.

I decided to follow the thread as you pose an interesting question.

 

[GregO]

How much do you think gas porting will help? Are we looking at 10%, 5%? any way to know?

Everyone is gas porting horizontal. with cleaner burning fuels and the ability to keep the combustion chambers clean. Do you think vertical gas points would benefit more.

Some good Gas Porting forum discussions on Speed Talk and Yellow Bullet. The late Big Joe Sherman and a few others are the guys to pay attention to.
Then there’s Gas Ported piston Rings…..

Two Stroke racing engines, triple cylinder 1000cc single ring piston with .040 dia. vertical gas porting can achieve up to 6 HP (2%) gain.

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