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https://techcrunch.com/2023/02/02/ford-earnings-left-2b-of-profits-on-the-table-in-2022/


I wish Ford would focus on building better quality cars and trucks over F1. It would be different if there was tech in F1 that could be useful to improve their vehicles, but to me it just seems like an ad campaign.
Agreed but people don’t want to pay for these types of cars coming from Ford or GM even. Remember that a better built car means a more expensive car. The average car purchase price now is 47K. That’s the highest in the history of car sales and it was in 2022. Before that the average car purchase price in America was 37K.

I think that it’s a great deal that Ford is jumping in the top tier of racing. But we can always look at the negative I mean why not.
 

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wasn't ford saying a short time ago that their future was in electric vehicles?
this f1 move seems a curious contradiction to that but if you want to spend the shareholders $$$ on some ego trip then this is how to do it!
 

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It’s called marketing. It also elevates the brand. This is a very good thing for Ford. Porsche really screwed the pooch with there thinking they were going to take over Redbull.

wasn't ford saying a short time ago that their future was in electric vehicles?
this f1 move seems a curious contradiction to that but if you want to spend the shareholders $$$ on some ego trip then this is how to do it!
 


Inthehighdesert

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I have five newer Ford products in my house. 2020 and up. 350R, Gt500, Explorer St, F550, and F450. They’ve all been great vehicles. Couple minor warranty recalls. All have been handled without issue. Dealer had great service as well. I’d love perfection, but don’t expect that on mass produced vehicles. So I’ll settle for the warranty coverage that’s provided if needed.

https://techcrunch.com/2023/02/02/ford-earnings-left-2b-of-profits-on-the-table-in-2022/


I wish Ford would focus on building better quality cars and trucks over F1. It would be different if there was tech in F1 that could be useful to improve their vehicles, but to me it just seems like an ad campaign.
 

Hack

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I have five newer Ford products in my house. 2020 and up. 350R, Gt500, Explorer St, F550, and F450. They’ve all been great vehicles. Couple minor warranty recalls. All have been handled without issue. Dealer had great service as well. I’d love perfection, but don’t expect that on mass produced vehicles. So I’ll settle for the warranty coverage that’s provided if needed.
I agree that vehicles don't need to be perfect. The reason I was calling out quality is because people in Ford were quoted in the article as saying that lack of quality had cost Ford a lot of money. Recalls are expensive.

Things like the bad crimps on the GT350 cooling lines. A little more work up front to improve their processes and maybe Ford could avoid some expensive recalls. When I got the recall done on my GT350, there was a leak after the fact and the dealer had to try a second time. I don't know if Ford paid for both trips, but it's an example of Ford spending a lot of money on something that shouldn't have been necessary.

I would assume that Voodoo engine issues cost Ford even more than the cooling lines did. Ford may have not been able to catch the valve issue on the later cars, but the early piston/ring issues I think they had an honest shot at preventing.

My dealer experience has been ok, not great. Two different dealer with one try each on attaching the GT350 front splitter failed, so I did it myself. I'm not a mechanic, but it was a relatively easy job for me. Incompetent and lazy dealer mechanics are a big reason why I try to avoid trips to the dealership as much as possible.
 

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Agreed but people don’t want to pay for these types of cars coming from Ford or GM even. Remember that a better built car means a more expensive car. The average car purchase price now is 47K. That’s the highest in the history of car sales and it was in 2022. Before that the average car purchase price in America was 37K.

I think that it’s a great deal that Ford is jumping in the top tier of racing. But we can always look at the negative I mean why not.
Well yeah. Ford stopped making inexpensive vehicles like the Focus and Fiesta. Fiesta was an actual well-built car from my experience. I owned a regular Fiesta and an ST. They were both extremely affordable. Nicer fit and finish than Mustang, for sure. I never had a single warranty claim on either of the Fiestas. Ford not making cars is a big part of why I own a Toybaru now. I realize Ford wasn't ever going to make an awesome, lightweight sporty RWD car like the 86, but completely stopping making ANY cars other than Mustang?

I feel like Ford abandoned people who want affordable vehicles.
 

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Well yeah. Ford stopped making inexpensive vehicles like the Focus and Fiesta. Fiesta was an actual well-built car from my experience. I owned a regular Fiesta and an ST. They were both extremely affordable. Nicer fit and finish than Mustang, for sure. I never had a single warranty claim on either of the Fiestas. Ford not making cars is a big part of why I own a Toybaru now. I realize Ford wasn't ever going to make an awesome, lightweight sporty RWD car like the 86, but completely stopping making ANY cars other than Mustang?

I feel like Ford abandoned people who want affordable vehicles.
Poor people are bad customers, that's why. Ford made like $1 on each of those models and faced stiff competition from Japanese brands. I'm not saying I necessarily agree with it, but I do understand. Freeing that ball and chain to repurpose your talent on your actual money makers was a smart move. Ford went from having inventory wasting space on lots, to having some of the most popular vehicles on the market right now with wait lists stretching to the moon and back.

The old model of having cars for every tier to build lifelong customers has long since been killed by the Japanese competition. Now Ford just focuses (ha) on what they're good at. Also, as much as I loved when they brought cool Euro models to the states, it pretty much never worked out. Americans have always hated small cars and hatchbacks by and large, and usually only buy them if that's all they can afford.

Final note, I wouldn't call the Toybaru affordable. If you can even get a new one, they're 30K on up. They also have one of the highest insurance premiums due to the average driver not knowing how RWD works. This especially applies to the older, depreciated models. The Mustang isn't really immune to this phenomenon either, but just in my mind, the truly affordable price tier was right around 20K, and that's all but gone now.
 

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I can’t argue or disagree with any of what you posted. Ford and Dealers aren’t exempt from what most of us that are trades related deal with seemingly in an endless cycle. I’ve stopped trying to hire, it’s been an exercise in futility. Covid made that even worse. Your splitter is a great example of just lazy and not giving a …. . At the last Track Attack I was at the head of Ford Performance was
doing the school to. I got to talk to him quite a bit. He said there main issue’s with the voodoo was a hand built Porsche quality engine with a Ford supply chain. But at the same time Ford could do these cars because of the economies of scale and the popularity of the mustang. I’m fortunate I have a good relationship with the dealer I use if need be. The same tech works on my stuff and knows me. I have direct access to him which is really cool. I do feel for the dealers with the folume of work they have to deal with. I try to cut them a little slack because I know how difficult that is.
Back on topic, even with the issue’s I think Ford did an outstanding job on the 350 and 500. We can’t question the commitment they put there in my opinion. I don’t expect anything less with them in F1. The coolest thing talking to the gentlemen from Ford was it was obvious he and those around him were car guys through and through. He was trying to fix a software issue with a nanny that the school had been dealing with on the gt’s coming on at the wrong time(100 percent track related) in between the sessions we were doing. I was really impressed.

I agree that vehicles don't need to be perfect. The reason I was calling out quality is because people in Ford were quoted in the article as saying that lack of quality had cost Ford a lot of money. Recalls are expensive.

Things like the bad crimps on the GT350 cooling lines. A little more work up front to improve their processes and maybe Ford could avoid some expensive recalls. When I got the recall done on my GT350, there was a leak after the fact and the dealer had to try a second time. I don't know if Ford paid for both trips, but it's an example of Ford spending a lot of money on something that shouldn't have been necessary.

I would assume that Voodoo engine issues cost Ford even more than the cooling lines did. Ford may have not been able to catch the valve issue on the later cars, but the early piston/ring issues I think they had an honest shot at preventing.

My dealer experience has been ok, not great. Two different dealer with one try each on attaching the GT350 front splitter failed, so I did it myself. I'm not a mechanic, but it was a relatively easy job for me. Incompetent and lazy dealer mechanics are a big reason why I try to avoid trips to the dealership as much as possible.
 
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Hack

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Poor people are bad customers, that's why. Ford made like $1 on each of those models and faced stiff competition from Japanese brands. I'm not saying I necessarily agree with it, but I do understand. Freeing that ball and chain to repurpose your talent on your actual money makers was a smart move. Ford went from having inventory wasting space on lots, to having some of the most popular vehicles on the market right now with wait lists stretching to the moon and back.

The old model of having cars for every tier to build lifelong customers has long since been killed by the Japanese competition. Now Ford just focuses (ha) on what they're good at. Also, as much as I loved when they brought cool Euro models to the states, it pretty much never worked out. Americans have always hated small cars and hatchbacks by and large, and usually only buy them if that's all they can afford.

Final note, I wouldn't call the Toybaru affordable. If you can even get a new one, they're 30K on up. They also have one of the highest insurance premiums due to the average driver not knowing how RWD works. This especially applies to the older, depreciated models. The Mustang isn't really immune to this phenomenon either, but just in my mind, the truly affordable price tier was right around 20K, and that's all but gone now.
I agree as well that building the most profitable vehicles might make sense. In the old days I think Ford built different cars with the assumption that people would buy the cheap models when they were young and then move up to more expensive models over time. Maybe brand loyalty is rare/dead now and Ford's current strategy is correct. I do admit that I'm odd - most people want pickups and SUVs and I don't like either of those types of vehicles. So in the end it's not completely surprising that Ford doesn't build what I would prefer them to.

I'm older and I've bought other brands, but I've been a Ford guy. Until last year I hadn't ever bought any new car except for Fords. They don't have to make something better than the competition necessarily. Just good enough that I want to buy. But they still need to build something with the right value for a even brand loyal person to choose to buy it.

The premium GR86 is right around $30,000. I own the base model. From when I decided to buy one, it did take a couple months to complete my MSRP purchase. I got a great trade on the FiST in that deal as well. I agree it would be great if GR86s were less expensive. However, there's no other car available in the market that is similar and costs less. If Ford built something that weighed 2,800 lbs and was front engine RWD with a manual transmission for $30K or less I would be interested. If I fit into a Miata that would have been on my short list as well.
 
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I agree as well that building the most profitable vehicles might make sense. In the old days I think Ford built different cars with the assumption that people would buy the cheap models when they were young and then move up to more expensive models over time. Maybe brand loyalty is rare/dead now and Ford's current strategy is correct. I do admit that I'm odd - most people want pickups and SUVs and I don't like either of those types of vehicles. So in the end it's not completely surprising that Ford doesn't build what I would prefer them to.

I'm older and I've bought other brands, but I've been a Ford guy. Until last year I hadn't ever bought any new car except for Fords. They don't have to make something better than the competition necessarily. Just good enough that I want to buy. But they still need to build something with the right value for a even brand loyal person to choose to buy it.

The premium GR86 is right around $30,000. I own the base model. From when I decided to buy one, it did take a couple months to complete my MSRP purchase. I got a great trade on the FiST in that deal as well. I agree it would be great if GR86s were less expensive. However, there's no other car available in the market that is similar and costs less. If Ford built something that weighed 2,800 lbs and was front engine RWD with a manual transmission for $30K or less I would be interested. If I fit into a Miata that would have been on my short list as well.
I think as a whole American car buyers have accepted the fact that lower quality is ok and have done this for decades. It really started in the mid 70s. Before that cars where built and lasted. But that was also a bad thing because dealerships and car makers where not making money. Why the advent of crappy cars. If you’re car starts breaking down after a few years it prompts you to buy another car instead of heaping money into an old out dated car.
We have an 03 Yukon with 364K miles. That car requires the least maintenance out of all the car we have and my wives favorite. The 03 and 04 model years where the most robust built SUVs as of late for GM. In contrast my buddy Glenn. He has a 2019 Infinity Q80 with 12K miles and the trans just took a crap and left him stranded 1900 miles from home.
 

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wasn't ford saying a short time ago that their future was in electric vehicles?
this f1 move seems a curious contradiction to that but if you want to spend the shareholders $$$ on some ego trip then this is how to do it!
The current and future F1 tech specs require a hybrid powertrain that is highly dependent on the electrical components (battery, electric motor/generator, and power management system). Development of the F1 powertrain should yield innovations that apply to road cars.
 
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The current and future F1 tech specs require a hybrid powertrain that is highly dependent on the electrical components (battery, electric motor/generator, and power management system). Development of the F1 powertrain should yield innovations that apply to road cars.
Im 2026 the cars electrical hybrid motor will yield over 300bhp where right now is just over 100. They are getting rid of the GMU which has yielded nothing for road going cars and they will be using fuel with a higher etanol content. All in all it’s right in line with what Ford is developing for their road going cars.
 

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Im 2026 the cars electrical hybrid motor will yield over 300bhp where right now is just over 100. They are getting rid of the GMU which has yielded nothing for road going cars and they will be using fuel with a higher etanol content. All in all it’s right in line with what Ford is developing for their road going cars.
Agree, F1 hybrid technology appears to be the future. Ford's move into all motorsports is awesome.

FYI, 10 days ago Lucid unveiled its motorsports motor:
  • Motor, inverter, differential and transmission all combined, the new motorsports drive unit produces 469 horsepower.
  • It weighs only 70.5 pounds (32 kilos) and is capable of a max rotor speed of 19,500 rpm
The future is now!
 

 
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