Ford CEO Farley says these customers aren't ready for electric cars

[K4fxd]

The motor I linked to is 210 HP with a 150 KW controller.

How much HP is Ford or Tesla claiming?

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[shogun32]

How much you want to bet the FBI and the police department would not get electric vehicles. They would get the gas powered vehicles. They don't want to run out during a police chase of battery juice

for city patrol duty and for in-city delivery (Amazon vans etc) EV can work. Whether the cost to acquire and the install of charging infra is defensible vis-a-vis the ubiquitous bread-van diesel upkeep I don't know but I'm guessing it tilts toward yes.

If you have to steal from the poor for the benefit of the rich (the very definition of subsidy) it's never defensible.

 

[K4fxd]

Lets assume 100% mark up on the motors, controllers and batteries.

You still are over the retail cost of a GT500 drive train.

What is MSRP on a GT500?

 

[shogun32]

When EV's are everywhere and electric rates go up I will have to choose between heat and lights in my house along with not driving as much.

even better your EV use is STEALING from every other person in the electric utility billing region because even when they don't own/operate an EV they are still getting whacked with the higher meter rates. If every new owner of an EV got wacked with a $5000 EV provision fee and EV surcharge on their charging meter to defray additional grid expenses that would be just fine.

Cost-shifting is THEFT. And it's rampant in our modern society.

Some of us are on fixed incomes as most will be at some point in their lives. So can't just go make more money.

sure you can. Walmart can't find people with a work-ethic so old folks are welcomed with open arms.

 

[Schwerin]

No, I know how averages work, I also know how polls and studies work, you only can use data you are given, and I highly doubt the data pool is complete. I.E. many never being asked how long the drive takes daily.
At best they can guess from public data that joe blow lives here and works there and the google maps stats it take 25 minutes.
Cuz, lets face it, for any of this type data averages, to be true, they have to admit that they are tracking everyone daily 24/7/365.
My guess, is they poll a sample size of people and call it good and post an "average" and call it good.

It was a 5 year study. Average One-Way Commuting Time by Metropolitan Areas (census.gov)

 

[shogun32]

It was a 5 year study. Average One-Way Commuting Time by Metropolitan Areas (census.gov)

TIME is not useful in the least without DISTANCE to go with.

 

[danpass]

EV is for defined routes; city buses, UPS/FedEx, USPS, waste management ...

 

[Schwerin]

TIME is not useful in the least without DISTANCE to go with.

It doesn't really matter as unless you are doing full max Highway speed (85 in many states) for the stated time you're still well under the range of an EV. Which even the worse tested still have a 200+ miles range even in winter. The longest commute listed of 40min, would be under 160 miles round trip. The average EV is creeping up on 300 which is actually better range than my Mustang gets to the tank unless I'm TRYING to get good MPG, and lasts me a full week+ of trips to work and back.

 

[ICU812]

It was a 5 year study. Average One-Way Commuting Time by Metropolitan Areas (census.gov)

Till they tack everyone it is ,well. you know.

 

[07S281E]

The point is the public doesn't want them. These EV's are being shoved down our throats. The government should get out of the auto business and let the market dictate what is sold. Demand will drive what is built. If people want EV;s or hybrids, the manufactures will follow the money.

 

[Schwerin]

Till they tack everyone it is ,well. you know.

You can literally make that argument about every datapoint ever. You don't need to know EVERYONE to get an accurate average or estimate. Also, Google/Apple could VERY easily do that research right now just by tracking how often phones hop cell towers and how fast. How many commuters you know don't have any kid of phone on them?

 

[ICU812]

It doesn't really matter as unless you are doing full max Highway speed (85 in many states) for the stated time you're still well under the range of an EV. Which even the worse tested still have a 200+ miles range even in winter. The longest commute listed of 40min, would be under 160 miles round trip. The average EV is creeping up on 300 which is actually better range than my Mustang gets to the tank unless I'm TRYING to get good MPG, and lasts me a full week+ of trips to work and back.

Now, drive that ev in winter when the range is much lower than what is claimed because of the cold, then add in the human wanting heat. I don't care if your commute is 15 miles, but if it is bumper to bumper 0-5 mph crawl that now took you 90 minutes and you have the heater, lights,radio, etc going. You might JUST make it home before the battery is dead.

 

[shogun32]

It doesn't really matter as unless you are doing full max Highway speed (85 in many states) for the stated time you're still well under the range of an EV. Which even the worse tested still have a 200+ miles range even in winter. The longest commute listed of 40min, would be under 160 miles round trip. The average EV is creeping up on 300 which is actually better range than my Mustang gets to the tank unless I'm TRYING to get good MPG, and lasts me a full week+ of trips to work and back.

I meant from a survey standpoint. From Stafford to Pentagon is 40 miles and 35-40 minutes if you leave by 0530 and use HOV ride-sharing lanes. If you don't leave by 3pm at the dot the return trip can easily exceed an hour and kiss 90 minutes. Those same 40 minutes gets me from Edsal to Crystal City a distance of 7.7 miles Fairfax bus and then Metro rail. It's about 25min if you catch the once-an-hour Metro Express bus that also happens to go past my house.

200-300mi range in an EV is just stupid. Massive weight to carry around for a <50mi/day workload.

 

[Strokerswild]

Now, drive that ev in winter when the range is much lower than what is claimed because of the cold, then add in the human wanting heat. I don't care if your commute is 15 miles, but if it is bumper to bumper 0-5 mph crawl that now took you 90 minutes and you have the heater, lights,radio, etc going. You might JUST make it home before the battery is dead.

I would love to test a BEV for a full winter just for my typical day to day driving to see the reality. Park it outside, etc. I'd be interested to see how things really work when it's -20* (or worse).

Open offer to any interested manufacturer.

 

[ICU812]

You can literally make that argument about every datapoint ever. You don't need to know EVERYONE to get an accurate average or estimate. Also, Google/Apple could VERY easily do that research right now just by tracking how often phones hop cell towers and how fast. How many commuters you know don't have any kid of phone on them?

If I pool data from folks that all work in the town they call home, that skew the average. Like say, I polled city folk that tend to work local to where they call home.
So, yes yes you DO need Everyone to have a true data point,
And like I stated above, they have to admit they are tracking you 24/7/365 to get a REAL average. So even if google had 100% of the market share to pull data from, they never do it, as that be showing their cards.

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