Extended Warranty and Track Days

Shadow277

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I'm an idiot and bought an extended warranty. I caved to my Dad's and older brother's advice that American cars are unreliable pieces of trash.

Anyways, I don't have a copy of it. Just wondering if someone has tracked their car and then tried claiming a failing part. As in, how did that all go down? Is it a bad to track while under warranty?

Mine is a 2016 with 53,500 miles.

 

BetOnBlack

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Tow it away from the track and say it was a hit and run.
 

Cobra Jet

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First, depending on who the Extended Warranty is written by (Ford ESP or XYZ aftermarket), you would need to read all of the fine print as to what is NOT covered.

Everyone who buys an Extended Warranty always just gets one after the Salesperson rattles off what it covers. The thing is, not all ESP’s are equal and not all cover ‘everything’ - and the pieces or parts not covered is usually what is in the fine print that everyone overlooks (and sometimes costs the most when it comes time to repair).

The Ford ESP runs concurrently with the Factory new car 3/36 Bumper to Bumper, as well as the 5/60 Powertrain.

So it looks and works like this:
3/36 used for nearly all warranty claims during first 3 years/36k miles, whichever comes first.

5/60 runs concurrently with the 3/36, so after 3/36 is depleted by miles or years first, the remainder of the 5/60 is left which is 2/24 (again whichever comes first).

Ford ESP - runs concurrently with the 3/36 and 5/60. So only AFTER the 3/36 and/or 5/60 is depleted, will the ESP be used. FACT (and it’s in the ESP fine print). So take for instance a new car owner bought a 7/75k ESP - what they really bought was a 2/15k.

The above is why if buying any ESP and planning on keeping a car for at least 5 years, always go with the ESP that has the longest term available. I think Ford has a 8/120 as the most current.

Always read the fine print. :)

——

As for tracking the car and something happens - in the S550 Owners Manual for every year since inception, it breaks out what is and is not covered by Warranty. If it’s found that the car was tuned (yes they can find that out even if a Tune was removed), OR that the car was abused and something failed during “racing” or timed events, the Ford Service Center can deny a warranty claim - regardless if the vehicle is covered by the 3/36, 5/60 or any Ford ESP.

To be as crystal clear as possible - the attached is directly from Ford - interpret it as you wish, but pay very close attention to not only how the main body is worded, but also the 2nd bullet in the 1st section for “Racing” and 3rd bullet in the 1st section, which equates to “tuning”.

Everyone can reference back to the M&M Act, but when reading the attached, Ford’s Legal Team has worded their position in such a way that they have the right to deny warranty claims if the failure was directly related to a tune that falls under systems tampering OR if it was found the failure was the result of “racing”.

Modifying comes with risks - if you have the pockets to play, you have the pockets to pay IF the mod has crossed the fine lines noted in their warranty provisions.
ced8837a-7ee4-4148-8795-bb3609d524d3-jpeg.jpg


5d4eead5-a515-4421-884e-b7b50e59b083-jpeg.jpg


Have tuned or modified Mustangs used in timed events been repaired under Warranty, despite what you see above and what’s in the Owner’s Manuals - yes. It’s hit or miss and depends on your Service Center.
 

luc

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Tow it away from the track and say it was a hit and run.
Insurance fraud. And a felony
It’s because of scammers like you that insurance are so expensive
Be a man and assume your act and decisions
What a stupid and unethical thing to say
 

BetOnBlack

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You really can't take a joke can you? Insurance is high because of uninsured drivers and all the idiot drivers on the road. I'm constantly trying to avoid getting hit by people swerving into my late etc.

Trust me the amount of people "scamming insurance" with track damage is a penny in the bucket to these companies anyways and has little effect on insurance premiums..
 


ice445

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First, depending on who the Extended Warranty is written by (Ford ESP or XYZ aftermarket), you would need to read all of the fine print as to what is NOT covered.

Everyone who buys an Extended Warranty always just gets one after the Salesperson rattles off what it covers. The thing is, not all ESP’s are equal and not all cover ‘everything’ - and the pieces or parts not covered is usually what is in the fine print that everyone overlooks (and sometimes costs the most when it comes time to repair).

The Ford ESP runs concurrently with the Factory new car 3/36 Bumper to Bumper, as well as the 5/60 Powertrain.

So it looks and works like this:
3/36 used for nearly all warranty claims during first 3 years/36k miles, whichever comes first.

5/60 runs concurrently with the 3/36, so after 3/36 is depleted by miles or years first, the remainder of the 5/60 is left which is 2/24 (again whichever comes first).

Ford ESP - runs concurrently with the 3/36 and 5/60. So only AFTER the 3/36 and/or 5/60 is depleted, will the ESP be used. FACT (and it’s in the ESP fine print). So take for instance a new car owner bought a 7/75k ESP - what they really bought was a 2/15k.

The above is why if buying any ESP and planning on keeping a car for at least 5 years, always go with the ESP that has the longest term available. I think Ford has a 8/120 as the most current.

Always read the fine print. :)

——

As for tracking the car and something happens - in the S550 Owners Manual for every year since inception, it breaks out what is and is not covered by Warranty. If it’s found that the car was tuned (yes they can find that out even if a Tune was removed), OR that the car was abused and something failed during “racing” or timed events, the Ford Service Center can deny a warranty claim - regardless if the vehicle is covered by the 3/36, 5/60 or any Ford ESP.

To be as crystal clear as possible - the attached is directly from Ford - interpret it as you wish, but pay very close attention to not only how the main body is worded, but also the 2nd bullet in the 1st section for “Racing” and 3rd bullet in the 1st section, which equates to “tuning”.

Everyone can reference back to the M&M Act, but when reading the attached, Ford’s Legal Team has worded their position in such a way that they have the right to deny warranty claims if the failure was directly related to a tune that falls under systems tampering OR if it was found the failure was the result of “racing”.

Modifying comes with risks - if you have the pockets to play, you have the pockets to pay IF the mod has crossed the fine lines noted in their warranty provisions.
ced8837a-7ee4-4148-8795-bb3609d524d3-jpeg.jpg


5d4eead5-a515-4421-884e-b7b50e59b083-jpeg.jpg


Have tuned or modified Mustangs used in timed events been repaired under Warranty, despite what you see above and what’s in the Owner’s Manuals - yes. It’s hit or miss and depends on your Service Center.
I get what you're saying but 5/60 is only for powertrain, so its silly to say a 7/75 ESP is actually 2/15. Like sure, for power train items only. But if your BCM fails at 4/40k, ESP still covers you.
 

luc

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You really can't take a joke can you? Insurance is high because of uninsured drivers and all the idiot drivers on the road. I'm constantly trying to avoid getting hit by people swerving into my late etc.

Trust me the amount of people "scamming insurance" with track damage is a penny in the bucket to these companies anyways and has little effect on insurance premiums..
So... is that making right and ethical?
Of course not
 

Cobra Jet

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I get what you're saying but 5/60 is only for powertrain, so its silly to say a 7/75 ESP is actually 2/15. Like sure, for power train items only. But if your BCM fails at 4/40k, ESP still covers you.
Good discussion, let’s look at it further.

Ok - your point taken - my above example was merely to show IF the 3/36 is gone AND the 5/60 is gone, all that is left is 2/15 of the ESP 7/75. ESP’s do not start after a 3/36 or 5/60 run out (many people do not realize that at all), the ESP always runs concurrently with the existing warranties AND start as of the purchase date of the car. The purchase date is usually the same Warranty start date as logged/defined in OASIS.


So let’s remove the powertrain as your example shows. A person buys a 7/75k ESP, the 3/36 is zapped. All they are left with is 4/39 if needing to fix anything other than a Powertrain related issue - years or miles whichever comes first. Most people drive these cars highway and annual accrued mileage could be 15k average - that’s already nearly eating that 39k left by half in only 1 year. The other problem is, did they get the right ESP that will cover the electronics modules or many other electronics tech equipment these cars are now loaded with? Did they read the fine print as to what is NOT being covered? Did they buy the ESP knowing how they use the car or know that it runs concurrently with the 3/36 and 5/60, or were they pushed into the “sale”?

IMO, a 7/75 ESP is a waste of money because it’s running concurrently with the 3/36 and the 5/60. No matter which way you slice it, there’s not much value in a 7/75 for someone who intends to keep the car longer than 5 years. It’s also a waste of money for someone who intends to get rid of the car in less than 5 years, because much of the systems and components were covered by the 3/36 and 5/60 anyway.

Many people don’t even realize how many components the 3/36 or 5/60 cover at all - because no one bothers to read the coverage, let alone even open the owners manual. They’re talked into ESP’s by many sales folks without even being explained the ESP’s coverage (or lack of it in certain areas).

I’m in no way saying an ESP (Ford or other) is worthless. What I am saying is make sure you know what is NOT covered because most of the time those items not covered are big ticket items in the end. Also research and determine if an ESP will even benefit one’s circumstances based on ownership period and use of that vehicle.

I myself bought an ESP through my Credit Union for my 2018 - a 7/120. It’s an approved plan and accepted at all Ford Service Centers just as a Ford ESP. I bought it because I knew what it would cover BUT also because my ownership will exceed 5 years and I need a buffer after my 3/36 and the 5/60 has been depleted - whether that buffer was to cover something that would have fallen within the 3/36 components OR the 5/60 components. Hell, I’ve already wracked up 40k on my 2018 as of mid 2020 - killed the 3/36 faster than most would.

Shop smart with ESP’s - don’t let Salespeople push it during point of sale and you’re being suckered into not fully knowing what you’re even buying or what it doesn’t even cover.
 

Elp_jc

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First of all, any event at a racetrack is absolutely excluded from any warranty and service contract (aka 'extended warranty'). Second of all, if your car has nav, and any airbag and/or seatbelt pretensioner fires up, the ECU stores all data, including location. Any suspicious claim will require your authorization for insurance to obtain data from the event data recorder (aka 'black box'); if you refuse, no coverage, so up to you. Ha ha. If you lie, and get caught, you could get charged even with attempted insurance fraud, and be in deep doo-doo. So even if somebody is not ethical, he'd also have to be stupid, to attempt a stunt like that. Remember there are always witnesses, cameras around, etc., so your off-road excursion could be trending on Youtube/Instagram/etc., without you having a clue. Ha ha.

If you want to be covered at a track, the smart thing to do would be to buy track insurance for the day.
 
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Shadow277

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First of all, any event at a racetrack is absolutely excluded from any warranty and service contract (aka 'extended warranty'). Second of all, if your car has nav, and any airbag and/or seatbelt pretensioner fires up, the ECU stores all data, including location. Any suspicious claim will require your authorization for insurance to obtain data from the event data recorder (aka 'black box'); if you refuse, no coverage, so up to you. Ha ha. If you lie, and get caught, you could get charged even with attempted insurance fraud, and be in deep doo-doo. So even if somebody is not ethical, he'd also have to be stupid, to attempt a stunt like that. Remember there are always witnesses, cameras around, etc., so your off-road excursion could be trending on Youtube/Instagram/etc., without you having a clue. Ha ha.

If you want to be covered at a track, the smart thing to do would be to buy track insurance for the day.
Track insurance doesn't cover parts failing. Just accidents. Also, my 2016 is a base model. No Nav.
 

Cobra Jet

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Track insurance doesn't cover parts failing. Just accidents. Also, my 2016 is a base model. No Nav.
Can you explain your concerns more?

You are placing emphasis on parts failing while an S550 (yours or otherwise) is participating in a track event (or an event that has already transpired) and if such a failure did occur, would the Ford ESP cover any such failure.

In my post #3 above, the attached images are from Ford. What is stated applies to to a Ford vehicle that has the new car 3/36, the Powertrain 5/60 and any other factory sponsored Warranties, including but not limited to a Ford ESP.

@Elp_jc also posted info that if an S550 failed during a timed track related event - what is considered by definition to be “racing”, the failure of said components would not be covered.

The only time a component *might* be covered is IF the failure was due to a proven manufacturing defect, which can be determined by Ford FSE’s and Engineering if called upon by the Ford Service Center due to a warranty authorization request.

These S550’s have lots of data gathering points, including key count cycles. Ford Service Centers are also provided with very clear and concise GSB docs from Ford that guide them in how to determine if a failure was from Owner abuse, neglect and/or modifications. Search “GSB” and “engine” on here and you’ll find those docs.

Usually a ‘normal’ failure while ‘normal’ driving is quite different from a failure caused by sustained high RPM’s, rapid oil loss or pressure, abrupt seizing of internal parts and data logging that points to sustained high speeds, sustained higher than ‘normal’ RPM’s, physical heat cycle damages seen on metal parts and/or manipulation of key count cycles.

I’m not sure if the above is offering you any more answers to what you may be seeking.
 
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Shadow277

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Can you explain your concerns more?

You are placing emphasis on parts failing while an S550 (yours or otherwise) is participating in a track event (or an event that has already transpired) and if such a failure did occur, would the Ford ESP cover any such failure.

In my post #3 above, the attached images are from Ford. What is stated applies to to a Ford vehicle that has the new car 3/36, the Powertrain 5/60 and any other factory sponsored Warranties, including but not limited to a Ford ESP.

@Elp_jc also posted info that if an S550 failed during a timed track related event - what is considered by definition to be “racing”, the failure of said components would not be covered.

The only time a component *might* be covered is IF the failure was due to a proven manufacturing defect, which can be determined by Ford FSE’s and Engineering if called upon by the Ford Service Center due to a warranty authorization request.

These S550’s have lots of data gathering points, including key count cycles. Ford Service Centers are also provided with very clear and concise GSB docs from Ford that guide them in how to determine if a failure was from Owner abuse, neglect and/or modifications. Search “GSB” and “engine” on here and you’ll find those docs.

Usually a ‘normal’ failure while ‘normal’ driving is quite different from a failure caused by sustained high RPM’s, rapid oil loss or pressure, abrupt seizing of internal parts and data logging that points to sustained high speeds, sustained higher than ‘normal’ RPM’s, physical heat cycle damages seen on metal parts and/or manipulation of key count cycles.

I’m not sure if the above is offering you any more answers to what you may be seeking.
If track time nullifies warranties of all sorts.

Regardless, I guess I better just accept stuff breaking and pony up. You gotta pay to play.
 

 
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