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Does the oil consumption issue apply only to the f150? Looking to buy my first 3rd gen coyote mustang but worried about all the issues.

Skye

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My comments are opinion and perception only. I have no statistical data to support my statements.

With respect to burning oil, I believe the primary driver is how the piston rings are meeting the cylinder walls. I do think it is in the best interest of the owner/operator to perform a moderate and progressive engine break-in quickly, within the first 100 mi / 160 km or so.

Very early on, stress the engine in a progressively harder fashion. Stress it a little, a little more, more still etc, on each drive, while not hitting the rev limiter or going WOT. Internal engine air and mechanical pressures need to press the rings against the walls soon, to seat the rings. Not doing so runs the risk of glazing the walls, setting the stage for oil burning.

Ford's break-in process for the mechanicals is 1,000 mi / 1,600 km. Oil consumption is expected to stabilize in the first 3,000 mi / 4830 km.

"Your vehicle requires a break-in period. For the first 1,000 mi (1,600 km)..."

"Note: The oil consumption of new engines reaches its normal level after approximately 3,000 mi (5,000 km)."

Why would an F-150 experience greater rates of oil consumption? Look at what they are used for. Most trucks are work trucks, tow trucks, hauling, 4x4, etc. These engines are most often placed in high-load, low RPM operating environments, exactly what you do not want for a new engine of any kind.

Regarding break-in, what to do and all that, there are tons of threads and comments within this forum alone. You can also read through what several engine builders do on their dynos. I've read great procedures on GM and Ford crate engine break-ins. Variable, moderate RPMs, not being shy towards revving high, very early, including acceleration and deceleration of the engine. IMO, deceleration, letting the engine take the load of slowing the vehicle down, is just as important.

I understand wanting to research an auto purchase before hand. The thing you have to remember though is that most internet and fourms are going to be heavily weighted with people searching for solutions to problems.
^ This is a really good statement. The overwhelming majority of Members here have 0 issues with their engines. Some do. Most of us do any number of things to our cars and never experience a problem.

Some failures are obvious: stuck PCV valves allowing oil to be sucked into the engine, not following Ford's break-in process, installing parts not designed for the engine, operating out of acceptable limits, not adhering to the maintenance schedule, etc.

But some failures are never known. Ford and suppliers build millions of these engines every year. Some are going to go bad. Even if the acceptable failure rate is a fraction of 1%, that's still a lot of engines. 1M engines, .1% failure rate is 1,000 engines.

Is there something inherently wrong with these engines? Something systemic? I don't think so.
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RagmopInKona

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So what is actually causing the oil consumption? Where is it going? I'm just concerned about piston ring issues and what not. I think the issue is data on this is so hard to get answers on cause there probably aren't a ton of high mileage ones to determine how serious this issue is or isnt yet eh?
Low tension piston rings, and thin rings and light weight motor oils. All part of the moves to make more power and get better mpg.
The v8 stangs hold 10 qt's. It is harder to control 10 qt's of fluid when you are driving it hard the oil piston rings are designed to only clear off a small film of oil, but when driving it "spiritedly" more oil gets splashed on the pistons, and cyl walls and more gets past the rings and burned Every engine does this till you move to a dry sump oiling system .
The oem oil pan doesn't do a great job of oil control other than it holds it from hitting the ground.
 
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zinsavage123

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Low tension piston rings, and thin rings and light weight motor oils. All part of the moves to make more power and get better mpg.
The v8 stangs hold 10 qt's. It is harder to control 10 qt's of fluid when you are driving it hard the oil piston rings are designed to only clear off a small film of oil, but when driving it "spiritedly" more oil gets splashed on the pistons, and cyl walls and more gets past the rings and burned Every engine does this till you move to a dry sump oiling system .
The oem oil pan doesn't do a great job of oil control other than it holds it from hitting the ground.
Well I guess let's assume I got one of the bad apples and it burned excessive oil...what are the cons to that, will that ultimately lead to engine failure and needing a new one? Or more of a mess and emissions issues
 

RagmopInKona

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Well I guess let's assume I got one of the bad apples and it burned excessive oil...what are the cons to that, will that ultimately lead to engine failure and needing a new one? Or more of a mess and emissions issues
Go buy an Echo.
Or buy a high powered car and get a warranty, or buy a new one, there are still 2022 and 2023's on lots. with ford's warranty not starting till the date of sale. Giving you 3 years 36k miles of the repairs if needed fords wallets problem.
 
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zinsavage123

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Go buy an Echo.
Or buy a high powered car and get a warranty, or buy a new one, there are still 2022 and 2023's on lots. with ford's warranty not starting till the date of sale. Giving you 3 years 36k miles of the repairs if needed fords wallets problem.
Eco is a no go for me, want strictly the 5.0 for the fun fast factor....but I can't lie and say I am not torn on just not getting one also cause of this oil stuff. I mean it doesn't seem to be a mass issue....but I am typically that guy that ends up as the 1% lol, and really don't want to be in and out the dealer with a car this new already.
 

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RagmopInKona

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Eco is a no go for me, want strictly the 5.0 for the fun fast factor....but I can't lie and say I am not torn on just not getting one also cause of this oil stuff. I mean it doesn't seem to be a mass issue....but I am typically that guy that ends up as the 1% lol, and really don't want to be in and out the dealer with a car this new already.
Then take the bus. Every vehicle has it's issues, I'll bet the oil issue on the 5.o's is 0.0001% of the units. but you are on a forum, and Those looking for answers to an issue tend to join them.
Ford sold how many v8 Mustangs or hell f trucks? the number of engines with oil burning issues is nill.
 

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stop worrying about something you have no control over, get a GT and Y O L O
 

KingKona

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There is no oil consumption issue.

Stop obsessing about a car you don't even own. Please go buy a Corolla, and stop wasting people's time here.
 
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zinsavage123

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There is no oil consumption issue.

Stop obsessing about a car you don't even own. Please go buy a Corolla, and stop wasting people's time here.

Wasting people's time? Hey I'm genuinely curious about these cars and just seeing the general view on them. There are some threads of people with these cars drinking more then normal oil, that's why I wanted some info and clarification.....sorry you don't seem to know much about the car that you own apparently.....as I have looked into them more then you have it seems.

I actually give a $hit about what I am planning to purchase and look into things....you must be the other guy.
 

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Wasting people's time? Hey I'm genuinely curious about these cars and just seeing the general view on them. There are some threads of people with these cars drinking more then normal oil, that's why I wanted some info and clarification.....sorry you don't seem to know much about the car that you own apparently.....as I have looked into them more then you have it seems.
It's been a few pages of people telling you not to worry about it, that it's not an issue. And yet you keep whining about it, because you're LOOKING for issues with a car you don't even own. Crying that you'll get one of the 1% that does have some issue.

A 5.0 isn't for you, you're too delicate and obsessive. We have too many of that type here already.
 

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zinsavage123

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It's been a few pages of people telling you not to worry about it, that it's not an issue. And yet you keep whining about it, because you're LOOKING for issues with a car you don't even own. Crying that you'll get one of the 1% that does have some issue.

A 5.0 isn't for you, you're too delicate and obsessive. We have too many of that type here already.
It's not about being delicate....we aren't talking about a oxygen sensor here or goofy electronic issue....we are talking about potential catastrophic engine damage, again that's why I wanted as much Info and input as I can get.

No....I don't want have to be dealing with a new engine and all that BS from a flawed design, the warranty doesn't last forever....and again this is not a goofy typical car issue....I am just not used to cars burning quarts of oil unless they have tons of miles on them. Apparently I got a lot to learn about these cars, that much I'll give you if so.
 

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Since you can't even figure out how to quote a post, I'll give you that you should steer waaaaay clear of anything that requires the slightest bit of technical or mechanical aptitude. Clearly checking the oil level when necessary would be vexing for you.

And everything you just posted about the Coyote is wrong. They don't drink "quarts of oil", there is no "flawed design", they don't have "potential catastrophic engine damage" issues any different in scale than any other motor.

Seriously, a 5.0 isn't for you. You won't be able to handle it. Stick to Hondas.
 

sk47

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Hello; I first discovered the issue a few years ago when shopping for a new F-150. I dismissed much of the internet forum talk until I found a FORD technical service bulletin about the Gen III coyote which was put into the F-150 at the time.
I will see if i still have saved the TSB and related information.

That some F-150s were burning excess oil is not false. Ford came up with a "fix". That was a two part fix. First after an oil consumption test the standard one quart low dipstick is replaced with a two quart to low dipstick. The other was to program the motor which opens and closes the throttle body butterfly. Before the butterfly would close all the way when you let off the gas pedal thus creating a high vacuum. After the butterfly would not close all the way as you coast to as stop. This allows air into the intake and reduces the total vacuum.
That vacuum apparently was pulling oil past the rings ( my assumption) into the combustion chamber, so more oil use. With less vacuum less oil is getting pulled past the rings.

Why the rings were not sealing I have not for sure found. Best i have found has to do with the plasma technique used to line the cylinder walls. Gen III does not have steel sleeves pressed into the bores. A liquid/plasma of steel is sprayed onto the cylinder walls. Saves a lot of weight in the engine. That very thin lining apparently is also very hard. Takes lots of miles to seat in rings. Over 10,000 miles is what i recall reading.
 

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It's not about being delicate....we aren't talking about a oxygen sensor here or goofy electronic issue....we are talking about potential catastrophic engine damage, again that's why I wanted as much Info and input as I can get.

No....I don't want have to be dealing with a new engine and all that BS from a flawed design, the warranty doesn't last forever....and again this is not a goofy typical car issue....I am just not used to cars burning quarts of oil unless they have tons of miles on them. Apparently I got a lot to learn about these cars, that much I'll give you if so.
This answer only further confirms King's previous comment is spot on.

You're looking for an issue, and/or obsessing over something that 1) isn't there and 2) can happen on any engine ever created.
 

sk47

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Hello; I first discovered the issue a few years ago when shopping for a new F-150. I dismissed much of the internet forum talk until I found a FORD technical service bulletin about the Gen III coyote which was put into the F-150 at the time.
I will see if i still have saved the TSB and related information.

That some F-150s were burning excess oil is not false. Ford came up with a "fix". That was a two part fix. First after an oil consumption test the standard one quart low dipstick is replaced with a two quart to low dipstick. The other was to program the motor which opens and closes the throttle body butterfly. Before the butterfly would close all the way when you let off the gas pedal thus creating a high vacuum. After the butterfly would not close all the way as you coast to as stop. This allows air into the intake and reduces the total vacuum.
That vacuum apparently was pulling oil past the rings ( my assumption) into the combustion chamber, so more oil use. With less vacuum less oil is getting pulled past the rings.

Why the rings were not sealing I have not for sure found. Best i have found has to do with the plasma technique used to line the cylinder walls. Gen III does not have steel sleeves pressed into the bores. A liquid/plasma of steel is sprayed onto the cylinder walls. Saves a lot of weight in the engine. That very thin lining apparently is also very hard. Takes lots of miles to seat in rings. Over 10,000 miles is what i recall reading.
Hello; here is a link to the TSB
http://www.fordservicecontent.com/Ford_Content/vdirsnet/TSB/EU/ (nhtsa.gov)
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