Camber plates track grade: Vorshlag vs Ground Control vs ?

[NvrFinished]

I am running the Ridetech setup, they move the camber settings to the strut base and use an eccentric bolt to adjust camber, I have them marked for -2.7* and -3.1* and I can make the change at the track. making the change at the knuckle has little effect on tow or caster so I have been able to get away with the little change in camber at the track. I make the change dependent on tire choice and track grip level. It would be nice to have more adjustment than the 2 settings but it is working for me so far. Having the shim style camber plates would allow for much more adjustment and should be more accurate as well.

The shim style plates are on my winter project list, but I still have projects left over from last winter I did not get done.

Dave

Hello Dave. I have the RideTech setup as well and the one thing I didn't care for was not being able to use standard camber plates. I'm not familiar with the shim style plates. Can you explain how these work or point me in the right direction to learn more? Google wasn't my friend on this one.

Also, I wasn't aware that changing the camber with the eccentric bolt setup didn't change the toe as much as camber plates do. When you make the change for more negative camber at the track, is adding a bit of toe out?

Thanks in advance!

Sponsored

 

[ddozier]

Hello Dave. I have the RideTech setup as well and the one thing I didn't care for was not being able to use standard camber plates. I'm not familiar with the shim style plates. Can you explain how these work or point me in the right direction to learn more? Google wasn't my friend on this one.

Also, I wasn't aware that changing the camber with the eccentric bolt setup didn't change the toe as much as camber plates do. When you make the change for more negative camber at the track, is adding a bit of toe out?

Thanks in advance!

The toe change for such a minor adjustment in camber in my case did not make much of a difference, I do not have my notes with me so I can not tell you how much the change was or what direction the change was but as long as you make the same changes to both sides it is not going to be noticed from the drivers seat. The toe link is in front of the knuckle so if I had to guess adding negative camber would increase the toe out of the front tires assuming you are running toe out in the front.

I have never tried adjusting rear camber at the track because it is such a pain using the stock hardware and I have not added the eccentric bolts to the rear yet. From what I remember the rear camber settings have a much larger impact on rear toe than the fronts did.

The shim style camber plates like the ones I pictured in the previous post have a center block (white block in the picture) that the top of the strut is attached to. There are shims on either side of the block, moving the shims from one side of the block to the other side of the block will either add or remove camber by moving the top of the shock in or out in relation to the shock tower. Each of the shims are a known thickness and usually are setup to equal a 1/4* of camber adjustment. If you want to increase negative camber by 1/2* at the track move 2 shims from the inside to the outside of the center block. The shims are through bolted through the center block and you end up with a solid setup that has very repeatable adjustments.

Many race teams build their own camber plates and shim packs so they can adjust the camber track side, a lot of teams use different color shims so they can make the changes in setup for the car based on last years testing or race days. When you find a setup that works at a particular track they make notes on the shim locations and then next time at the same track they can start from the same place every time.

You have to remember most competitive race teams will make many minor changes in setup throughout the event to try and work the whine out of the driver.;)

Dave

 

[NvrFinished]

The shim style camber plates like the ones I pictured in the previous post have a center block (white block in the picture) that the top of the strut is attached to. There are shims on either side of the block, moving the shims from one side of the block to the other side of the block will either add or remove camber by moving the top of the shock in or out in relation to the shock tower. Each of the shims are a known thickness and usually are setup to equal a 1/4* of camber adjustment. If you want to increase negative camber by 1/2* at the track move 2 shims from the inside to the outside of the center block. The shims are through bolted through the center block and you end up with a solid setup that has very repeatable adjustments.

Many race teams build their own camber plates and shim packs so they can adjust the camber track side, a lot of teams use different color shims so they can make the changes in setup for the car based on last years testing or race days. When you find a setup that works at a particular track they make notes on the shim locations and then next time at the same track they can start from the same place every time.

You have to remember most competitive race teams will make many minor changes in setup throughout the event to try and work the whine out of the driver.;)

Dave

OK, I see what you are talking about now. I didn't realize that the pic in the previous post was what you were referring to. It makes sense now to use the shims to get the known settings. So nothing is readily available aftermarket for the RideTech's unless you custom build a setup for them then.

After two separate track days on my stock PP Pirellis, I now know that I need more negative camber both front and rear based on the tire wear. I was thinking about purchasing toe plates and a camber gauge to set camber setting on the eccentric bolts up front and then measure how much it affects the toe. If the toe needs to be changed I'm assuming I could always set it back when moving camber back to the street setting. I need to keep studying up on doing this myself.

I have adjustable rear camber arms and toe rods for the rear. You are correct in that any adjustment of the camber affects the toe more than the front. The shop that did my 4 wheel alignment after I installed everything commented on how they kept chasing settings in the rear until they got it right. I may have to find a compromise between street and track for the rear camber.

 

[ddozier]

The shop that did my 4 wheel alignment after I installed everything commented on how they kept chasing settings in the rear until they got it right. I may have to find a compromise between street and track for the rear camber.

It is always going to be a compromise unless you setup the car for each event then put in back in street mode. The tire you choose for track duty will have the biggest input on the track setup. The best method for getting the camber and toe settings correct is to read the tire with a pyro and using the tire temps adjust your settings until you have ideal tire wear and grip levels.

Most R-Comp tires like and need lots of negative camber, most street tires can tolerate more camber than the factory spec. Having the camber bolts marked for two settings street/track would be ideal for the front but the rear will be much harder to have a dual setup because of the way the toe adjustment and camber adjustments are interconnected. This is going to make the rear the biggest compromise. This is also why it is a good idea to run a square setup with your track wheels and tires so you can rotate tires front to rear to extend tire life.

Dave

 

[wildcatgoal]

I use Steedas. Zero issues. I have adjusted track side when another attendee noticed my camber was different between left and right side visually. He put a thing on the wheels and proved it more or less (given the ground couldn't have been perfectly even). Come to find out my alignment shop's sensors were out of calibration or something because I went elsewhere to figure out what the deal was and everything came together perfectly. Anyway... zero issues with Steeda's - I think they're great.

 

[Mootang]

I use Vorshlag and haven't been to the track yet lol. The plates... they niceeeeeeee. Set my caster at +8 with them and easy to adjust with 3 loosen bolts and jacked up.

 

[BmacIL]

I like the Ground Control ones the best from a design perspetive because they have built in markings for adjustment. I want to be able to go from my street setting (roughly -1.5) to a track/autoX setting (-2 to -2.5) repeatably.

 

[D K]

Why not go with Vorshlag?
With as much as they are sharing and contributing, why not give them first shot?

 

[NvrFinished]

I like the Ground Control ones the best from a design perspetive because they have built in markings for adjustment. I want to be able to go from my street setting (roughly -1.5) to a track/autoX setting (-2 to -2.5) repeatably.

I have markings on my Vorshlag plates. Love the over-sized spherical bearings - no clunking noises!

 

[TeeLew]

I'm using the J&M camber plates with SPL Camber bolts.

Works extremely well.

I'm on J&M + Eibach bolts and they're also good.

Sponsored