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Anyone Dyno, Has physically Seen, ESS System 800+RWHP?

vanquishvzla

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Just curious, why do you say putting a 3.8 Whipple on a car that’s not raced and wants 600whp is a poor choice?
Because that’s like asking to get superman’s powers because you just wanna lift the couch while cleaning
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TrackMustang

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Because that’s like asking to get superman’s powers because you just wanna lift the couch while cleaning
I kinda figured that, but that doesn’t strike me as a big deal, just kind of a waste…
 

silverbullet85

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This is mostly incorrect. We rate the pulleys at 7200rpm across the board. That rating applies to Gen 2 and Gen 3 cars because they are the same kit. Also for G2 and G3 kits which utilize a different sized supercharger. There are so many variables at play when measuring boost. Different altitudes, weather, year of car and other modifications all play a huge factor in how much boost you will end up making. For example, a G2 car with headers and GT350 manifold will likely see less boost because of less restriction and a smaller supercharger. There is no one size fits all for measuring boost with each individual pulley. See Kevin’s car above, a G2 with the 105mm pulley making just over 10psi. Another member has this same setup with the G3 and makes over 14 psi. We give a baseline to go off of as well as pulley recommendations for pump gas that are clearly listed in the installation manual and on the website. We have done extensive testing and R&D on our own shop cars and know the limits on pump gas. If the recommendations we supply are followed there will be no issues.
Ok so you got me by 200 rpm. You rate rpm far lower then a stock coyote revs to, which was my point. And a very well known tuner at Lund had mentioned this is a cause for concern being that nobody revs the coyote to 7200 rpm. What happens when you spin to 7800 or 8k? That 9 psi becomes 12
 

kenand1988

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Ok so you got me by 200 rpm. You rate rpm far lower then a stock coyote revs to, which was my point. And a very well known tuner at Lund had mentioned this is a cause for concern being that nobody revs the coyote to 7200 rpm. What happens when you spin to 7800 or 8k? That 9 psi becomes 12
Revving past the stock redline on a 2018+ is a drivers choice and a tuners choice. If they rated their pulleys at 8k everyone would complain about low boost.
 

WIST2019GT

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Ok so you got me by 200 rpm. You rate rpm far lower then a stock coyote revs to, which was my point. And a very well known tuner at Lund had mentioned this is a cause for concern being that nobody revs the coyote to 7200 rpm. What happens when you spin to 7800 or 8k? That 9 psi becomes 12
I have completely stock exhaust on the G3 with a 110 (9.5psi) pulley. I spun the car to 7849 in the log and the air load showed 10.43 psi of boost at peak. I think there are a lot of variables and if you cant make a good safe choice based on some research and tuner suggestions then buy the largest pulley and work your way down. They are $150 for a pulley.
 

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DougS550

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Considering how superior they are I figured they’ve seen 1000+ and ran 8s no problem
Just curious, why do you say putting a 3.8 Whipple on a car that’s not raced and wants 600whp is a poor choice?
Im guessing because he thinks that would be way OVER-KILL for that application. I think I agree. Good Luck
 

Torinate

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Just curious, why do you say putting a 3.8 Whipple on a car that’s not raced and wants 600whp is a poor choice?
Um. Yea. As others have mentioned, the Whipple 3.8 is complete overkill. I’m not sure if you could put a big enough pulley on it to limit the car to 600whp. I guess if you only spin it to 5000 rpm maybe. The 3.8 is not designed for “only” 600. It’s a balls to the wall blower. Kind of like Procharger. You’re not putting an F1 on a car that you’re looking for 600 max. Again, I don’t know if you can fit a big enough pulley to get “only” 600 unless spinning the car to 5k RPMs. Same thing except opposite in using a Roush and shooting for max effort 1500 whp.

Don’t forget too though, it’s NOT just the blower it’s the complete combination of everything involved. Every little thing has to work in harmony to get the end results your looking for.

So if your goal is to run a Whipple 3.8 so you can tell your buddies that’s what you got, great! Be careful with the RPMs and you might be ok... just like a local guy around here who says he has 3 kits of nitrous on his stock 17 Camaro - each is a 200 shot - and he could lay waste to my car. I’m sure he could. Once maybe. I’d be afraid of running over all his motor parts on the strip and buggering up a tire.
 

Brevin@ESS

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Ok so you got me by 200 rpm. You rate rpm far lower then a stock coyote revs to, which was my point. And a very well known tuner at Lund had mentioned this is a cause for concern being that nobody revs the coyote to 7200 rpm. What happens when you spin to 7800 or 8k? That 9 psi becomes 12
The factory redline on a gen 2 auto car is 7,000 and 7500 on a gen 3 (auto). 7200 is splitting the difference between the two. Remember this kit is for both generations of mustang? What happens then if we rate the pulleys to 7800 and someone with a mild Gen 2 setup installs a kit with a 7psi pulley and a 7200 redline? He will see 2-3 psi less than what he believes the kit is advertised for. He will then start looking for a boost leak and believing that the kit is not making the advertised power. There must be a baseline set. We chose 7200 and clearly advertise this on the website and the install manual. If the end user does not follow these recommendations it is on them. There are too many variables and different combinations to have a one size fits all pulley chart. Also If you listen to that video carefully he clarifies that the end user is responsible for following the manufactures pulley ratings. See the website and manual below.

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TrackMustang

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Um. Yea. As others have mentioned, the Whipple 3.8 is complete overkill. I’m not sure if you could put a big enough pulley on it to limit the car to 600whp. I guess if you only spin it to 5000 rpm maybe. The 3.8 is not designed for “only” 600. It’s a balls to the wall blower. Kind of like Procharger. You’re not putting an F1 on a car that you’re looking for 600 max. Again, I don’t know if you can fit a big enough pulley to get “only” 600 unless spinning the car to 5k RPMs. Same thing except opposite in using a Roush and shooting for max effort 1500 whp.

Don’t forget too though, it’s NOT just the blower it’s the complete combination of everything involved. Every little thing has to work in harmony to get the end results your looking for.

So if your goal is to run a Whipple 3.8 so you can tell your buddies that’s what you got, great! Be careful with the RPMs and you might be ok... just like a local guy around here who says he has 3 kits of nitrous on his stock 17 Camaro - each is a 200 shot - and he could lay waste to my car. I’m sure he could. Once maybe. I’d be afraid of running over all his motor parts on the strip and buggering up a tire.
Makes sense, I’m not looking to do that myself or anything, I just wanted to make sure I understood. My whole life was 2 wheels so blowers were never my thing. All of what you’re saying makes sense though, thank you-
 

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LSchicago

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Revving past the stock redline on a 2018+ is a drivers choice and a tuners choice. If they rated their pulleys at 8k everyone would complain about low boost.
It should be rated at redline. Anything different doesn't make sense.
 

Brevin@ESS

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It should be rated at redline. Anything different doesn't make sense.
Read my above posts. We rate it between the redline of the Gen 2 and Gen 3 cars. So that means it’s actually rated above redline on the Gen 2. Remember these kits are designed for BOTH generations. There has to be a middle ground baseline. It’s a fairly simple concept. Redline will vary depending on setup. So will boost as has been discussed.
 

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The factory redline on a gen 2 auto car is 7,000 and 7500 on a gen 3 (auto). 7200 is splitting the difference between the two. Remember this kit is for both generations of mustang? What happens then if we rate the pulleys to 7800 and someone with a mild Gen 2 setup installs a kit with a 7psi pulley and a 7200 redline? He will see 2-3 psi less than what he believes the kit is advertised for. He will then start looking for a boost leak and believing that the kit is not making the advertised power. There must be a baseline set. We chose 7200 and clearly advertise this on the website and the install manual. If the end user does not follow these recommendations it is on them. There are too many variables and different combinations to have a one size fits all pulley chart. Also If you listen to that video carefully he clarifies that the end user is responsible for following the manufactures pulley ratings. See the website and manual below.
The way you've rated the kit is fine in my opinion. Honestly, this seems like a straw man you're arguing against.

This thread below is talking about the Procharger HO kit making 5.28 instead of 6.5 and there are no pitchforks from the crowd. The consensus is put a smaller pulley on and hold on.

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/th...procharger-ho-stage-1-low-boost-issue.127093/

You've given a reasonable reference boost pressure to RPM and recommended pulley size which has been demonstrated to be safe in the ESS thread.

I've been really impressed with the kit and the response from your company making updates and upgrades based on feedback.

I also appreciate the pioneers here that are pushing the systems for the benefit and knowledge of the community. :beer:
 

andrewtac

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Been off for a while, threads like this suck me in. I don't understand why people get so wrapped up in stuff like this. Manufacture rates it at x rpm and folks aren't happy. At least he rates it ar something, it isn't rocket surgery to interpolate it to higher rpms. There are so many variables that go into it. When I was buying mine I don't remember if any kits were rated at psi at x rpm, but I don't think I would have cared. I knew what the blower was capable of, about what pulley I needed to make a hp goal and have gone up since then. I have changed so much stuff and the psi has varied with just about everything. The capability of the blower has remained the same though, just keep letting it breath better.
 
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DougS550

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Who cares about the exact boost of one person's car with what ever mods they might or might not have. If your boost is low, buy a smaller pully. If your boost is to high but a larger pulley. Performance mod HP ratings are estimates for you to start out with. Each car will be different as to the total boost obtained and at what RPM driven. My gosh buy two or three pulleys and go from their to fine tune your engine to what ever your needs, wants etc are. Good Luck
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