afraid of the 2018 GT? buy now or no?

[bootlegger]

I'm pretty sure that the TSB referred to a certain batch of faulty shift forks that were made. Not all of them and since then the issue was corrected. It wasn't just that they were made of aluminum but that there was a casting issue with a certain batch. If the problem was that serious it would be a recall, not a TSB. I hate that the smaller percentage of cars with issues (compared to the many without serious issues) is causing this mass hysteria. I understand the reservation with such a large purchase, but no car is without an army of people complaining about something. Mine has 10k miles on it, it has ticked the same since I noticed it around 2k miles. Goes away once warmed up. Other then that the car has been near perfect.

The shifter fork thing is a small amount of cars. The rattle, not so much. You are lucky that yours goes away when warm.
That said, I don’t fear the car. I am just disappointed in the amount of time it is taking for Ford to release a TSB. They need to explain why it happens and whether it matters for engine longevity. That would probably relieve many concerns. I still don’t think they have a grip on the situation.

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[The_Phantom]

@Timeless


Not true at all.

Just people who have nothing constructive to add to the conversation at hand as I don't have time to entertain trolls.

 

[IronG]

I agree with you and others around the shift forks. It was a moment in time on a "batch" of cars that had the issue. Discovered, analyzed and fixed. My opinion on the rattle is that there isn't any clear data to suggest it is a problem or not. Just taking into account those on this forum that have mentioned it and/or getting new short blocks, some of them have modified their cars. Not saying that the mods caused it or accelerated the problem to happen, but those examples should be ignored. The only ones I would care about are the ones that did not mod their car, went through proper break-in and don't use it mainly for a track autocross car. That is really the only pool of cars to look at especially at first. Once that is figured out on why those failed (noises don't count) then you can move down to the next variable etc etc. Looking at it as a whole regardless of the variables is just wrong. This type of stuff has to be done scientifically and actually to be more specific forensically. I would hope that is what Ford is doing and why it is taking so long to hear why those engines failed. On the good side it could just be the % that were always going to fail for various reasons, part failure, mfr. failure, built on a Friday (ha!) etc. On the bad side, it is a engineering failure. This is probably unlikely, but you never know until Ford comes out with something official.

Anyway, I really feel bad for anyone that went through or going through the extreme (engine replacement) and those that are concerned they may be next. Nothing fun in that. I would say that every car enthusiast site (that I have been on) regardless of brand has similar discussions so it is not a surprise to me to see it here. I would just recommend that everyone should try to enjoy their car and if under warranty just stop worrying about it. If it happens that sucks, but the odds are you will be fine. At the end of ownership you will have wasted a lot of time and energy on something that never happened.

One last thing, I don't yet have my Mustang so I have nothing vested in Ford other than my daughter's Focus which has had transmission problems that were fixed. My last Ford was a 1971 Torino GT Cleveland. Glad to be getting another Ford (not counting my daughters) in the form of a Mustang. I see them all the time and have decided to go this way rather than getting another Porsche (btw it has not been trouble free). I love my Cayman though and will most likely keep it. My heart is set on a early 70's Carrera.....if I win the lottery it would an RS!. If you think Mustangs have problems, try owning a Porsche. You will question your purchase until you get in it and drive it when running right and forget the issues...otherwise it is a vicious circle.

 

[bootlegger]

I agree with you and others around the shift forks. It was a moment in time on a "batch" of cars that had the issue. Discovered, analyzed and fixed. My opinion on the rattle is that there isn't any clear data to suggest it is a problem or not. Just taking into account those on this forum that have mentioned it and/or getting new short blocks, some of them have modified their cars. Not saying that the mods caused it or accelerated the problem to happen, but those examples should be ignored. The only ones I would care about are the ones that did not mod their car, went through proper break-in and don't use it mainly for a track autocross car. That is really the only pool of cars to look at especially at first. Once that is figured out on why those failed (noises don't count) then you can move down to the next variable etc etc. Looking at it as a whole regardless of the variables is just wrong. This type of stuff has to be done scientifically and actually to be more specific forensically. I would hope that is what Ford is doing and why it is taking so long to hear why those engines failed. On the good side it could just be the % that were always going to fail for various reasons, part failure, mfr. failure, built on a Friday (ha!) etc. On the bad side, it is a engineering failure. This is probably unlikely, but you never know until Ford comes out with something official.

Anyway, I really feel bad for anyone that went through or going through the extreme (engine replacement) and those that are concerned they may be next. Nothing fun in that. I would say that every car enthusiast site (that I have been on) regardless of brand has similar discussions so it is not a surprise to me to see it here. I would just recommend that everyone should try to enjoy their car and if under warranty just stop worrying about it. If it happens that sucks, but the odds are you will be fine. At the end of ownership you will have wasted a lot of time and energy on something that never happened.

One last thing, I don't yet have my Mustang so I have nothing vested in Ford other than my daughter's Focus which has had transmission problems that were fixed. My last Ford was a 1971 Torino GT Cleveland. Glad to be getting another Ford (not counting my daughters) in the form of a Mustang. I see them all the time and have decided to go this way rather than getting another Porsche (btw it has not been trouble free). I love my Cayman though and will most likely keep it. My heart is set on a early 70's Carrera.....if I win the lottery it would an RS!. If you think Mustangs have problems, try owning a Porsche. You will question your purchase until you get in it and drive it when running right and forget the issues...otherwise it is a vicious circle.

Most of the people complaining about rattles have no mods.

 

[Silver Bullitt]

I am bone stock. It's rattled since 250 miles. I broke it in pretty much by the book. 2K miles now, 1/2 qt down on oil and rattle seems to be consistently getting a little louder. Going in for free oil change on Saturday. Will do the blend this time, and then plan to go full syn at 5K and then every 5K. I've still got 57 months and 58K miles to determine if there's really a problem or not. For now, I'm just driving it. And, btw, no issues with shift forks so far (May 2018 build), and I've stabbed it pretty hard a few times on the 2-3 shift (no problem barking the 305's going to 3rd).

 

[IronG]

Not sure you guys read my entire post (it was kinda long), but I said the noises are irrelevant at least for now. Only the engine replacements are important. Until someone posts an official statement from Ford on why the engines were replaced and what the root cause was it is just a bunch of people posting stuff. Again, not saying they did or did not have mods, broken in the car properly or raced it since it is impossible to know for sure. Just from my experience, I know factually that engines fail for defects and engines fail for misuse. I am sure both scenarios are responsible for the engine replacements.

 

[IronG]

I am bone stock. It's rattled since 250 miles. I broke it in pretty much by the book. 2K miles now, 1/2 qt down on oil and rattle seems to be consistently getting a little louder. Going in for free oil change on Saturday. Will do the blend this time, and then plan to go full syn at 5K and then every 5K. I've still got 57 months and 58K miles to determine if there's really a problem or not. For now, I'm just driving it. And, btw, no issues with shift forks so far (May 2018 build), and I've stabbed it pretty hard a few times on the 2-3 shift (no problem barking the 305's going to 3rd).

The best thing you said was "I'm just driving it". That is what everyone hopefully should be doing.

 

[The_Phantom]

I agree with you and others around the shift forks. It was a moment in time on a "batch" of cars that had the issue. Discovered, analyzed and fixed.

So you know this for a fact, or is this just your opinion? Because it sounds like an opinion that's being stated as fact.

My opinion on the rattle is that there isn't any clear data to suggest it is a problem or not.

Can you tell me how many examples you know of where an engine rattle, of any kind, is a good thing and not a problem? Especially on a brand new car?

Just taking into account those on this forum that have mentioned it and/or getting new short blocks, some of them have modified their cars. Not saying that the mods caused it or accelerated the problem to happen, but those examples should be ignored. The only ones I would care about are the ones that did not mod their car, went through proper break-in and don't use it mainly for a track autocross car.

So what you are saying here is you're not interested in what happens to a car that is modified, even knowing that the Mustang is the most likely vehicle to be modified on the market today and was built to be improved. What you want to know is, does the Grandpa driving a bone stock car at 10 under the speed limit at all times, no more than 25% throttle ever, have issues? That's a poor way to judge the likelihood of issues with this car, and also is NOT the way the car is marketed, by Ford, for their audience. They tell us to modify it. They offer us Ford Racing parts. They tell us the track times, lateral G's, etc. And what you are essentially saying here is, "Well, anyone who actually does that stuff...their opinion and experiences do not matter." Even though they are driving the car and treating it as it is advertised to be treated.

Anyway, I really feel bad for anyone that went through or going through the extreme (engine replacement) and those that are concerned they may be next. Nothing fun in that. I would say that every car enthusiast site (that I have been on) regardless of brand has similar discussions so it is not a surprise to me to see it here. I would just recommend that everyone should try to enjoy their car and if under warranty just stop worrying about it. If it happens that sucks, but the odds are you will be fine. At the end of ownership you will have wasted a lot of time and energy on something that never happened.

Every forum does not have credible complaint issues about new car build quality, at least not to the extent Ford has seen at this point on the '18's. The suggestion to, basically, "stick your head in the sand and hope nothing happens" is the same approach that was taken about the early MT-82 trans issues on the S197's. And we all know how that turned out. The forum is full of people asking about Mustangs they are thinking about buying. It is on us, the current owners, to give them the best information possible. Just because a failure happens under warranty DOES NOT make it acceptable, especially when you are talking full engine replacements.

Replies are in bold in the quote.

Most of the people complaining about rattles have no mods.

+1

I don't have the engine rattle...at least not consistently...yet. But I do have interior rattles that occurred in the first 5k miles of ownership when the car was 100% stock down to the paper air filter. No fun in a $50k car, despite what some will tell you.

Some can live with things like that, some can't. Me, I've always driven muscle cars so I'm used to some noises here and there, but I've never had rattles kick in at such low mileage. Plus, the wife is used to her Toyota Camry so we take the Lexus everywhere because she absolutely can not stand the back seat/trunk area rattle that I'm currently in the process of chasing down.

 

[IronG]

Go look at the TSB for the shift forks. Your answer will be there.

As for the rattle, can you tell me what is making that sound and is it bad?

Any car that is modified regardless of how it is driven is suspect. You nor anyone else would know how it was really driven. The only known is that it was modified. Pretty much why doing such things will nullify a warranty for all or parts of the car. So yeah, not interested in why someone would modify their car and what happens to it afterward in regards to warranty work. Only the non modified cars should be looked at since no root cause is known. Not saying it is bad to know how modifications affect a car long term in case you are interested in doing it, but you are rolling the dice if under warranty.

Funny you questioned me on a clearly stated opinion for data and you agree with someone that made a statement with no data to back it up. Wow, what are you trying to say really?

Your last statement makes no sense to me. You are saying no other car manufactures have issues to the extent of engine replacement? Your kidding right or maybe you meant something else? I never mentioned once to have anyone not say they have an issue or are hearing noises. I was merely stating that you should not worry about hearing noises until the noise you are hearing is a proven symptom of a bigger problem. Some have done the right thing and taken it to their dealer. Other than that, why get all worked up over something that is possibly nothing? If it were a 10 year old car out of warranty, different story.

The one thing we agree on is that some 2015-2019 Mustang GT owners have had their engines replaced. How many and what the root cause was is unknown. Until the root cause is found, nothing you nor I say is really worth too much other than idle speculating. That is why I am going with the odds are in your favor that nothing will happen to your engine regardless of a few "ticks" or "rattles".

 

[The_Phantom]

I was merely stating that you should not worry about hearing noises until the noise you are hearing is a proven symptom of a bigger problem.

There are a whole lot of C6Z06 owners who would be walking if they followed your logic on that.

The key to correcting issues is to recognize them early on before they become even worse. So not sure how you think ignoring the issue and just driving it until something goes boom is a great idea.

 

[bootlegger]

Not sure you guys read my entire post (it was kinda long), but I said the noises are irrelevant at least for now. Only the engine replacements are important. Until someone posts an official statement from Ford on why the engines were replaced and what the root cause was it is just a bunch of people posting stuff. Again, not saying they did or did not have mods, broken in the car properly or raced it since it is impossible to know for sure. Just from my experience, I know factually that engines fail for defects and engines fail for misuse. I am sure both scenarios are responsible for the engine replacements.

Engine noises are relevant when not all cars have them. The engines that have been replaced had cylinder wall scuffing. Just because someone didn't have an engine replaced, doesn't mean their issue is irrelevant. Many Ford dealers don't care to even troubleshoot the issue. Thus, their customers wouldn't even know if the noises mean anything. The engine replacements, thus far, were all on stock vehicles.
I once had a dealership tell me a grinding noise while driving down the road in my S197 was "normal". They were wrong. The transmission was later replaced under warranty due to gear issues (caused by that same dealership). Engine replacement isn't the only time we should be concerned with an issue or unknown noise.

 

[bootlegger]

The key to correcting issues is to recognize them early on before they become even worse. So not sure how you think ignoring the issue and just driving it until something goes boom is a great idea.

This is my problem with people on this forum. Too many are fine with ignoring noises they don't understand. They always fall back on the warranty, which basically tells me these people beat on the car for a couple years and trade it in.

 

[NoVaGT]

The key to correcting issues is to recognize them early on before they become even worse.

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. Lots of sounds people think are issues really aren't, they're the normal sounds a car makes.

 

[The_Phantom]

This is my problem with people on this forum. Too many are fine with ignoring noises they don't understand. They always fall back on the warranty, which basically tells me these people beat on the car for a couple years and trade it in.

+1

I agree 100%

 

[Silver Bullitt]

This is my problem with people on this forum. Too many are fine with ignoring noises they don't understand. They always fall back on the warranty, which basically tells me these people beat on the car for a couple years and trade it in.

I'm certainly not ignoring it. But, I'm not going to let Ford tear into it or have my car for weeks only to tell me it's normal. Yes, it's a $40K car, but I'm not going to lose sleep or worry about it. I sure don't want it to fail, but at least the warranty covers me if it does. I'd like to have the car for a long time. I had my GTO for 12 years. I beat the hell out of it, but I changed the oil every 3K with full syn and took good care of it. It was in mint shape when I sold it.

As for the Mustang, I don't regret the purchase one single bit. Until we know what's going on (if it's not just a normal characteristic of the beast), I'm going to enjoy it because it's a damn fun car to drive. What else would you suggest we do?

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