2021 Mach 1 CONFIRMED in Leaked Ford Document!!!

[MaskedRacerX]

What's that got to do with torque?

To answer your question though.........no one will know until Ford releases the specs, but I really hope the 10-speed is at least an option (all previous Mach 1 have been available with a choice of transmissions)

In the very near future, I'd be surprised to see any new "manual only" products. It'll be interesting to see what happens with the last few: GT350 (certainly gone pretty soon), and Bullitt / PP2 (maybe living on conceptually in something new).

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[GreenS550]

I agree with @shogun32 on this one. Yes technically torque and force are different, but they are really treated the same/similarly. Torque is just force applied at a distance.

But shogun was wrong when he implied that HP doesn't translate into moving/accelerating an object.

That is definitely an incorrect answer.

Nope. Read the formula. Angle, force, lever arm. Not the same. That's why the stroke and bore are critical in determining torque. The angle, length, weight, etc. This is one of the reasons why the Coyote doesn't have the torque even though it has 12:1 compression. Also the reason the VooDoo engine has less torque than the Coyote. You can apply more force through FI, but there is still the lever arm length and angle. Torque is much more complicated than "force".

 

[Hack]

What's that got to do with torque?

To answer your question though.........no one will know until Ford releases the specs, but I really hope the 10-speed is at least an option (all previous Mach 1 have been available with a choice of transmissions)

Point taken. My apologies. I'll try to dial back.

It would be really interesting to know Ford's internal reasoning about the Mach 1 and how they plan to position it in the market. I'm a manual only guy, but there's no reason the auto can't be available for any purpose, whether it be the natural old school straight-line or cruising purpose or for road course. Autos are accepted as being good for road course use now. And likewise manuals are not as good for straight line or anything else with the possible exception of driving enjoyment - but I really hope Ford makes a good manual available.

I'd really love to see it positioned with lots of configurable options like they did back in the day. Available big power, available inexpensive with low power, available manual and auto - all options with cool appearance. Most current cars the appearance is very different between the lower and higher power versions.

I'll take my Mach 1 with the high RPM 5.2 or larger engine, manual tremec, big brakes and all the road course cooling and aero.

Nope. Read the formula. Angle, force, lever arm. Not the same. That's why the stroke and bore are critical in determining torque. The angle, length, weight, etc. This is one of the reasons why the Coyote doesn't have the torque even though it has 12:1 compression. Also the reason the VooDoo engine has less torque than the Coyote. You can apply more force through FI, but there is still the lever arm length and angle. Torque is much more complicated than "force".

You are right. I think of them as being the same, but that's ignoring all the specifics about how each needs to be treated when doing "the math". So I was wrong in what I said.

 

[MustangJoe84]

I have a feeling that if the Mach1 is based on some combination of Bullitt/PP2/GT350 that it might be a manual only.
If I remember the original leaked CJ Pony video describing a forthcoming Mach1 I believe he said manual only.
I think this would be a mistake on Ford's part, but if they are on a limited budget....
I still to this day applaud Scott Hoag for pushing through developing an automatic for the 03/04 Mach1, of which I still own a copy.

 

[302@12psi]

There's plenty of folks who would option the PP2 with the 10 speed. In hind sight, and if they offered it, I likely would have. As long as they aren't afraid of the 10 speed over heating during mild track sessions, which personally I think they are, then there is no reason not to offer it. It does EVERYTHING better besides provide maximum fun.

I think you offer the 18+ Ford Performance Power Pack, PP2 handling upgrades, and transmission options along with appropriate cooling. If they do a "normal" 5.2 I'd be shocked. I'd also be shocked if they violated the GT350 and borrow the FPC.

 

[Elp_jc]

Ford needs to come up with a DCT (dual clutch transmission) for these cars, or they'll have a hard time selling them IMO. My last Porsche was a DCT, and even though I was reluctant to get one at first, it was awesome (always driven with the paddles, of course). The downshifts in sport+ had a super aggressive throttle blip, and sounded incredible. And super smooth too; none of the surging and jerking needed on a planetary gear tranny, like Ford's 10-sp. And shifts (up and down) are absolutely instant. You can't use sport+ outside a track, since it shifts at redline. But used in manual mode, it was just about perfect. And impossible to come even close in a manual, but I missed rowing the gears too much, so now I'll be back to a proper manual .

 

[99Zeus99]

After seeing Stangmode destroy the new GT500 with his 5.0 Supercharged, I'll keep my Whippled GT. The dealer markup on a Mach I will be stupid.

 

[MaskedRacerX]

Ford needs to come up with a DCT (dual clutch transmission) for these cars, or they'll have a hard time selling them IMO.

You're aware the 2020 GT500 has a DCT, right? There's a part available, it's just a significant cost, and due to the gearing, might introduce a GGT into the regular GT.

 

[Twin Turbo]

If I remember the original leaked CJ Pony video describing a forthcoming Mach1 I believe he said manual only.

The video stated it'd use the Tremec 6-speed manual from the GT350.......but didn't state if this would be the only transmission.

I'd love the Mach 1 to have the GT500's DCT but as well as the cost, I can't see them using it as its a unique selling point for the Shelby.

In a world where the manual gearbox is becoming a rarity, Ford are pretty good at offering a number of manual-only Mustangs (PP2/Bullitt/GT350). However, in terms the Mach 1, if they don't offer an automatic option, it'll be the first time the Mach 1 would be manual-only.

Right now, I'd settle for a new spy-shot as it's about the only new model that hasn't been spied during the Covid lockdown (we've seen Bronco/Bronco Sport/new F150)

 

[EcoVert]

If I remember the original leaked CJ Pony video describing a forthcoming Mach1 I believe he said manual only.

The Mach 1 has traditionally been a auto or standard transmission car and I believe Ford will make this one with a auto option. Take a look around and see how many manual only Bullitt's are still on the dealer lots my dealer has three and there 2019's. I don't think Ford will make the mistake with the Mach 1.

 

[MaskedRacerX]

The Mach 1 has traditionally been a auto or standard transmission car and I believe Ford will make this one with a auto option. Take a look around and see how many manual only Bullitt's are still on the dealer lots my dealer has three and there 2019's. I don't think Ford will make the mistake with the Mach 1.

Yeah, I look back at MY15-17, when I suspect a lot of PP cars were sold in spite of the manual, then look at the huge number of A10 PP cars people are buying. It's clear that's a major market, i.e., high performance (both street and track), with an automatic (GM even stuck an A10 in the ZLE). Not to mention, the A10 is just so darn good too.

Would the DCT be even more amazing? Yeah, probably, buy I said above it's cost prohibitive and like @Twin Turbo pointed out, very specific and unique to the GT500 model. I mean, a Mach I with a DCT, 3.73, a high winding 520HP NA motor, GT350 brakes? *boom*

While we're at it, how about a specialty performance model option for the convertible. Yeah, yeah, I get it, convertible owners are all girly boy cruisers, and I get that the GT350 / GT500 are very "purpose built" (though the previous one had a convertible option). Still, I'd like to see something like a Mach I convertible, a really dialed up performance flavor, and it's not like these cars aren't super modular, there's really nothing all that complex.

 

[FreePenguin]

Makes me sad that people if had the choice sacrifice the manual for sake of times/quarter. If there was 50/50 they would still have both options But it’s true less and less want manual.

 

[dfanucci]

The Mach 1 has traditionally been a auto or standard transmission car and I believe Ford will make this one with a auto option. Take a look around and see how many manual only Bullitt's are still on the dealer lots my dealer has three and there 2019's. I don't think Ford will make the mistake with the Mach 1.

Absolute truth.

I've had more mustangs in my life than I care to count. My first was the 84 anniversary addition. Every single one of them outside of my 68 and 65 were manuals. I simply did not want anything to do with an automatic. I was in the market again for a new one, and since I'm getting up in my years I decided it was time to splurge. I was 3 minutes from signing the papers on a Bullitt, but a black Gt caught my eye. I walked over to it, peeked inside, and saw the auto. I lost interest. Salesman says "have you driven the new 10 speeds?" I answered no, and he said "drive it".

Long story short, if the Bullitt had the auto as an option I would be driving it right now instead of the GT. I never in my life thought I would own a late model auto, but these 10 speeds are the real deal.

 

[w3rkn]

I'm almost done, but I will try one more time to help you. Since you are the expert and torque is very meaningful... answer this question.

I have two cars that each weigh the same 3,000 lbs. They both have the same transmission and same rear gear. One has an engine that makes 100 ft/lbs of torque. The other has an engine that makes 1,000 ft/lbs of torque.

Which car will be faster through the quarter mile?

Wait, we go through of all that, for you to go right back to scenarios? I understand you are trying to get an understanding.

Understand that, and engine can only hit peak HP once in the powerband (again, because peak HP is the potential of the engine).. where as you can have peak torque over a broad part of the rev-band.. Subsequently, torque is not a static figure, (like I think you are mentally portraying).

Torque is not over time.
Horsepower is over time.

Go back and re-read what I carefully wrote for you in an earlier post... I am not trying to be combative, but to help.

 

[Alex1979]

Hoping for more info on the Mach 1 soon!

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