2021 Mach 1 CONFIRMED in Leaked Ford Document!!!

Discussion in 'Mustang S550 General Forums' started by JGillis, Apr 1, 2020.

  1. Bikeman315

    Bikeman315 Well-Known Member

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    Well based on the sheet from Ford that’s not happening so now we can go back trying to figure out what the new 5.0 will be. :)
     
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  2. 200MPHCOBRA

    200MPHCOBRA Liberty Tree Needs Water

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    Probably one of several reasons why the numbers continue the plunge from 2015.:beer:
     
  3. Bikeman315

    Bikeman315 Well-Known Member

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    Maybe it’s time for you to step up and buy one. :giggle:
     
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  4. falcongtho3

    falcongtho3 Well-Known Member

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    Look
    At
    The
    Engine
    Code.
    We
    All
    Know
     
  5. martinjlm

    martinjlm Retired from GM

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    The infrastructure issue is really only applicable to battery electric vehicles. I expect that whatever Ford does with a hybrid Mustang will be a hybrid, not a plug-in hybrid. The battery would be somewhere in the 1.8 - 2.2 kWh size, so not too heavy. For comparison, a Toyota Prius uses a 2.16 kWh battery. A Chevrolet Bolt BEV uses a 66 kWh battery. The Bolt needs infrastructure (sort of) while the Prius does not. The Mach E will need infrastructure (sort of) while a Mustang Hybrid will not. I say “sort of” because the only time a Bolt or a Mach E will need infrastructure is for trips longer than their full battery range (238 miles for Bolt, 300+ for Mach E). Otherwise, they can recharge at home. People who can’t recharge at home shouldn’t buy one.

    A Mustang with an electric motor between the engine and transmission would be able to drive for short distances at low speed with the engine off. Saves fuel. They would also get pretty decent launch assist from the electric motor, with full e-motor torque at 0 rpm. That could be fun. Most of the added weight would be from the electric motor, not the battery. I would expect it would use the same system used in the Explorer Hybrid. Here’s a review with specs of the Explorer Hybrid system.

    https://www.greencarreports.com/new...rer-hybrid-first-drive-review-muscle-over-mpg
     
  6. Bikeman315

    Bikeman315 Well-Known Member

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    All we know is that there are three V8 engines. We do not know exactly what is going into the Mach 1. How do we know know it won't be a NA 5.2? Anything's possible at this point.

    Screen Shot 2020-04-05 at 10.46.13 AM.png
     
  7. Twin Turbo

    Twin Turbo Super Moderator
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    I had assumed the Mustang would share it's hybrid design with the F150, both being V8s. However, at the same time this Mustang VIN document leaked, so did the F150's. and it appears the F150 hybrid will be a 3.5 V6...........so not even the same as the Explorer/Lincoln Aviator, as that uses the twin turbo 3.0 6 cylinder.... F150 hybrid.jpg
     
  8. Twin Turbo

    Twin Turbo Super Moderator
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    So, perhaps the Mustang will use this form of hybrid. This V8 doc revealed in a patent Hybrid diagram.jpg
     
  9. martinjlm

    martinjlm Retired from GM

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    Also, the reason I think this thing is a hybrid (other than the fact Ford says they will make a hybrid) is the dirty of information on the 2nd 5.0L. All they’re saying is it will be a 4V. Wow! Guess it’ll have heads too, right. The first one is described as TiCVT, which is Ford’s description of the tried and true Coyote. Why not carry over that same designation to the 2nd 5.0L? Maybe because there’s something different about the valve train? Like Atkinson Cycle operation?
     
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  10. Bikeman315

    Bikeman315 Well-Known Member

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    So I guess that kills the idea of a hybrid Mach 1. Didn't really make sense to me anyway. The sales of a special edition couldn't justify the cost. Of course they could wait a year or two and then put it in a regular Mustang but that doesn't really make financial sense either.
     
  11. Mazman

    Mazman Well-Known Member

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    If it is released with a hybrid motor it will make very very compelling for European buyers as the tax would be much lower (hopefully) as it has the hybrid drive to push down the CO2 values.

    Also considering the muscle car heritage I think the electric part will be there to boost the 0-60 and up 402m. Not sure if it will eg be a 12kwh battery similar to what I have in my 330e as that would add a bit of weight to be able to get 20-30 miles electric range

    Weight doea not seem to be a problem on the platform from a dynamics perspective just look at the GT500 (eventhough there are many differences compared to GT)
     
  12. martinjlm

    martinjlm Retired from GM

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    #162 martinjlm, Apr 5, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2020
    We’ve (the engine analysts in my team at work) been debating this issue all week, remotely of course. . I think Ford’s having a little fun with us. I think the F-150 Hybrid will be based on the 3.5TT. Why? Notice it is only called 3.5 HEV. It doesn’t say that it is TT. It also doesn’t say that it is not. There is (in my opinion) a reason why they are not showing the hp. It will be very similar to, but probably slightly less than, the 3.5TT hp.

    So why wouldn’t they just do a 3.5L NA? They could, but at this point, they do not have a 3.5L RWD NA engine in their portfolio. They do have a 3.3L, but not a 3.5L. So they would either have to develop a 3.5L by stripping the turbos off of a 3.5TT or by increasing displacement of the 3.3L. The second idea is where others in my group are lining up. It would make sense, because using an Atkinson Cycle valve setup as most hybrids do does reduce hp and increasing displacement would get some of that power back. But on the other hand, if they expect this hybrid F-150 to tow worth a darn, they’d be best advised to slap those turbos back on. By the way, a twin turbo RWD hybrid already exists in Ford’s portfolio, so adding the 3.5TT F-150 hybrid is not a stretch.
     
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  13. martinjlm

    martinjlm Retired from GM

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    It would not have as much battery as your 330e. Your 330e is a Plug-in Hybrid and needs the extra battery size to be able to operate at high speeds as electric only. Similar to the 18.1 kWh in my Volt that can drive at 99 mph with the ICE off. It will be closer to the 1.5kWh in the Explorer Hybrid. Probably larger...1.8 - 2.2 kWh.
     
  14. Hack

    Hack Well-Known Member

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    Hey if you want to trade more weight, cost and complexity for a fuel economy improvement in your "sporty" vehicle, go for it. I'd much rather have a larger displacement engine than a hybrid system. Cheaper, weighs less and lasts longer. Dead reliable.

    I pray that hybrid stays an option rather than replacing everything. I like new cars and it would be great if Detroit would continue to build something I like.
     
  15. Alex1979

    Alex1979 Member

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    Total crazy hopeful thought, what about a 5.0 flat plane crank ! Lol, that would be cool
     
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