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2019 Base GT350 Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2s in the Rain?

BillyJRacing

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BillyJRacing,

Thanks for all your input! Really appreciated, especially for track noobs as myself. I do have a question in regards to my stock PSS.., I’ve tracked them in the rain at Big Willow. They slid around quite a lot...even the instructor was surprised how easily my tail gave out.

On the way home, on normal streets in the wet, it got even worse. Is this due to the “marbles” that are stuck on the surface slowly giving way? Are melted bits of tire that get stuck an issue?

Thank you!

PS, forgot to ask...after reading your explanation of the new cup 2s for the non-R....would it be suffice to say, that I should go for those as opposed to my current PSS, when comes time to replace my tires?
It never rains in CA, and when it does, the oil from the road comes to the surface and makes the streets as slick as ice, compared to places that rain all the time. Is this the main cause and issue (that happens in any car) that you are talking about?

If you have rubber pickup from marbles, then yes it can hurt the tire's wet performance.

It depends. If you are happy with the wet/dry performance of the stock PSS, then the 2019 GT 350 Cup 2 would be an improvement, especially on track. If you don't track your car more than 1-2X a year, and care more about wet grip and hydroplaning resistance than dry and track performance, i'd go with PS4S tires. Since you live in CA and it rarely rains, personally, I'd probably go with the new Cup 2 if you intend on doing more track days.

Decently comparable is still useful. Somewhat useless isn’t completely useless. Every tire distributor says comparable within same brand. Still doesn’t answer the question.
What are you trying to deduce from knowing the stated treadwear ratings (which are all the same for the Cup 2's). If you're trying to determine what Cup 2 will last longer on the street due to a deeper tread depth or harder compound, you can look up the former and won't know the latter. Therefore, the stated number is useless.
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MikeR397

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I find them fine, until the point when they suddenly are not and hydroplane and just pray they catch before you slide off the track that is! Few concerns on the road except maybe highway in deep puddles but you do have to pay attention
2277D24B-C793-4BB9-B001-96196E28BF58.jpeg
 
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MikeR397

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NOT ALL CUP 2 TIRES ARE THE SAME !!!!

The bespoke 2019 GT350 Cup 2 is designed to be more in line with the 2015-18 bespoke GT350 Pilot Super Sport in terms of wet grip and hydroplane resistance than the more track-focused GT350R's Cup 2.

Meanwhile, a Corvette C7 Z06 Cup 2 has a very shallow tread depth and aggressive compounding and tread design that has very poor cold, wet, and hydroplaning resistance.

Think of the 2019 GT350 Cup 2 like the old bespoke PSS. If that tire is not offer enough in terms of wet performance or daily-driveablility, you can look at an off the shelf PS4S or Continental ExtremeContact Sport if you want to give up dry performance, feel and handling for an increase in wet performance. You won't get much better than the PS4S or ECS in terms of deep water wet performance. You'll also probably get worse wet performance than the factory Cup 2 by going with a 'summer tire' that's not a PS4S or ECS.

For most people, the factory 2019 Cup 2 is perfectly fine for a daily driver since that's what it was designed for. Do not be afraid of driving on them because you think they are equivalent to a Z06 or GT350R Cup 2. FWIW I drive a GT350R on it's more aggressive Cup 2s in the rain here in FL. It's not ideal, but you're far better off in a 2019 GT350 with it's street focused Cup 2 tires.
Crap, I asked this in another thread and was told the Cup 2 305/30/19 that come on a mustang GT performance pack 2 are the same tire that come on the front of the R? I just bought a set of 4 of these off said car for $150 a tire on eBay for my R front wheels, which is pretty exclusively track use. Thought it was a deal...

O well, guess I get to see how they compare next year if the compound is all that different...

Edit: I guess the base 350 cup 2 are different sizes, but all 4 on the gt performance pack 2 cup 2s are the same size as the R cup 2. So when buying this size on tirerack or elseware how do you make sure what you are getting. I know the Porsche spec cup 2 same 305/30/19 tire warranty are 102y vs 98y, have stiffer sidewall and more tread, but how to tell performance pack 2 cup 2s apart?

Edit 2: looks like you already answered my question a page back, thanks and now I can be happy with my deal again :)!

The PP2 uses front GT350R Cup 2s all the way around. You're probably not going to find a faster Cup 2 for your wheel size short of the Z06's front tire, which may or may not be faster or work well on the Mustang.
 
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BillyJRacing

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Crap, I asked this in another thread and was told the Cup 2 305/30/19 that come on a mustang GT performance pack 2 are the same tire that come on the front of the R?
They are.

Edit: I guess the base 350 cup 2 are different sizes, but all 4 on the gt performance pack 2 cup 2s are the same size as the R cup 2. So when buying this size on tirerack or elseware how do you make sure what you are getting. I know the Porsche spec cup 2 same 305/30/19 tire warranty are 102y vs 98y, have stiffer sidewall and more tread, but how to tell performance pack 2 cup 2s apart?
Yes. 2019 GT350 Cup 2 are 295/35-19 & 305/35-19 (104Y & 106Y) XL and notated by "FP" (Ford Performance) on the tire. The GT350R Cup 2 is a 305/30-19 & 315/35-19 (98Y & 100Y) SL.
 

MikeR397

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Thanks again Billy J. You may have missed my edit 2 but I saw your post on this on the last page just now as well.

It’s interesting that you are saying the Porsche spec 305/30/19 cup 2 would not last as long if you are pushing the car hard mainly on track, considering significantly more tread and stiffer sidewall. I posted before I’ve been getting 5 max days on front cup 2s before chording ( -2.8 camber) and heat cycling out with 40% tread left on my rears after 8-9 days. It could be an adverse technique but I’m not understeering or pushing in the corners and do trail brake. Many who tried the Porsche spec did say they lasted significantly longer on track like honey badger iirc. I’ve never tried bc I always find a deal on 2015 year cup 2 or R cf wheel take offs or now pp2 tires for the front. Hard to pass up sub $200 a tire and pay $500 each instead — same reason i havnt tried slicks.

Fwiw, I generally run 1:26 at grattan, occasionally can get 1:25 with my R. This is generally quicker than anything shy of a race car during the events I do, but again, not saying I’m driving the car properly! Photo from Waterford, not grattan...
9FE66934-627B-4FFB-B6F7-29A909FDF9FC.jpeg
 

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It never rains in CA, and when it does, the oil from the road comes to the surface and makes the streets as slick as ice, compared to places that rain all the time. Is this the main cause and issue (that happens in any car) that you are talking about?

If you have rubber pickup from marbles, then yes it can hurt the tire's wet performance.

It depends. If you are happy with the wet/dry performance of the stock PSS, then the 2019 GT 350 Cup 2 would be an improvement, especially on track. If you don't track your car more than 1-2X a year, and care more about wet grip and hydroplaning resistance than dry and track performance, i'd go with PS4S tires. Since you live in CA and it rarely rains, personally, I'd probably go with the new Cup 2 if you intend on doing more track days
Thanks BillyJ! 2019 Gt350 cup2s it is!
 

Racer2233

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I know this has been beaten to death, but IMO if your going to use as a daily driver (and I do) put on a set of Super Sports and live longer.
 
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Racer2233

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I guess you didn't read a lot of the recent posts on this thread.
Oh I have and realize its just my opinion, but people seem to "Qualify" wet performance of our Cup2's. I live in North Carolina and can absolutely attest they are not something you want to intentionally (Daily Driven) be out in a heavy rain on. On the track they are amazing
 

Eritas

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Oh I have and realize its just my opinion, but people seem to "Qualify" wet performance of our Cup2's. I live in North Carolina and can absolutely attest they are not something you want to intentionally (Daily Driven) be out in a heavy rain on. On the track they are amazing
And you promote the stock PSS tires which have the same wet performance as the stock 19 Cup 2. See the irony?
 

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Racer2233

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So I am going to tap out after this response since I have no interest in banter. "Dry performance" at mile 1 may be similar but when you take real word driving and total water evacuation area of the tread it's just simple math from there. I do not promote any tire, just been driving race cars for 35 years and prefer not to wad up my new GT350. Peace
 
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Eritas

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So I am going to tap out after this response since I have no interest in banter. "Dry performance" at mile 1 may be similar but when you take real word driving and total water evacuation area of the tread it's just simple math from there. I do not promote any tire, just been driving race cars for 35 years and don't want to die now. Peace
That's comical that you don't read posts by the guy who developed the car and said the tire you want to put on, that you think will save your life, won't have any better wet performance. :crackup:

It's your money and car. Whatever makes you sleep better at night. :thumbsup:
 

Droopy1592

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What are you trying to deduce from knowing the stated treadwear ratings (which are all the same for the Cup 2's). If you're trying to determine what Cup 2 will last longer on the street due to a deeper tread depth or harder compound, you can look up the former and won't know the latter. Therefore, the stated number is useless.
I called Michelin and they gave a more detailed answer and answered my question. Thanks though.
 

svttim

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For those of you that are afraid to drive your 350 in rain, these were good for 150 in the pouring rain at Charlette Motor speedway.
USED_ContinentalWet_1000.jpg
 

Coyote Red

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When you own a sportscar, you need to know how to drive one. To see these cars in the hands of inexperienced drivers, running hard in the rain is scary. Two days ago I was coming home from a client's house in the semi-wet, a plant worker going home the other way on this two lane hwy tried to pass a couple of slower cars and I was coming at speed toward him 70 mph.
I started to move over into the change a flat lane and this guy did too? I had to regain my lane and split him and oncoming traffic for a butt gripping experience for 3-4 drivers as I did this maneuver at speed. Go to a performance school and learn to drive in the wet weather, "It's a Thing" for real.
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