17/18 350R vs. 19/20 350

[Tomster]

like I said earlier, I'll save myself a whole lot of typing. Get the R

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[MandoGt350R]

Get the R please. Join the elite group.

 

[lenFeb]

In my case I didn't consider R due to below reasons:
1. I can barely make out of my driveway with GT350, nevermind R with bigger front spoiler and lower clearance.
2. I read reviews for 2019 GT350 vs. 2019 GT350R which pointed that revised 2019 GT350 in par with R model. The real difference are CF wheels, which I don't need in most of my DD.
3. I had to have rear seats.
4. If consider all the above, the cost factor for R wasn't justify for me, given I purchase my GT350 for $10K less MSRP.

 

[MarkFT]

Thanks to everyone for taking the time to offer your insights and advice, it's been helpful. I'm still somewhat undecided as the Rs available in my market (Ontario, Canada) are all black, which is probably my least favorite colour. That being said, I can live with black if I can find the right R in the right condition and price. A dealer in my market has a non-R 2020 in Performance Blue, which would be my colour of choice, all else being equal. Looks like there might also be a Heritage Edition non-R available in the market!

So, to add another layer to the question, there are two Rs that I'm looking at, both black with OTT stripes:

Option 1: 2018 with 5,000 km (3,000 miles) and a "sunday driver", not tracked, all documentation, etc. A good candidate to hold value, provided mileage isn't run up too much.

Option 2: 2017 with 18,000 km (11,000 miles) and has been to the track five times by an intermediate driver. On its second set of tires with decent life left, obviously not in as good a shape given its mileage and usage. Interestingly, this car has the rear seat package that the owner had installed, so a nice bonus.

There is a $14k Canadian difference between the two vehicles (asking) at $90k for the 2018 and $76k for the 2017. The 2017 would probably save me $1,000 and a lot of hassle since it has the rear seat already. One could view this as the 2017 having already taken the brunt of the depreciation hit, plus some devaluing for having been to the track, while the 2018 would be more valuable to a potential "collector", but this assumes I keep the mileage down, which would be hard as I'd probably still put 7,000 km (4,000 miles) a year on it.

Thoughts? As a daily driver (and potentially a track day or two a year), it seems like the cheaper 2017 is a better option as I would be paying for the low mileage of the 2018 and then doubling the mileage in the first year.

 

[Johnnydarkgt350]

8000 miles difference for 14k$ , that’s quite a good value for the higher miles. Some thoughts about your buying . If one of them has had it for sale a little too long to make them consider their asking price? Or is financially motivated? Or just lost interest/ moving to a different car . The buyer is always in the driver seat on any purchase/negotiation. As an example offering 64k for the higher mile one or 80K for the lower mile one done the right way In friendly Way , might shake out which one is the best value .

 

[Frank.Herbst]

In my case I didn't consider R due to below reasons:
1. I can barely make out of my driveway with GT350, nevermind R with bigger front spoiler and lower clearance.
2. I read reviews for 2019 GT350 vs. 2019 GT350R which pointed that revised 2019 GT350 in par with R model. The real difference are CF wheels, which I don't need in most of my DD.
3. I had to have rear seats.
4. If consider all the above, the cost factor for R wasn't justify for me, given I purchase my GT350 for $10K less MSRP.

I agree with you, an older R is not necessarily a better car than a 19 or 20. Some of this is what we call water cooler value. You know hanging out and saying I have...

 

[Johnnydarkgt350]

I agree with you, an older R is not necessarily a better car than a 19 or 20. Some of this is what we call water cooler value. You know hanging out and saying I have...

Let’s consider another approach as I love both levels of GT350’s ; approximately 19000 for advanced engineered Carbon fiber wheels that do you make a difference . A 10,200 list price carbon fiber wing that does make a difference . Higher grip pp2 tires. A different rear anti-sway bar, Resonator delete , lower build numbers. Yes a 136.16 @ Laguna Seca is a little quicker than a newer your model GT 350 . ( a 2020 GT350R with its small changes hasn’t been Randy Pobst tested at Laguna Seca to my knowledge) . Major depreciation has not struck the 19 or 20 yet and could find them in the mid to upper 30s years from now . Where as a GT 350 R I doubt would ever be in that low of a value because of its exclusivity. You can also consider paying 50 to 55 for a low miles earlier GT 350 R and have it worth maybe 45 to 50k in five years versus the New or newer GT 350s paying 60 to 65 being worth 35 to 40 later as a value statement . Yes they are it’s not for everyone as others have said because of its build design . I love speaking of past histories to consider a 1957 f supercharger T-bird not being as practical on the street as when they came out compared to a rear seat 1958 TBird ( Ford sold a lot more 58 T-birds because of the rear seat) . Worth now ??$$ And more 1965/ 66 mustang GT‘s with the A code engine were sold than the high-performance K model that had to have the valves adjusted and cost more ? Worth now ?? In my experiences; buy the mustang with the lowest build numbers with the best performance and let somebody else take the first few years of depreciation and you win in the wallet category. Unless you’re driveway won’t let you in .(Of course you could put a standard GT 350 splitter on and if it meant that much to you to have the R and keep the original splitter for value retention) .

 

[GT30fan]

These are all facts, agreed...but as this guy kicks around what he wants to do.....

I am not saying this is excellent sound logic, but just the other side of the coin

1) approximately 19000 for advanced engineered Carbon fiber wheels that do you make a difference .

While I assume that's true at a dealers list, there always seem to be a set of these for sale as take offs, not sure why so many are being sold off if they are as rare as they say, and they rarely are over 10k a set. It seems odd because if someone has the money to buy an R then it seems they could afford to just store them. I'd hate to try to sell an R, minus the wheels, as they are one of the biggest justifications of the R thing now. So it seems then it's not just base owners swapping out Ford wheels for Signature rims/ Forgline etc etc. I am just perplexed why they just don't keep 2 sets, I would. There are some of these for sale on this forums right now

2) A 10,200 list price carbon fiber wing that does make a difference .

Yes, but Swing (2109 and up) with the Gurney flap has more downforce. And there is Andreson Composites affordable clone if someone wants that wing

They are also using this new "swing" on the GT500 and the upcoming Mach 1
See this video at the 2 minute, 50 second mark.


3) Higher grip pp2 tires.
Tires wear out and there is no reason someone can't buy the R tire if they want it, and vise versa, but most do not like it on the street. I read more people want a PSS or PS4 for street use. But for track, yes Cup 2 (R version) is really good... but there are others

4) A different rear anti-sway bar: true

5) Resonator delete ,yes, but many just do that to the base, it's one of the most common/ easy/ cheap mods

6) lower build numbers. True. The vast majority has weighted out what each offers for their own use, and most choose the base. But I think I heard the low R numbers was due to they could only build so many R's due to the rims, at least at first

7) Yes a 136.16 @ Laguna Seca is a little quicker than a newer your model GT 350 . ( a 2020 GT350R with its small changes hasn’t been Randy Pobst tested at Laguna Seca to my knowledge) .

I had heard the R was still on top, but barely from a number of sources, I think it is Ford's data. Most say it's the tires. But yes I heard the R is the better performer by a little

8) Major depreciation has not struck the 19 or 20 yet and could find them in the mid to upper 30s years from now .
We could , true. Could.

9) Where as a GT 350 R I doubt would ever be in that low of a value because of its exclusivity. You can also consider paying 50 to 55 for a low miles earlier GT 350 R and have it worth maybe 45 to 50k in five years versus the New or newer GT 350s paying 60 to 65 being worth 35 to 40 later as a value statement .

This is again a could. Once the GT350 is gone at the end of this year, we will see what the market values, the fact it's an R, or a car dammmmm close with a 'improved' core motor

10) Yes they are it’s not for everyone as others have said because of its build design . I love speaking of past histories to consider a 1957 f supercharger T-bird not being as practical on the street as when they came out compared to a rear seat 1958 TBird ( Ford sold a lot more 58 T-birds because of the rear seat) . Worth now ??$$ And more 1965/ 66 mustang GT‘s with the A code engine were sold than the high-performance K model that had to have the valves adjusted and cost more ? Worth now ?? In my experiences; buy the mustang with the lowest build numbers with the best performance and let somebody else take the first few years of depreciation and you win in the wallet category. Unless you’re driveway won’t let you in

Excellent point, based on sound logic. This may be a good way to look at it

12) .(Of course you could put a standard GT 350 splitter on and if it meant that much to you to have the R and keep the original splitter for value retention)

That's a great idea. The R sits a bit lower as well, but the GT350 splitter is much cheaper then the R splitter.

While I am doing another angle of some of these points, I do agree with everything here, they are based on good valid thoughts, so at this point you have to figure out yours to buy one!


.[/QUOTE]

 

[Tomster]

OP,

Whatcha gonna do?

I'm curious so that I can put these keyboard dissertations to rest.

Thanks

 

[sublime1996525]

R R R R R!! This is coming from a 350 owner lol.

 

[svttim]

The R wing makes more downforce, Andy's Video is incorrect. Wildcard Fox numbers are straight from Ford. The 19/20 bas model closed the gap by 50%. So, a 4 second difference at VIR became 2. still significant. And no, Its not the tires, the wheels or the suspension, its all of it put together. A 17/18 R is still faster then a base model. The 19/20 R's are a tick quicker due to revised ABS and the 20 has the revised steering component

 

[newmoon]

Tough call, used R verses new GT350

The R wing makes more downforce, Andy's Video is incorrect. Wildcard Fox numbers are straight from Ford. The 19/20 bas model closed the gap by 50%. So, a 4 second difference at VIR became 2. still significant. And no, Its not the tires, the wheels or the suspension, its all of it put together. A 17/18 R is still faster then a base model. The 19/20 R's are a tick quicker due to revised ABS and the 20 has the revised steering component

1-2 second difference seems to be what is typically thrown out there comparing the 19+ 350 to the R, if you are a hardcore track rat maybe you could take advantage of this, but I suspect most of us wouldn't push either car that hard chasing lap time glory. The main question I think is do you want a back seat or not?

 

[GT30fan]

True, in the he may be mistaken on the downforce, but I noticed most quote the downforce specs measured at a given speed the car is traveling. Could one have more force then another, pending at what speed? 2 parked cars are both at zero downforce (LOL). But I don't know, it takes time to research it all but odds are as you say, he is mistaken. But the other stuff he was talking about I know by heart he was correct on

If 2 MPH difference is correct, and I am too busy to dig into it, some will say that will be significant trying to win races. no doubt. But most of these times are clocked with EXTREMLY good drivers in EXTREMLY fast cars and they might run at close to 3 minutes/typical if you mean VIR in Virginia. The best of the best "world champs" might be in the 2 minute 30 second.

He will need to decide that if he gets his skill up to be decent, if that if 2 seconds trade off will off set his daily needs, if he does any street driving. There is no doubt ALL the GT350's are made to be great on the track, but if he is willing to make those trade-offs, including costs, to get the 1% difference, (I didn't use a calculator, maybe it's 1.5%) he needs the R.

I am curious how a base 2019 up GT350 with better then the "street-able Cup 2 lite" tires would do. I am not that much of a track person to be the guy. I like the "cup 2" lite tires since I hear they last longer, and are sticky and grab rocks, etc as well...but not as bad

 

[svttim]

True, in the he may be mistaken on the downforce, but I noticed most quote the downforce specs measured at a given speed the car is traveling. Could one have more force then another, pending at what speed? 2 parked cars are both at zero downforce (LOL). But I don't know, it takes time to research it all but odds are as you say, he is mistaken. But the other stuff he was talking about I know by heart he was correct on

If 2 MPH difference is correct, and I am too busy to dig into it, some will say that will be significant trying to win races. no doubt. But most of these times are clocked with EXTREMLY good drivers in EXTREMLY fast cars and they might run at close to 3 minutes/typical if you mean VIR in Virginia. The best of the best "world champs" might be in the 2 minute 30 second.

He will need to decide that if he gets his skill up to be decent, if that if 2 seconds trade off will off set his daily needs, if he does any street driving. There is no doubt ALL the GT350's are made to be great on the track, so if he is willing to make those trade-offs, including costs, he needs the R.

I am curious how a base 2019 up GT350 with better then the "street-able Cup 2 lite" tires would do. I am not that much of a track person to be the guy. I like the "cup 2" lite tires since I hear they last longer, and are sticky and grab rocks, etc as well...but not as bad

Its all just data. In the end, He has to take that Data and make a decision

 

[GT30fan]

Or, he could do this (lol)... I think there is no doubt this one will be RARE.

Or go up even higher with the GT4 version!

https://www.motortrend.com/cars/ford/mustang/2017/2017-ford-mustang-fp350s-race-car-review/

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