shogun32

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People should expect and be prepared to pay a reasonable price for a Mustang GT and not expect to be getting 460 HP of RWD, V8 power and relatively modern creature comforts, for anywhere below $30k.
Edited - I had old numbers. Conclusions changed.

the entrypoint for GT is 37K (2021). The regulatory burden since 2019 is not the same as from 20 years ago. The Ecoboost entrypoint is 29K.

If people bought just 100A/300A the Mustang is still reasonably affordable - 3100hrs at $12/hr, 2500hrs at $15. In 1996 a 'base' GT was $17,600. I was making $7.5/hr at McDonalds after school for a time value of 2300hrs.

17600 in 2021 dollars is 30300 so yes the price has increased faster than "official" gov't inflation. 7K (22%) to account for labor, environment, legal burdens after 25 years is definitely high.

But more so it's the prices of the upgrades that is out of control.

 
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LSchicago

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Edited - I had old numbers. Conclusions changed.

the entrypoint for GT is 37K (2021). The regulatory burden since 2019 is not the same as from 20 years ago. The Ecoboost entrypoint is 29K.

If people bought just 100A/300A the Mustang is still reasonably affordable - 3100hrs at $12/hr, 2500hrs at $15. In 1996 a 'base' GT was $17,600. I was making $7.5/hr at McDonalds after school for a time value of 2300hrs.

17600 in 2021 dollars is 30300 so yes the price has increased faster than "official" gov't inflation. 7K (22%) to account for labor, environment, legal burdens after 25 years is definitely high.

But more so it's the prices of the upgrades that is out of control.
They are much better, safer, better equipped, and far better performance than the 96 though. Put both a new 96 GT and a new 21 GT side by side and I would pay that extra $7,000 every time. Compare the todays base ecoboost to the 96 GT, and the EB is better in every way except sound, and for LESS money than the 96 GT comparatively. That's progress.
 
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Hanavarian

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Until companies make back all the money they loss from last year and the so-called shortage ends, they will continue to add mark ups. Ford is the worse for incentives right now.
Maybe ...or people will behave like I have, replacing 95% of my long term disposable income vendor base because of any one, or combination of, crap service, unjustifiably higher prices, overt entitlement, poor quality.

Many people are doing the same.....

It's like E Europe 1990s LOL...answer to low business was to increase prices, get even ruder, and provide worse service.

Obviously the players who gave fair pricing and great service prospered. When the govt stop bailing out losers consumers will win.

Mustang is great value even at MSRP so I dont care. I demanded a discount on order and got $3,500 off EB HPP vert, plus whatever incentives avail on delivery next month, documented in a valid sales contract with $1 K deposit to seal it.

All the cars are so boring in N. America....
 

truckinguy92

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Problem is all the cars they have that I might be interested in have the damnable A10 trans.
What’s so “damnable” about an A10? I thought the Chinese 6 speed MT82’s are junk? Just curious?
 

shogun32

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What’s so “damnable” about an A10? I thought the Chinese 6 speed MT82’s are junk? Just curious?
the TUNING on the A10 in sport/+ mode is an assault on the senses and mind-bending bad. My F150 has the A10 but they did the tuning RIGHT.
 

truckinguy92

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the TUNING on the A10 in sport/+ mode is an assault on the senses and mind-bending bad. My F150 has the A10 but they did the tuning RIGHT.
I would have to agree to a point. I’ve never driven an A10 F150 before but had a 2016 F150 with a 6 speed auto and sport mode was only for using the up/down buttons on the side of the shifter. Although I think comparing an A10 in a F150 vs a Mustang GT is like comparing the proverbial “apples vs oranges”. Even if you compare it to the 5.0 option on an F150, the engines are the same but definitely tuned way differently.
 

likeaboss

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My biggest complaint with the S550 is that outside of the digital dash in 2018 they have done next to nothing to improve the interior. The layout of the interior is fine but the material quality needs an upgrade and it only gets worse when you're paying Shelby money.

Ford will say the reason they stopped selling cars is because everyone was buying SUVs and trucks which is partially true. The real reason is people weren't buying Ford cars because they didn't put much effort into them. Unfortunately the ICE Mustang seems to be getting the minimal effort treatment now that Ford is all in on EVs. I don't have much faith the S650 is going to deliver what's needed to be a sales success. :frown:
 

ICU812

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Edited - I had old numbers. Conclusions changed.

the entrypoint for GT is 37K (2021). The regulatory burden since 2019 is not the same as from 20 years ago. The Ecoboost entrypoint is 29K.

If people bought just 100A/300A the Mustang is still reasonably affordable - 3100hrs at $12/hr, 2500hrs at $15. In 1996 a 'base' GT was $17,600. I was making $7.5/hr at McDonalds after school for a time value of 2300hrs.

17600 in 2021 dollars is 30300 so yes the price has increased faster than "official" gov't inflation. 7K (22%) to account for
I don' think you GET IT!
No one wants to buy a Stripper car with a 4" screen for 37k and up. Not when their are other options out there .
A tracked mostly car sure, but then I'd not want a bunch of stuff I'm still stuck with out of it also.
This isn't the 60-early 2000's that if you bought a car with a base am or am/fm radio, it was a few hours and you could have a pioneer super tuner III with cassette in the dash.
Buyers today have no interest in buying a car then having to spend more to get the now very standard infotainment that a toyota echo comes with.
Next problem is finding one of those 37k unicorns on a lot.
IIRC I think I found 1 base no options gt in the year I looked at a new toy. Even the e/b were mostly hovering in the 38-43k on the lots. or, units that the sales manager for the sales floor lay out stock ordered with crap.
I found a red metallic (extra cost) e/b base coupe. Was the first s550 I looked at.
I was fine with the 499. for the red metallic, but then on a BASE EB mind you. Active exhaust 999.99 , optional wheel package 1200.00, over the roof race stripe 999.00
So 3200.00 is pure garbage added to the bottom line, but it had that 4" screen infotainment cloth seat base interior.
Car looked good, but even the salesman said everyone was lets look at something else after driving it. because well, it was lipstick on pig in 2020.
What ford basicly did was, said, to the youth buyer without a dad bankrolling the purchase .
We got you fam.
We know your whole life is wrapped around that 4"x8" phone in your pocket, what we got you, is a car that your phone's interface and all is better than what we gave you in the car, All for you. We stocked up on all the 2004 blackberry screens we could just for you.
 

AnalogDan

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I hope Ford has something interesting up their sleeve for the next Mustang.

Releasing the first PHEV pony/muscle car would be a fun trick. A rev-happy V8 paired with a battery for low end torque seems like a match made in heaven.
 

shogun32

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I don' think you GET IT!
No one wants to buy a Stripper car with a 4" screen for 37k and up.
I did. and I'm trying to line up a 100A (damn shame they took the paddle shifters away) for 25K (3000 below MSRP).

If you have a smartphone , the half-way tolerable 8" touch screen is completely superfluous. Sure I can't see my 4.5" smart-phone screen from the driver's seat all that well (I could see it better if I moved my Pro-something cell phone mount to the left of my PP1 gauges) but voice prompts suffice to NAV and for everything else, there is a pull-over lane. Google maps is vastly more useful than Ford's attempt.

The 4" system has perfectly acceptable music/audio and it's voice recognition is noticeably better than the 8" version. And if you want to upgrade the doorcard speakers or the rears, it's quite cheap to do so. My F150 has the 9-speaker system and I slapped a drum skin damper pad on top of the dash to muffle the center channel.

My point was simply that the "every man" Mustang is strictly limited to the lowest-possible trim level. Deviating at all means you're paying MAJOR money for negligible content. Teenagers can reasonably afford a 100A/300A if not new than not all that old. Anything else takes outside funding.
 

ICU812

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I did. and I'm trying to line up a 100A (damn shame they took the paddle shifters away) for 25K (3000 below MSRP).

If you have a smartphone , the half-way tolerable 8" touch screen is completely superfluous. Sure I can't see my 4.5" smart-phone screen from the driver's seat all that well (I could see it better if I moved my Pro-something cell phone mount to the left of my PP1 gauges) but voice prompts suffice to NAV and for everything else, there is a pull-over lane. Google maps is vastly more useful than Ford's attempt.

The 4" system has perfectly acceptable music/audio and it's voice recognition is noticeably better than the 8" version. And if you want to upgrade the doorcard speakers or the rears, it's quite cheap to do so. My F150 has the 9-speaker system and I slapped a drum skin damper pad on top of the dash to muffle the center channel.

My point was simply that the "every man" Mustang is strictly limited to the lowest-possible trim level. Deviating at all means you're paying MAJOR money for negligible content. Teenagers can reasonably afford a 100A/300A if not new than not all that old. Anything else takes outside funding.
BUT YOU HAVE TO LOOK AND TOUCH your cell phone while driving.
This is an issue in many places that have banned this.
It is costly when caught also.
 

dethmaShine

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Overpricing products already sold by high end retailers like rare Ferraris costing $1 million vs $400,000, doesn't justify charging $120k for a new Raptor or GT500, that retails thousands of 5 figures less. Ditto for Rebel TRX and many other brands, that do not wear a premium badge.
I might disagree with you here. 400k -> 1M is an increase of 250% however an 80K -> 120K is an increase of 50%. By definition, the first one is more ridiculous than the second irrelevant of the dynamics of how rare the entity is. The rarity is built into the $400K price but a 5x % increase is absolutely nuts.

I might agree on principal that nothing should have ADMs, maybe standard 10% on demand or something (ofcourse not regulated), but I don't think a 120K GT500 is ridiculous in this market for a dealership to sell it for.

Ford can fix all of this by removing dealers from the equation and set up shops all over the country. But they won't.
 

TrackMustang

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BUT YOU HAVE TO LOOK AND TOUCH your cell phone while driving.
This is an issue in many places that have banned this.
It is costly when caught also.
If the size of the screen in your mustang is that big of an issue you bought the wrong car bud. I could give two shits less about the screen in the dash… get rid of it completely for all I care. If the screen is what you’re after the Jetta prolly has a big one
 

LSchicago

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If the size of the screen in your mustang is that big of an issue you bought the wrong car bud. I could give two shits less about the screen in the dash… get rid of it completely for all I care. If the screen is what you’re after the Jetta prolly has a big one
I wanted the larger screen & drive modes with cloth so I made sure the dealer got me a 301A. No need to settle for what you don't want.
 

TrackMustang

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I wanted the larger screen & drive modes with cloth so I made sure the dealer got me a 301A. No need to settle for what you don't want.
They all have drive modes, my seats will shortly be Sparco and I don’t care about the screen. That being said, to each their own. My point was more that he was talking about the screen like it was the most important thing in the world and I don’t think screens are significant in a sports car. Unless of course it’s you’re daily driver, but I don’t personally get that either… again, to each their own.
 

 
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