“Next Gen” Mustang Will be Electric (EV) Only Claims Autoline

[I <3 Boost]

Personally, 99% of the driving experience stems from the sounds and smells associated with driving a performance car. I can’t say that I’ll never own an EV, but I will say that I will never own an electric-based sports car. I own both automatic and manual sports cars. Yes, automatics are faster but they do not offer even a fraction of the enjoyment of a manual car for me.

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[zackmd1]

Personally, 99% of the driving experience stems from the sounds and smells associated with driving a performance car. I can’t say that I’ll never own an EV, but I will say that I will never own an electric-based sports car. I own both automatic and manual sports cars. Yes, automatics are faster but they do not offer even a fraction of the enjoyment of a manual car for me.

Well smells really are not a thing with modern performance cars (unless you are considering catless exhaust)

The question I pose to everyone.... Have you ever actually driven an EV (Tesla or Mach E equivalent, not compliance crap like a Prius or leaf)? You might be singing a different tune if you experience the instant acceleration and 0-60 times under 2-3sec in addition to the extremely low center of gravity.... Then consider the fact that these cars were not designed as sports cars and imagine what a purpose built EV sports car can do.... (yes manuals could be included in that purpose built EV)

 

[I <3 Boost]

Well smells really are not a thing with modern performance cars (unless you are considering catless exhaust)

The question I pose to everyone.... Have you ever actually driven an EV (Tesla or Mach E equivalent, not compliance crap like a Prius or leaf)? You might be singing a different tune if you experience the instant acceleration and 0-60 times under 2-3sec in addition to the extremely low center of gravity.... Then consider the fact that these cars were not designed as sports cars and imagine what a purpose built EV sports car can do.... (yes manuals could be included in that purpose built EV)

All of my performance vehicles are cat-less. I don’t purchase performance vehicles to leave them stock - hence the sounds and smells comment. I have driven a Tesla Model S but it wasn’t the highest performance variant. A Tesla or some comparable EV would be ok for a daily driver but as a car guy, will never be what I want or appreciate in a vehicle. I know that the future will have more and more electric vehicles but I personally will wait until I am forced into buying one. I understand that EVs can be as fast if not faster. Being fast is definitely important to me but is only a small percentage of the driving experience.

*I did not know that they were offering any EVs with a manual transmission*

 

[Gregs24]

Porsche Taycan 4S real world review. Plus trying to charge it away from home.. - YouTube

(Norm - this is just a gentle drive by an old man that I think you will find interesting)

Here you go - not all EV's are shopping trolleys although clearly volume car makers will concentrate on these first. Porsche make a lot of cars so not a real specialist but at the same time they have a set of values that mean they don't produce dogs. Yes it is different to an ICE car, yes it is quieter, but it can also be fun, fast and engaging.

This is just the first of many 'sports' EV's coming out in Europe, coupe / convertible etc. Yes the Porsche is expensive - but aren't all Porsches expensive.

A friend of mine with a lot of VERY nice cars (from a 1928 Bentley to modern day Ferrari's and Astons) has just ordered one of these as his daily driver, he was that impressed. Others will prefer SUV practicality but that is why we have different shaped cars.

I'm sure some will still say it is no good - but if this is as good as it gets the world will not be too bad a place in EV life.

Finally on the recharging subject. Many on here are trying to make an EV fit the ICE refuelling model, but the reality is that it will be slightly different. The convenience of home charging, charging when shopping or at your destination. This is more flexible than always going to a petrol station - it is different to what you are used to but only because the ICE way has been ingrained into you. If EV's had come first many would be moaning about having to drive 10 miles to get petrol !

 

[Vlad Soare]

Here you go - not all EV's are shopping trolleys

Those that aren't are preposterously expensive. A Taycan costs more than two Mustangs, and can get even as high as three Mustangs if you tick a few option boxes.
If the Mustang were forbidden in Europe, do you think people who want a Mustang would buy a Taycan instead? Not a chance. That's a completely different market.

Besides, this isn't just about Mustangs. In the ICE world there are a lot of exciting options for all budgets. Those options do not exist in the EV world. In the EV world it's either a dreary shopping cart or an immensely expensive sports car. Nothing in between. A 911 owner might consider a Taycan instead, but what can a Fiesta ST owner replace it with? An i3? A Zoe? What can you replace an MX5 with?

 

[Gregs24]

Those that aren't are preposterously expensive. A Taycan costs more than two Mustangs, and can get even as high as three Mustangs if you tick a few option boxes.
If the Mustang were forbidden in Europe, do you think people who want a Mustang would buy a Taycan instead? Not a chance. That's a completely different market.

Besides, this isn't just about Mustangs. In the ICE world there are a lot of exciting options for all budgets. Those options do not exist in the EV world. In the EV world it's either a dreary shopping cart or an immensely expensive sports car. Nothing in between. A 911 owner might consider a Taycan instead, but what can a Fiesta ST owner replace it with? An i3? A Zoe? What can you replace an MX5 with?

That may be the case for you in Romania but plenty of options coming available now.

Of course the Taycan is expensive - ALL Porsches are expensive. The point was EV's can be rewarding to drive.

How many ICE alternatives are there to the Mustang ? When I bought mine there weren't too many options ???

A hybrid Mustang seems pretty likely for the next generation, with an EV one for the following generation (coupe / convertible not the Mach E)

Regarding ST Fiesta - how about a Mini Electric. OK if you don't like the ICE Mini you are unlikely to like the EV one but they are out there.

'I really can't wait for the new crop of electric hot hatches' | Auto Express

Renault 5 set to relaunch as an EV – Alpine eyeing hot hatch variant | evo

Most car makers are up against it with EV's at the moment. They are in a development race with the Chinese and South Korea and want to get big selling models to the market as fast as they can, more niche products will follow.

 

[Vlad Soare]

The point was EV's can be rewarding to drive.

Of course. If you pay 120K euros for a car, it's bound to be exciting at least to some degree, isn't it? I cannot think of any car that isn't rewarding in some way or another in that price range.
But that's not the point.
You cannot outlaw hamburgers and then say "oh, but caviar is extremely tasty, I don't see why you're complaining".

An electric Mini is not exactly a replacement for a Fiesta ST or an MX-5. That's just a shopping cart. We were talking about exciting EVs, not shopping carts.
A Mini Cooper S is exciting. A Mini John Cooper Works is even more exciting. The electric one is a washing machine on wheels. It has nothing in common with them apart from its name.

 

[Gregs24]

Of course. If you pay 120K euros for a car, it's bound to be exciting at least to some degree, isn't it? I cannot think of any car that isn't rewarding in some way or another in that price range.
But that's not the point.
You cannot outlaw hamburgers and then say "oh, but caviar is extremely tasty, I don't see why you're complaining".

An electric Mini is not exactly a replacement for a Fiesta ST or an MX-5. That's just a shopping cart. We were talking about exciting EVs, not shopping carts.
A Mini Cooper S is exciting. A Mini John Cooper Works is even more exciting. The electric one is a washing machine on wheels. It has nothing in common with them apart from its name.

The Mini Electric JCW is coming in a few months and is the same car but for motive power - If it looks like a Mini JCW, handles like a Mini JCW and goes like a Mini JCW then it is a Mini JCW, just powered by electricity. Ford need to catch up with an EV Fiesta ST, I'm sure it is coming.

The Golf GT derivatives can now be had with diesel, petrol, petrol hybrid or full EV. All are extremely similar to drive, similar performance and handling, just the power source varies. It's a bit like the old argument that a diesel cannot be a hot hatch, well Skoda did a pretty good job at selling a lot of diesel vRS versions of their cars, so drivers voted with their wallets.

New MINI JCW electric hot hatch due in 2021 | Auto Express

 

[zackmd1]

The Mini Electric JCW is coming in a few months and is the same car but for motive power - If it looks like a Mini JCW, handles like a Mini JCW and goes like a Mini JCW then it is a Mini JCW, just powered by electricity. Ford need to catch up with an EV Fiesta ST, I'm sure it is coming.

I commend you for fighting the good fight but you are simply not going to convince some people no matter how many times you try to explain it. These are the people that will be dragged along kicking and screaming while the rest of the world moves forward.

 

[Mikthehun1]

The Mini Electric JCW is coming in a few months and is the same car but for motive power - If it looks like a Mini JCW, handles like a Mini JCW and goes like a Mini JCW then it is a Mini JCW, just powered by electricity. Ford need to catch up with an EV Fiesta ST, I'm sure it is coming.

The Golf GT derivatives can now be had with diesel, petrol, petrol hybrid or full EV. All are extremely similar to drive, similar performance and handling, just the power source varies. It's a bit like the old argument that a diesel cannot be a hot hatch, well Skoda did a pretty good job at selling a lot of diesel vRS versions of their cars, so drivers voted with their wallets.

New MINI JCW electric hot hatch due in 2021 | Auto Express

How much more does the EV weigh? The Mini formula includes light & nimble as one of the cornerstones. Take that away and you get...the Countryman.

 

[Gregs24]

I commend you for fighting the good fight but you are simply not going to convince some people no matter how many times you try to explain it. These are the people that will be dragged along kicking and screaming while the rest of the world moves forward.

This has always been the case.

 

[Vlad Soare]

you are simply not going to convince some people no matter how many times you try to explain it.

Like I said, and like many others have said, convincing us would be easier if you weren't trying to bully us into it. A child will eventually eat his/her vegetables if you take away every other kind of food, but convincing them that they taste good will be impossible after that.

I get it - you love your Model 3. Good for you. But can't you just enjoy it without trying to force everybody else to like it?

 

[Gregs24]

How much more does the EV weigh? The Mini formula includes light & nimble as one of the cornerstones. Take that away and you get...the Countryman.

It isn't quite as simple as that. EV's carry more weight, but they carry it very low down. Most have batteries at floor level (some even under the floor) and so the centre of gravity is extraordinarily low. An ICE engine is a big lump suspended much higher in the car. The front end on a Mustang is hugely compromised by that big lump of V8 and it will always be playing catch up compared to the front end on the Taycan for example that doesn't have that weight high up at the front.

The advantage to the EV is that the roll moment of the car is significantly lower, meaning much less stiff anti roll components in the suspension and a concurrent benefit to ride and handling. It is actually quite spooky how little roll there is, even in SUV type EV cars.

Performance wise the huge instant torque overcomes the extra weight so EV's are often faster than equivalent powered ICE cars.

They are different for sure and the techniques to setting up an EV based chassis are different to those of an ICE based chassis, but the crucial word is different not better or worse.

 

[Gregs24]

Like I said, and like many others have said, convincing us would be easier if you weren't trying to bully us into it. A child will eventually eat his/her vegetables if you take away every other kind of food, but convincing them that they taste good will be impossible after that.

I get it - you love your Model 3. Good for you. But can't you just enjoy it without trying to force everybody else to like it?

I don't have a model 3 ???? My brother in law does.

I'm not bullying anybody - just trying to explain that EV doesn't automatically mean bad as some are suggesting. In fact EV has some distinct advantages over ICE that if you close your mind to it you will miss.

 

[Vlad Soare]

Performance wise the huge instant torque overcomes the extra weight so EV's are often faster than equivalent powered ICE cars.

Off the line.
But try to accelerate hard at 50 mph in a cheap EV (not some 120K+ dollar supercar), and your experience will be different.

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